Is steel guitar becoming bad for business?

Vic Lawson · From: White House, Tennessee, USA

I was at the Stage on Broadway last night. I was talking to someone in the band when they took a break and they said that the manager at Legend's Corner had conducted a "survey" and the result of his survey was "business was down during shifts where there was a steel guitar in the band". All this is taking place in Nashville! I couldn't believe it! Any input?

Kevin Hatton · From: Buffalo, N.Y.

Yeah. Hire barmaids with more cleavage. Watch business pickup dramaticly. Tell him to try THAT survey.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

From what you describe, this sounds more like some type of correlation of business volume to which band was playing than a "survey". Surveys generally involve getting information from people through a questionaire or some other method.

If it's a pure correlation, it should be viewed very skeptically, IMO. How on earth would anybody be able to tell that steel guitar was the causative factor in reduced business without knowing a lot more information. Maybe the business volume difference is from some other cause, or just a random fluke of other unrelated circumstances. And how is business volume measured? Number of people? Dollar sales volume? All this matters - if a significant portion of the income is from cover charges, then number of people matter, but some types of crowds tend to spend more money on food or booze. To really know what's going on, I think one must understand what's affecting all of these things.

If it was an actual survey, there are a ton of ways to mess it up and invalidate the results.

First, the survey may be flawed - the exact questions asked are very important. Poor question design can bias the results one way or another. More subtle variations of "Hey, don't you hate obnoxious, whiney steel guitar?" or "Would you like some cool rockin' music instead of this lame-a$$ old country stuff" would sure skew the results. Wink

Second, the sampling of customers who answer a survey may be flawed. For example, perhaps the number of survey respondents are biased towards patrons who don't like what's going on. Or perhaps the sample percentage is way too small to be statistically significant.

Third, even if everything else is right, there may be other issues that make the control variable look like the cause, when in fact it's something else they are reacting to.

Finally - you can make a survey or other type of statistical study give you any answer you want it to, if you know what I mean.

Hey, on Kevin's point - if the audience is mostly guys, maybe the non-steel more rock-oriented bands had waitresses with more cleavage. Laughing

Vic Lawson · From: White House, Tennessee, USA

Dave, I appreciate the input, but I'm using "survey" in a sarcastic way. I work on Broadway a lot and I am sure there was no scientific basis for his deduction, more of just an ignorant opinion.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

Yup, I got that. I'm just trying to give some "scientific" ammunition. Buried underneath all that verbiage was the tacit premise that it was probably an ignorant opinion disguised as a "study" of some sort. I say fight fire with fire. Smile

Henry Nagle · From: Santa Rosa, California

That's ridiculous. Are you sure it wasn't a put on?

Mike Sweeney · From: Nashville,TN,USA

Well Vic,

They've got to blame something and I guess we're it. I know that James Gee got bumped from a sunday afternoon next month. I guess it's my fault since I play with him. You and I both know which direction that manager wants to go. Maybe we just need to take out an ad in some of the trade and tourist mags.
Jay Andrews and myself are thinking of putting a banner across Broadway saying "NO STEEL GUITARS ALLOWED". You wanna hold the ladder?...LOL!!!!!!!
Maybe it will turn around.
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Alvin Blaine · From: Picture Rocks, Arizona, USA

Tommy R. Butler · From: Nashville, Tennessee

I like the t-shirt handing Legends store.
"I STEEL FOR A LIVING"

Les Anderson · From: The Great White North

Around this neck of the woods we are told that it is just plain economics.

"It's nice to hear the steel in the background but we can get along just fine without it." I am most often told.

Don Barnhardt · From: North Carolina, USA

If you boys want to make money playing music, you need to play what pays. I paint houses for money and play steel for my personal enjoyment. I could care less what club managers or the fickle public thinks. Think back, pedal steel players put some excellent steelers including Jerry Byrd in the same situation you guys are in now.

Gaylon Mathews · From: Jasper, Georgia

Git a Rope !!
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Jim Walker · From: Headland, AL

Buck Reid · From: Nashville,TN

My experience is that Lower broadway is good for your chops but has nothing to do with the "music business"!

Bo Borland · From: South Jersey -

Wait until the record labels start PAYING the club owners for the slots so their new acts can get heard.
They do it all the time with "reporting" radio stations. Pay to play & report or pay the acts local appearance fees, let the radio station host it, and report the acts new tune in heavy rotation to radio & records.. it is worth major money to have your tune reported.
It is still payola..
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Billy Carr · From: Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)

I've played clubs since before I was legal age. Most club owners/managers could care less what instruments are on stage. There looking at the dollar signs each night. Different areas draw different customers. Pretty waitresses with a good dance band and a safe environment and regular customers make money, not if a PSG was on stage or not. If the place is not PSG friendly, then as a player, I'd go somewhere that is. By this I mean, if a band not playing music that's open for a lot of PSG, then I'd go somewhere else. I played around that environment a long time and picked up a lot of fast R&R licks that were transposed over to PSG but I was a lot younger then. I doubt if I'd do it again though.

Ron Randall · From: Dallas, Texas, USA

My 2c.

"Whatever happens in Nashville stays in Nashville."
That sounds like a good motto to me. Razz

I know of so many venues around Texas that expect a steel guitar. The owners of these establishments know their customers, and what they want.

The truth in Texas...Steel guitar is good for business.

Vic Lawson · From: White House, Tennessee, USA

Thanks for the input. Mike maybe I will help hold the ladder! Buck, while that is true, my point is it's all just so ridiculous to think that an instrument whether steel or not could have an affect on business.

Theresa Galbraith · From: Goodlettsville,Tn. USA

Vic,
How did Terry Crisp & band sound? Gregg & I were there a few months back and they just knocked us out! Smile

Great band & great crowd that night! Smile

Charles Curtis · Posted 29 May 2007 5:04 am

Has anyone done a survey of those that don't care to listen, or watch a band that doesn't have a psg? Just curious.

Buddie Hrabal · From: Arlington,Texas USA

My question would be "Do they put a sign out front stating STEEL GUITAR TONITE" Most of the time the problem really belongs to the club and the club management. It is unfortunate that the Steel Guitar has to take the blame. Sounds to me like the results of an dictated survey.

Jerry Hayes · From: Virginia Beach, Va.

I think that a steel guitar in the band is always good for business. I've always considered myself a lead guitarist who doubled on steel and I always thought I played guitar much better than I do steel, however, very seldom does anyone come up to me and rave about my playing when doing a guitar gig but hook up the steel at a gig and you'll find folks standing beside the bandstand watching your every move. Anyone who's ever played in a band has experienced that. There's something about a steel that people really like so if it were up to me I'd hire a steelman for every gig. What really irks me is I see so many bands which have a keyboard player and a fiddle player but no steel. What's up with that? I'd drop the dang keyboard player and get a good steeler before I'd go that route......JH in Va.
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Roger Light · From: Sheldon, IL

I think most of the folks where we play up here don't know if I'm playing a steel, piano, or an ironing board, but they know the whole picture "sounds good"! We all know the steel is part of that sound, but 99% of they "paying crowd" doesn't really care as long as we keep a good steady beat for them to dance and "not play too loud"!
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b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Eric West · From: Portland, Oregon, USA, R.I.P.

Well I liked Buck Reid's comments.

I did a tour of the old Sho~Bud Factory and a couple other places. Dead as a door nail during the week I was there.

Maybe the bands with steel players tend to work when there's no money, just to keep their chops up, and because there are no crowds you have a coincidence.

No good deed goes... as they say.

I'm not sure a sign on the bandstand bigger than, or in place of, the Band Logo stating that The Band Makes No Money is an advertisement of positive self image, and it's out there and more readable than the band banner.

I tend to kick the tip jar in the corner as I think they're kind of embarrassing.

How about one that says "I lost 50 lbs playing music. Ask me how."

Smile

EJL

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