U14 String Gauges for string #14

Eugene Cole · From: near Washington Grove, MD, USA

I used to run an .080 for the low E-string when I had Grover tuners. I also discovered that a .090 would not fit through the hole in the Grover tuner. With a keyless tuner system I currently use a .100 for the low-E and a .080 for the low-B. These gauges seem to work well for me.

Has anyone tried modifying a Grover tuner to accept a larger string gauge? If so how large was the hole modified-to and what gauge string did it accomodate?

For reference I have posted my U14 copedents and a couple of Anders Brundell's copedents here:
--> http://www.pixenbar.com/Copedents/

I would like to see and/or learn what gauges other players choose for strings 14 & 13 and which brands of string you prefer to use for these strings. Why do you prefer that brand? Please state what type of tuners you are using.
_________________
Regards
-- Eugene <sup>at</sup> FJ45.com

PixEnBar.com
Cole-Luthierie.com
FJ45.com

Sierra U14 8+5 my copedent, 1972 MSA D10 8+4, and nothing in the Bank. 8^)

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

I played a Sierra SCM14SE a few years back. I always used the suggested string gauges listed on the copedent sheet. Worked just fine for me. [.080 on the 14th and .068 or .70 on 13 best I recall.]

At that time I was buying all my strings from Bruce Zumsteg and I believe they were stainless composition. They performed great for me.

My axe was a gearless model, so can't offer any suggestions re: the Grover machines.

Eugene Cole · From: near Washington Grove, MD, USA

A related problem I would like to open up for discussion is whether other players find that string 14 goes dead pretty fast?

This is the reason I am curious to know what brand of string you prefer and why you prefer that brand of string.

-E

Anders Brundell · From: Falun, Sweden

Hello, Eugene!

I've given up hope for string 14 so I actually play a 13 stringer. The scale is simply too short, so the .105 in position 14 sounds muddy even though it's a NewTone string (often labled Burns, London) that are by far the best sounding strings I've ever heard. It has a crystal clear Fender twang with any pick up.
I guess that a low E on a short scale (relative to electric bass guitar) would require a much heavier string than a .105, but I've never found any. But I haven't researched that much either, so there might very well be some manufacturer somewhere. I always used Ernie Ball standard strings before a friend hinted me about New Tone.
I play a keyless Sierra; copedant at
http://groups.msn.com/countryfolketidalarna/dcmcsfotoalbum.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=151
and I have to "peel" off some wire before I can get the heaviest string ends into the hole in the lever.

ed packard · From: Show Low AZ

Eugene; I use anything that I can get short of a Hawser rope...but then I have scale lengths up to 30" with low note + C, another with 25" scale and low note = Bb, and one 25" scale with Bill Stafford's setup using an E for the low string. These are all 14 stringers.

The low string gauge is always a compromise re what can be obtained. 0.120 would be nice on the Bb and C...hard to find.

Mostly I use GHS BOOMERS, or SIT for the "normal" strings...and whatever I can find for the low ones. Contact Bill Stafford re these FAT strings...he both uses and sells them.

The FAT string issue is one reason that I am looking at string clamping methods. If the ball & wrap can be eliminated, the string gauge range is opened up considerably, as piano strings can be used, and they come in many more gauges.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

I have the same issue with my Sierra U-14 with Grovers. I think I got an 0.085 on string 14, which is the max it would take - my guess is that each one is a hair different. I find even that gauge is a bit too slack to be useful as a low E. It just sort of goes "boing". I think 0.100 would be a lot better. My 6-string Fender Jaguar Bass VI has a 0.095 on the low E with a 28.5" scale, and it sounds great. I think with a 24-25" scale, 0.100 or 0.105 would be OK, but so far haven't been able to get one on there.

I have drilled out tuners to accomodate larger strings (an old Dano Silvertone 2-pickup guitar, for example, which I set up as a baritone guitar), but haven't done it to this steel yet. Of course, one needs to be very careful, but I think it should be able to be done. I used a Dremel with a real small (I think 1/16" or 3/32") aluminum oxide grinding bit to ream and then polished it with a comparable polishing bit - polishing is, of course, critical to avoid a sharp edge which can break the string. I just did it by feel - ream a little bit, check for fit, then do a bit more, until the string fits in there, then polish it and smooth the edges. When I do this on the steel, I'll probably get a replacement tuner to mod, keeping the original one stock. I generally like the GHS stainless strings for that steel.

I don't find that bass strings go dead quickly at all. I think my problem is that the slackness of the string causes it to feel dead right away.

One other thing - I have found, on bass and baritone guitars, that the stiffness on flatwound strings is a bit higher. I have thought of putting a fat flatwound on string 14 just to see if that helps.

Of course, even with all this, I doubt I'm gonna find a bass player who appreciates me down in his turf. Wink

Anders Brundell · From: Falun, Sweden

I see that Newtone http://www.newtonestrings.com/ has a bunch of really fat strings (.120 .125 .130 .135 and .140)
I've never tried any of them, but now I'm getting curious. If not a .140 can be tense enough for a low E, then a tow wire is probably the final solution.

Eugene Cole · From: near Washington Grove, MD, USA

I know that this is stating the obvious... but... at the moment I am slapping my forehead and exclaiming DUH because I never tried this!

If one removed the winding from around the core-wire on the portion of the string which passes through hole in the tuner one could fit a larger string to an OEM sized hole in a tuner. This same method should work with most keyless tuner systems.

Have any of you already tried this?

The problem is that you lose the friction/clamping which keeps the winding tight. But it would probably still offer an improvement for the players that had maxed out with a .080 to a .085 because they were using sealed-tuners like Schaellers or Grovers.

I could use a bench grinder to remove the winding at a very specific point on the string.

I guess I need to order some strings and do some experimenting.

-E

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