The Difference

Walter Stettner · From: Vienna, Austria

Been watching some videos on YouTube: Hal Rugg & Buddy Spicher (from the Wilburn Shows), Chet Atkins, Roy Clark, some of the great ISCG videos Bill Ferguson has put on, Jim & Jesse...and then I clicked on the link of a Justin Timberlake video (just beause the link was on the same site).

The difference:

Here you have stellar musicianship, absolute control and mastery of the instrument, melodies and, very important, the musicians are showing that they obviously had a good time while playing. The same is true for most of those old vids, no matter if you talk about Country, Jazz, Rock or other styles.

On the other side, you have a staged video performance, electronic sounds, no melody (at least nothing that I can follow), electronic hip-hop beats, an overall performance that seems very...strange...to me.

No wonder that many of us can't deal with today's "music"!

Kind Regards, Walter
_________________
www.lloydgreentribute.com

Charles Davidson · From: Phenix City Alabama, USA

AMEN,AMEN,AMEN,AMEN,AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Les Green · From: Jefferson City, MO, R.I.P.

Double those Amens!

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Walter Stettner · From: Vienna, Austria

JT is one of the big names in today's "music" business, young kids go crazy about him. He's won several awards on MTV, maybe even a grammy. Nothing wrong if you haven't noticed him so far. Believe me, you didn't miss anything!

I don't know if he plays any instrument, at least he tries to sing (sort of) Very Happy

Kind Regards, Walter
_________________
www.lloydgreentribute.com

Archie Nicol R.I.P. · From: Ayrshire, Scotland

Music, is it? I'll give you music:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yz_EFhLT2Zo

Arch.

Tom Olson · From: Spokane, WA

I think Justin Timberlake is more famous for having dated Britney Spears than for his "music."

David Mason · From: Cambridge, MD, USA

Justin Timberlake was a member of N'Sync, a boy band manufactered in Orlando out of parts left over from aging Disney Mouseketeers. Britney Spears and Christine Aguilara also received their initial showbiz training as Mouseketeers - there is apparently quite a thriving industry down in central Florida, repackaging and reorienting cute, singing dancing children for an older (I hesitate to say "more mature") market as they begin to "bud out." Oh, Walt - what hath you wrought.... Shocked

Bill McCloskey · Posted 5 Feb 2007 11:22 am

I thought Justine was a singer? Hasn't it always been such? On the one hand we've had Charlie Parker, on the other the Vegas lounge singer. I don't think Justin's form of pop music is much different than other pop stars in any era. Just think of the 50's music stars that came out of the disney machine.

David Doggett · Posted 5 Feb 2007 11:53 am

David's got the goods (I know all this because I have three teen daughters that were into him when they were preens). JT was the most popular member of the most popular boy band in pop music several years ago. They sang very good four part harmony while doing intricate dance numbers (how many steelers can do that?). They had a number of top singles, CDs, videos and sold out arena concerts around the world. Their music was very rhythmic, but also very melodic and catchy in a modern pop way - think Michael Jackson in the '80s and '90s, or early Britney Spears. After N'Sync broke up, JT has struggled to remake himself as a solo act. To get away from the bubble gum stereotype he has tried to go more in the rap direction, and his music is not melodic the way it once was. After his affair with Britney, he has become more a personality than a musician. I have no idea if he plays any instruments - only vocals and dance have ever been part of his act. Did Fred Astair or Sinatra play any instruments?

One of the problems with these old music/new music discussions is that the relationship of melody, rhythm and chord progression has drastically changed. Up until the '50s, the rhythm and progression followed the melody. The progression might be very different from song to song, according to where the melody went. In the '50s, blues and rock used similar or identical progressions on many songs, with the melody following the progression and rhythm. Many people, used to the old music, hear the same progression on many songs, and don't recognize subtle variations that are occuring in the melody, which may vary from version to version according to the vocalist. Then when rap came along in the '70s, melody was completely eliminated, sometimes also any chord progression, and only rhythm remained. There is still some hardcore rap like that. But most of the really popular rap has some simple progression and instrumental and/or vocal riffs backing up the non-melodic rap vocal, which is more part of the rhythm section than anything else. Also, many of the most popular hip hop songs intersperse rapping with highly melodic R&B singing. Some of these have very beautiful progressions. If you just look for the very worst lyrics and nonmelodic rapping, sure it's out there. I can't take a steady diet of it, but I hear the hip hop and pop stations every time my daughters jump in my car. Some of it is very melodic and beautiful, and some of the lyrics are inspirational. "Where is the Love" by the Black-Eyed Peas comes to mind.

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

I think a lot of it is related to the fact that much of the "music" we hear as a backdrop in commercials and TV shows isn't really music in that it wasn't performed by musicians. It is sequenced synthetic sound. When you've been trained to think that it is music, anything with a human in it sounds great by comparison.
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video

Ray Minich · From: Bradford, Pa. Frozen Tundra

Ron Fitzgerald · From: Port Charlotte Florida

Walter, no disrespect , But Dave is on the money. I too have the at home teens and as an ecclectic musical family we see and hear a lot of music. Justin can sing a b9 at will . I was also a disbeliever in his musical ability until I saw him on a Grammy awards show a few years ago. He played incredible jazz piano on a latin funk tune and it might as well have been Michael McDonald or Stevie Wonder . As a lifelong Jazz and Country player, I was astonished. Who knew this kid could paly anything? I surely didn't. Sometimes these kids do exactly what management says to do . They are millenium song and dance men , who would probably rather be jammin with Buddy

John Macy · From: Rockport TX/Denver CO

I'm with you Ron--there is way more there than a lot see (or care to see). One of my regular studio clients co-writes a lot with Justin, and I have cut many of the demos of their work, including the first recorded version of a cut on the new record (and als some killer songs there that many will never hear). Sings, writes and plays, and has figured how to make a killer living at it Smile

Keith Cordell · From: San Diego

I can't stand the music personally, but the guy clearly works his butt off at what he does, has talent as a vocal shredder and writes some of his material. That he leaves the instrumental part to the professionals is a testament to good sense more than anything. I have no use for him but lots (millions) of people DO.

That being said, there are a lot of manufactured artists out there that didn't earn anything (Paris H.) and it shows.

John Macy · From: Rockport TX/Denver CO

Actually Keith, the record credits show him as:

Justin Timberlake: Guitar, Piano, Keyboards, Vocals, Vocals (bckgr), Producer, Executive Producer, Beat Box, Choir Director, Choir Arrangement

He can play Smile

110% agreement on the Paris thing... Smile

David Doggett · Posted 6 Feb 2007 4:15 pm

Ray, I have mixed feelings about the lyrics. I'm not a puritan. I always thought it was hypocritical to have two sets of words for the same things, one set "clean" and acceptable and another that is "dirty." The "clean" set are Latinized or French derived terms, and the "dirty" set are from the old Anglo-Saxon common languages of England. This goes back centuries to the Norman invasion of England, when imported Latin and French were considered "proper" and the native English was considered vulgar or even illegal. In the '60s I went to jail for running a newspaper that printed four letter words. The case was appealed to Federal court and thrown out by a very conservative judge. The attitudes of gender and racial hatred and degradation in some rap lyrics bother me more than the actual words. But even as liberal as I am, sometimes the lyrics are so in-your-face nasty that I change the station and tell my teenage girls, "You know, I'm not sure I'M old enough to hear stuff like that. That's just not something I want to hear right now while driving to school." There is very definitely a cultural battle going on in popular lyrics right now involving conflicts between races, genders, generations, street culture and church culture, etc., and it can all be heard in the music and lyrics. It's what they call "real."

John Macy · From: Rockport TX/Denver CO

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17008732/from/RS.2/