E13th tuning

D Schubert · From: Columbia, MO, USA

I have just strung up my "new" English Electronics (National-Valco) double-8 console. I tuned the front neck in A6, which I already understand. I tuned the back neck to E13...EG#DF#BC#E from lo to hi....which I want to learn.

What are some good recorded examples of E13 tuning that I can use to get inspired and started?

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

I'm using G# E C# B G# E B E on a short scale with a 16 gauge topper.

Compliments my usual C6 w/high G quite well.

Stephan Miller · From: Silver Spring, Maryland, USA

DS, I'm guessing you wanted to include a 4th string G# to fill out the tuning? As this is Leon McAuliffe's tuning, his recordings with Bob Wills or later under his own name could be a good place to start. He used other tunings too, so I would think the low E and the 2nd/9th sound from the F# would be good "identifiers" for that E13. Haven't tried this exact tuning, but it's a favorite for Western Swing...good luck with your quest.

D Schubert · From: Columbia, MO, USA

Yes, I'm looking at Leon's tuning -- EG#DF#G#BC#E or 13793561 -- from lo to hi

Matthew Prouty · From: Warsaw, Poland

A lot of early Western Swing was on E13th. The tuning sometimes vary but are pretty close. As stated Leon used this and some say that Joaquim Murphy used it too, but not real sure about that.

Ricky has a great tab on E13th for Oklahoma Stomp.
http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum8/HTML/000392.html

Also Don Helms used it, but a variation. I use Don Helms on my lap steel. Also Little Roy Wiggens used E13 but I am not sure what his tuning was.

I am a big fan of this tuning. I used Leon's for a while before switching Don's. Our band leader want that Hank sound for some songs and he wants it exact as possible.

M.

Frederic Mabrut · From: Olloix, France

DS,
you can go to this link (my band's website)
http://perso.orange.fr/les-coyotes/Fred.html

you will find here 2 examples of my playing with Don Helms' tuning on my D8 Gibson Console.
Love letters in the sand is accompagnied with its tabs.
I'm still working on the tab for Hop skip and jump.
Fred

------------------
Franklin D10
Gibson CG 520

Edward Meisse · From: Santa Rosa, California, USA

According to Andy Volk's book Don Helms used an E6/AMajor9 tuning. It is exactly Bobbe Seymore's C6/Fmajor9 tuned a major 3rd higher. That is from lo to hi A C# E G# B C# E G#. If I remember right. His second tuning was a B11. Again according to the book, he mostly used it to back vocals. He did little or no solo work with the B11 neck. Oh, by the way, nice work on those tunes. I thought Love letters was particularly good.

[This message was edited by Edward Meisse on 20 September 2006 at 04:00 PM.]

Jim Bates · From: Alvin, Texas, USA

Regarding E 13 th tuning - Anything by Bobby Koefer is usually done on E 13th.

Another version of E 13th is:(L-H) E B D E (or F#) G# B C # E, which is what I use.

Thanx,
Jim

Mike Fried · From: Nashville, TN, USA

The front neck of my Rick DC16 has the following E13 (low-high): B-D-E-G#-B-C#-E-G#

I like the high 3rd on top for the bright traditional country sound, and I have B11 on the back neck for a darker, more complex tonality. That makes my setup similar to Don Helms', except for the bass strings.

I've tried the western swing versions of E13, but not having that middle E really messes me up...

Edward Meisse · From: Santa Rosa, California, USA

Me too. I really don't get that. McAulliffe sounded pretty good on it, though.

Stephan Miller · From: Silver Spring, Maryland, USA

I read that John Ely used the McAuliffe tuning a lot in his years with Asleep at the Wheel. Maybe some folks would be able to name a few of the Wheel numbers where he played Leon's tuning. Also John has a website-- maybe you could contact him through that, and he could help you. There seems to be little if any tab for the particular E13 you're asking about-- you'd think there would be more.

D Schubert · From: Columbia, MO, USA

What I've discovered so far...it is great for rich 8-string strums and one-fret slides from above or below...can play country-sounding harmonized scales on strings 1+4, strings 4+8...a few neat scalar patterns falling into place...EZ for steel guitar rag...but y'all are right about the missing middle E...

John Bechtel · From: Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.

I think I've solved the more complete sounding and max. usage available from the E13. Tuning by incorporating all the tones in a 10-string version. This will be on my new T~10 non-pedal guitar. E~B~D~E~F#~G#~B~C#~E~G# There is still lots of tweaking possible on the lower strings if you're so inclined, for other different combination~tunings!

------------------
“Big John”
a.k.a. {Keoni Nui}
Current Equipment

John Lang · From: Las Vegas, Nevada

DS, If you are attending the TSGA show in Dallas this March, check out the Dick Meis non-pedal seminar. He does a great overview of E13 and explains it very well, and his courseware was how I was introduced to it.

One of the tabbed pieces you learn with him is Midnight in Amarillo, it is a great E13 tune, and I play it with my band all the time. Cindy Cashdollar included this tune as a duet with Herb Remington on her latest CD, I believe she is using E13 on it but I am not positive. She uses the Leon tuning as well on her instructional tape.

D Schubert · From: Columbia, MO, USA

Just listening to MIdnight in Amarillo on Cindy's album, as you suggested. Oh, yeah -- that's the sound in my head -- just need to get it to travel down to my picks and bar.

Thanks for all of the help, guys -- this is the best neighborhood on the web.

Jim Bates · From: Alvin, Texas, USA

John B. - Glad to see you have come to the same conclusion I did in 1969 when I put this version of E 13th on my pedal steel. I use all the standard pedal changes as E 9th (except without the 'rarely used' chromatic strings in my case). It has always been very easy to play the standard crying steel sounds with the pedals, and then play all the western swing, Hawaiian, and almost anything else without using the pedals.

It would be great if more people could discover this good tuning.

Thnax,
Jim

Bob Kagy · From: Lafayette, CO USA

Using the free Guitar Map program it's interesting to look at what you get with McAuliffe's E13th tuning (and other E13th variations).

It's avaiable at this link if you don't already have it:
http://home.comcast.net/~k.abolins/guitarmap.html

Gary Boyett · From: Colorado/ Lives in Arizona

Here is the link to the Dick Meis book

15 Songs in E-13th

[This message was edited by Gary Boyett on 24 September 2006 at 04:16 AM.]

Kevin Ruddell · From: Toledo Ohio USA

Thanks for posting the link to the site with the E13 material. I've tried the High G# tuning and picked out a few things Don Helms played but I'm at a total loss when I try the E13 tuning. Now that there is this instructional material maybe I can make a little progress. I never played E9 although I played regular guitar for a long time ; but I just don't know where to go with the E13. The F# in the middle of the order throws me off with somewhat of a restless sound. I can find the B and D chord fragments , strum some vamps and pick out some country-ish diads, but can't play a song on it.
I'm going to order the book/cd next payday and check it out

Steve Alcott · From: New York, New York, USA

Tom Morrell (High to low) : G#,F#,E,C#,B,G#,F#,E,D,E.

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

I thought Morrell's low string was a B. Live and learn...

Bryan Bradfield · From: Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada.

To get back to D Schubert's original question, that is a request for recorded examples of E13, does that mean we can acquire any of Tom Morrell's recordings, and be listening to an E13 non-pedal tuning?

Stephan Miller · From: Silver Spring, Maryland, USA

Some of the instrumental CDs in the "How The West Was Swung" series list the 2 10-string tunings on his Bigsby as the E13 just described, and an extended C6. That E13 is a really close-voiced tuning, and based on the chords & harmonics he's playing on those CDs, I'd say it's E13 most of the time. When it comes to all-time favorites,Tom Morrell is right up there with Joaquin Murphey in my book.

D Schubert · From: Columbia, MO, USA

This is a very enlightening thread, friends!

Steve Alcott · From: New York, New York, USA

When I saw TM at TSGA last March, he was playing his Carson Wells S10, E13 all the way. Nobody could figure out how he was doing the stuff he did. Truly amazing, and an experience no steeler should miss.

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