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Topic: Reading Tunings |
James Quackenbush
From:
Pomona, New York, USA
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Posted 3 Apr 2006 6:48 am |
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| I am looking at a lot of different tunings for the various lap steels that I have , that are posted by forum members, and I notice that there does NOT seem to be any way of knowing whether the tuning is from low to HIGH or from HIGH to low...When tunings are posted , what is the general rule ? ....Is the FIRST note listed the 1rst string ( HIGH) or is the lowest string ? ..... I thought there was some kind of rule on ths ????????....A lot of times I would tune to a tuning that is listed , only to find out that I tuned it the wrong way !!... What is the general rule on this ? ......Thanks, Jim |
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Brad Bechtel
From:
San Francisco, CA
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Posted 3 Apr 2006 7:33 am
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There is no general way to be sure a tuning is listed from low to high or high to low unless the person listing the tuning says so specifically. In my correspondence with people who ask, I always use from bass to treble. On my page of tunings I changed the layout to this type of display:
1. E
2. B
3. G
4. D
5. A
6. E
If you're not sure which way a tuning should go, you should ask for clarification.
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Brad's Page of Steel
A web site devoted to acoustic & electric lap steel guitars
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Al Marcus
From:
Cedar Springs,MI USA (deceased)
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Posted 3 Apr 2006 8:07 am
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James-Although when I play , I always figure my tunings From low to high and Print them that way low to high,as Brad does.
However for better clarification I always say the tuning from High to low. I think that is pretty standard with most guys....al 
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My Website..... www.cmedic.net/~almarcus/
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Roger Shackelton
From:
MINNESOTA (deceased)
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Posted 3 Apr 2006 8:28 am
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The strings are numbered 1--8 or 1--10 etc., from the highest pitch to the lowest pitch.
It seems academic to list the tuning the same way, as in C-6th,(1- E,C,A,G,E,C,A,F
IMHO.???
Roger |
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David Doggett
From:
Bawl'mer, MD (formerly of MS, Nawluns, Gnashville, Knocksville, Lost Angeles, Bahsten. and Philly)
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Posted 3 Apr 2006 8:39 am
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Throughout the musical world scales and chords are numbered from the bottom up. But somehow stringed instruments got their strings numbered from high to low. On the standard guitar one can see the conflict in that the strings are numbered from high to low, but the tuning is universally referred to as EADGBE. Early on, steelers followed the string numbers and tended to describe tunings from high to low. Some old timers get really incensed if anyone strays from this. Possibly this worked out better because, as strings were added, they tended to be added at the bottom. Starting the numbering from the bottom on the new strings would rearrange the entire string numbering system on the higher strings, that otherwise didn't change. The high strings were more or less fixed and couldn't go any higher, because of the physical limitations of the strings. But more variation was possible on the bottom strings.
But most of us, especially anyone with some theory background, think of tunings as built around chords, and therefore from the bottom up. Once you go beyond 6 strings, it is very difficult to reel a tuning off the top of your head without visualizing the chord from the bottom up. So we are stuck with these conflicting conventions, and the only solution is to state which convention is being used, and ask if nothing is stated.
If you think this is bad, take a look at the order of numbers on your touchtone phone and your hand calculator or computer number pad.  |
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Lee Baucum
From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
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Posted 3 Apr 2006 9:28 am
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There was a really loooooong discussion about this topic earlier.
Click Here
Lee |
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Russ Wever
From:
Kansas City
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Posted 3 Apr 2006 10:41 am
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| Quote: |
| There is no general way to be sure a tuning is listed from low to high or high to low unless . . . . . |
When figuring out whether a tuning is spelled out high-to-low or low-to-high,
it would become rather obvious when you look at the 'musical width' involved in each of the two possible ways of reading it:
Take the 8-string C6th mentioned several posts above, for example.
It is, from low to high,
F > A > C > E > G > A > C > E
and it 'spans' a musical distance of one octave and a major seventh.
If it was meant to 'read' the other way, with E as the low(est) note and F as the high(est), and of course cover the same order of notes
( E > C > A > G > E > C > A > F ),
it would 'span' a distance of five octaves and a minor second.
This 'inversion' would have the tuning no longer in 'player-friendly' thirds (excepting the G > A perfect second), but would render it to very wide intervals of sixths (with the A > G being a minor seventh).
What's more is that it'd be highly impractical, in this case, if not impossible to put appropriately guaged strings to accomodate the 'misread' version of the tuning: Since we are 'confined' by string guages to keeping the (now) highest note 'F' no higher than F4 (~350 hz), by the time we got to the (now) lowest 'E', it would be in the ~10 hz (subsonic) range.
Looking at another example, the six-string 'Open G' Dobro tuning:
( G > B > D > G > B > D )
If it is read as G being the lowest note and D being the highest, the range is an octave and a fifth, and it is comprised mostly of intervals of thirds; however, reading it as D being the lowest note and G the highest it becomes three octaves and a fifth wide and those thirds are now sixths.
When a tuning is spelled out horizontally I'm all for it being the more musically-intuitive 'lowest-on-the-left-to-highest-on-the-right', just the way notes 'lay' when you play an instrument, whether it's keyboards, guitar, xylophone, steel guitar:
The Lowest notes are to the players Left while the Highest are to the Right.
~Russ
.[This message was edited by Russ Wever on 03 April 2006 at 01:36 PM.] |
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James Quackenbush
From:
Pomona, New York, USA
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Posted 22 Apr 2006 4:28 am
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| I forgot to thank you guys for your info ....I am just as confused as ever about this subject , but the advise to "ASK" how the tuning is written is best .... Thanks again to all who responded ....Sincerely, Jim |
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Mitch Druckman
From:
Arizona, USA
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Posted 22 Apr 2006 6:30 am
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When the tuning is listed in a stacked, up and down format, the bottom string is lowest in pitch and the string on the top is highest in pitch. At least it has some logic to it.
1.E highest pitch
2.C
3.A
4.G
5.E
6.C lowest pitch |
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Jeff Au Hoy
From:
Honolulu, Hawai'i
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Posted 22 Apr 2006 7:02 am
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| Leave it ambiguous. The confusion keeps it fun. |
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Drew Howard
From:
48854
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Posted 23 Apr 2006 8:52 am
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Left-to-right is low-to-high.
1 High
2
3
4 to
5
6
7
8 Low
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Drew Howard - website - Fessenden guitars, 70's Fender Twin, etc.
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HowardR
From:
N.Y.C.-Fire Island-Asheville
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Posted 23 Apr 2006 3:01 pm
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Jeff Au Hoy & I devised this no brainer way of writing tunings.... 
D D
B B
G G
E
[This message was edited by HowardR on 23 April 2006 at 04:04 PM.] |
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Jesse Pearson
From:
San Diego , CA
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Posted 23 Apr 2006 4:05 pm
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What David Dogget said. The main tunings seem to have mostly had an E on top, so Ray Montee’s point about every one tuning the upper strings first makes sense relative to the bass and guitar and fiddle, so that the melody notes are in tune with everyone. Rick A. made the point that the upper strings are used for melody and the lower strings harmonize the upper strings. So these two points would explain why they would describe tunings from high to low back in the day. Also, Mike Neer made the point of string packaging going from high to low.
But since steel tunings are mostly just open chords, and I can spell any non- inverted chord without much thought, that makes it easy for me and it seems alot of other players, to remember steel tunings low to high, just like spelling any non inverted chord.
Now if I get my butt flamed on this one, I give up, LOL!
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Chuck Fisher
From:
Santa Cruz, California, USA * R.I.P.
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Posted 25 Apr 2006 11:49 am
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| I hate this thread/s ! Just specify low-to-high or high-to low. or vertically the top is high because its as the strings are located when you play......... duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh |
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Jesse Pearson
From:
San Diego , CA
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Posted 26 Apr 2006 3:35 pm
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| Some of us are into spelling non-inverted chords Chuck, what can I say?. What the heck are steel tunings? Most steel tunings lay out like a non-inverted chord from low to high, duhhhh! That means the root is on the bottom when you’re looking at your steel. I agree this is a dumb argument, unless of course your a beginner who doesn't know that most steel tunings are non inverted chords and learning how to spell non inverted chords is a big part of making music and an easy way to remember a bunch of different steel tunings. I think we all agree what ever floats your boat and works for you is the way to go. Showing logic behind a particular approach is no big deal unless your the kind of guy who follows the crowd around and says what ever they say, disregarding any logic that might be contrary to the groups long standing routine? God bless America and the freedom to ask why. |
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Darryl Hattenhauer
From:
Phoenix, Arizona, USA
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Posted 28 Apr 2006 10:26 pm
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Jeff,
Do you work for FEMA?
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"Drinking up the future, and living down the past"--unknown singer in Phoenix
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