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Topic: Is there a demand for younger players? |
Alex Piazza
From:
Arkansas, USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 3:05 pm |
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| I had this conversation with a guy the other night after a gig. He seemed to think there is a demand for younger "non-traditional" players in some of the major hubs like L.A, Nashville, Austin. I didnt know if this guy really new what he was talking about. just wanted to hear some thoughts. |
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Steve Hinson
From:
Hendersonville Tn USA
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Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 3:44 pm
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| If by "younger" you mean players who are making music rather than sitting at their computers complaining that music's no good anymore, yep--there's a lot of music being made and there's a lot of steelers being called on. |
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Joe Miraglia
From:
Jamestown N.Y.
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 4:11 pm
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| Jon- you're right! What is keeping a young or old steel player from working in most cases is their attitude. No group wants a player with a negative attitude or a know it all. There is a demand for steel players ,Young and old. Joe www.willowcreekband.com [This message was edited by Joe Miraglia on 27 November 2006 at 04:14 PM.] |
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Fred Justice
From:
Mesa, Arizona
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 5:02 pm
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Alex I think there is a lot to what your friend was talking about.
In my observation, they would be a great deal more of these younger singing act's carring a steel player if they were more younger steel players to hire. And not just for the players playing ability alone.
I recently watched a rerun on TV that had a steel player, but never heard a peep out of him the whole show. But he was young, wore a tee-shirt and a cowboy hat(Token Steel Player).
Now I'm not slamming any music or singing act here, just the fact that if they were more younger players they would be some new jobs open up out there,"my 2 cents worth.
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Fred Justice,
Justice Custom Cases & Cabinets,
Fred's Music, www.fredjusticemusic.com
[This message was edited by Fred Justice on 27 November 2006 at 05:18 PM.] |
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Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 5:26 pm
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I KNOW there's a demand...or at least a desire...for younger, especially non-traditional steel players around L.A.
I've been around the L.A. club circuit, mostly populated by 20-somethings, and a lot of the players would love to try steel in punk, metal, prog-rock....you name it. But they can't plunk down a huge chunk of money on an instrument when there are no resources for their styles. The steel community largely seems to have the attitude of "good" - we don't want that type.
That's too bad, because there are a LOT of teaching opportunities and a ton of instrument sales sitting there untapped.
I'm doing loops for some of them for recordings, and they'll fire them off via triggers live...but that's not the same as having a real (or GOOD!!) steel player as PART of a band, even playing power chords through a Bogner Uberschall. |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 6:22 pm
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I agree, they want only young, good-looking players. No, of course they don't want players with bad attitudes. They probably also don't want players with expectations of making a lot of money, players who won't travel anywhere or do anything at the drop of a hat, or players who want to do anything but sit quietly in the background while the star gets all the money, glory, and attention.
From my own point of view (which is admittedly, not front-row center of the Opry), the days are mostly gone when the musicians were a vital, identifiable, and recognized part of the star's personna and sound. ET, Buck, and Hag usually toured with the same band they recorded with. They appreciated their musicians! (What a novel concept?) They usually had the same guys in the band, and always recognized the band and gave them a chance to shine, too! Yesterday, it was mostly the "sound" that sold a star, today it's mostly "image" and sex appeal. The sound and band's musical contributions are strictly secondary. I also don't think most stars and recording companies want a musician who can do fresh new stuff, they just want the right "look", and if they can play something close to Paul's part, that's just icing on the cake. Oh, there are exceptions; there's still groups that want a "Sneaky Pete" type, but they're mostly obscure, unknowns, and they'll be happy to have you if you'll work for next to nothing and don't bring a lot of baggage with you.
I feel that when musicians (of any type) "get an attitude", there's usually a pretty good reason. They're just like most employees in other occupations, in that their "bad attitudes" are not usually created by their co-workers, but more often by someone "up the line" who wants things done their way, and "no thanks", they don't want any discussion.
"Uhh...band pictures? You mean the musicians? No, sorry, we don't have any 'band pictures' for sale. But we got plenty hats, T-shirts, and jackets with the Star's name and picture on them!"  |
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Pat Burns
From:
Branchville, N.J. USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 7:00 pm
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| ?? Jon Graboff seems to be doing pretty well as a "Cardinal" with Ryan Adams...heard them backing Willy Nelson on the radio this morning. |
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Pat Burns
From:
Branchville, N.J. USA
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Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 7:56 pm
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Donny, I think people are generally talking about a different playing field. Your talking about the traditional role of the steel player, and the original post was about non-traditional players.
The stuff you mentioned might be relevant to a sideman steel player of some sort, but most of the "non-traditional" steel I hear players talk about wanting is guys who will play it as a member of a band in styles NOT normally associated with steel - hardcore, metal, punk, hiphop. etc.
There's lots of interest....but no way in, unless the player simply takes a do-it-yourself approach. There's not a steel teacher around who is going to take a student who wants to learn Disturbed or Dillinger Escape Plan material...unless they will learn it by going through Winnie's book first. And they're not going to do that, as most of it isn't going to directly apply to them, and it's a l-o-n-g way around. |
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Don Barnhardt
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 8:22 pm
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| It seems to me that the music industry has become more show than music. Videos of cute singers in padded jeans lip synching to generic music is where the problem lies from the musician's stand point. I'm of the opinion that local gigs by guys with day jobs that play for the personal joy of it are the best chance for young players to get any recognition. Think back when music videos became popular and how many great singers and musicians carreer's were cut short because they just " sounded" good. I hope young musicians don't get discouraged and pursue steel and other instruments . I think we all get too hung up on this Young and Old rivalry. Tastes change from gener ation to generation. Most of us old farts have gone through more than one style of playing in our time. When I was a teenager I couldn't stand hillbilly music and thought western swing was the greatest music of all time and always would be. I have no desire to play the stuff that's popular now myself but I listen to the young players when I can and always encourage them to keep playing. |
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Ben Slaughter
From:
Madera, California
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Posted 27 Nov 2006 9:59 pm
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I had a blind offer to go on a tour with an alt-country band out of LA. They'd never heard me play. This was about 3 years ago, I was 25 at the time.
I could have handled the job, just couldn't have afforded the pay cut  My wife was 8 months pregnant.
I played 1 gig with a local alt-country group, then they flaked. They were pretty green, so it didn't break my heart.
Other than that, nobody's beating down my door, but I'm not exactly living in a musical hotbed. |
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CrowBear Schmitt
From:
Ariege, - PairO'knees, - France
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 2:01 am
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Lord have Mercy !
the clip is reserved to US residents
i can't get in on it from here  |
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Tor Arve Baroy
From:
Norway
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 2:35 am
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I am a 27 year old steel player from Norway, I feel that there is a need for steel players in general, I now play 2 bands on a regular basis + several one-night gigs. I also have to say no sometimes because there is to few hours in a day!
Steel is now officially a hip instrument!
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Tor Arve Baroy, Norway
www.baroy.no |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 3:04 am
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Steve, "Guess who Doesn't Love me Anymore" is one fine tune...
Anyway..the problem with the younger generation in my view, is not just with the Steel..its pretty much with everything..
like Burger King..
They want it now..
I feel that very few of the younger generation MINIONS are of the "work hard for a longtime to reach your goal" mindset.
Video games, fast food, on-line tests, on- line anything puts many folks in the "I need to do it now" mode.
I am of the opinion that our entire society is turning into a 30 second thing.
I think the desire to play Steel is there, but I think the actual commitment of time is not what it used to be. And of course the financial commitment is part of the equation as well.
A very new student came by the house for a lesson maybe 3 months ago, he understood the 6 string neck but had no clue about the Steel. He told me he had like 4 gigs lined up in the next few weeks. He needed to learn some GO TO licks so he could play a few solo's with the band, next week...
As I showed him the basic string grips and some basic AB Ped phrases, it was apparent he was not going to play anything anytime soon. He was real frustrated that he could not get the 10,8,6..8,6,5...6,5,4...5,4,3..grips down in less than a minute. He asked me how long it took me to just play each of the grips without thinking about it..I told him 30 years ! Actually I told him a month or two of daily constant practice will bring it in. He said he could do it in a week.
I don't know if he did or not, I never heard from him again. By the way he was playing on a very old student Guitar that someone took advantage of him with. The C Pedal didn't work and the knee levers were not even connected to anything. He said the guy who sold it to him told him it was a very Hi quality brand X and that it was a very popular Steel Guitar. It was brand X's student model. A piece of Cxxp....The guy , according to the student had two D10's in his music room so I am gonna go out on a limb and say the guy new what he was doing when he sold the student guitar to the newbie. And at $500 smackaroo's... A mindset to play in a week along with a piece of Crxp Steel is not a good equation.
just my morning take..and rant..
t
[This message was edited by Tony Prior on 28 November 2006 at 03:09 AM.] |
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Charlie McDonald
From:
out of the blue
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 5:10 am
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I'll bet the student didn't learn it in a week.
I can understand why his band would want to incorporate a few 'go-to' licks and why he'd think that an inadequate steel would do the job. But we all know what it takes and that's years of work.
The very young are in an excellent position to take the years to do it. Unfortunately, it's an instant society. |
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Sidney Ralph Penton
From:
Moberly, Missouri, USA
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 7:01 am
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well the way i see it by the time you learn this thing your already old. it takes a while to get good then it takes a while to get your name around. it all takes time unless you start up a band yourself. i believe that there will always be a call for the old style country twang as well as the newer stuff like with george streight etc. then there will be some that start up a new sond with steel. time changes, people change with the times and then there are some that hang on to the old school of things.
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zum SD10 peavy session 400 peavy XR600G
if its not a zum steel it isn't real
just trying to steel for the Lord>
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Jim Walker
From:
Headland, AL
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 8:41 am
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This is an interesting thread.
I have been lucky in the fact that I always treated people with respect, treated them how I wanted to be treated and that disolves a lot of attitudes. I love everybody and everybody loves me.
I'm 38 years of age which prolly makes me old by Nashville standards. My life long dream was to play for an artist on tour someday and I'm not quite ready to give that dream up just yet but I've been playing PSG less than a year and the phone is already ringing. Not many steelers in my area and there's a band on every corner. I do play lead guitar and sing as well so that gives me an edge. Point is I'm working! My little 3 piece band is pretty booked up and I have 3 more steel gigs in December with a great, good paying country band that I first played with in October. Two of the members have won Grammy's and another was nominated. I would have never had the chance to play with these guys if it were not for PSG.
The reason I took up steel was to go places I have never been. I guess I'm on my way!
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Rains SD10
Fender Steel King
B-bender Telecaster
Line 6 Flextone II Plus
www.jimwalkeronline.com
My Space
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 9:22 am
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To me, music is music, basically just chords and notes. The same chords, notes, and techniques are used in most styles of music. With the exception of "power chords", there's not really that much that's new. You learn the basics (the "building blocks", as it were), and then you go on from there. And just like building a building with bricks, the major difference in the final product is how everything's put together. You can build an outhouse or a cathedral from the same basic building "blocks".
Tony does bring up a good point, in that steel is much harder to learn than most other instruments. A lot of people don't have the moxie to hang in there. You have both hands, both feet, and usually both knees, all going in different directions. Add that to the problem of maintaining good intonation (not really mandatory for a regular guitar player), and the instrument is a real bear to learn. It takes a lot of time and dedication, and in today's world of instant gratification expectations, many decide to move on, or just add a B-Bender to their regular axe.
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Pat Burns
From:
Branchville, N.J. USA
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 9:24 am
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..CrowBear, click on this link to Carrie Rodriguez's website and wait a minute or so, it will automatically load "Seven Angels On A Bicycle" and play it for you...
http://www.carrierodriguez.com/ |
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Duane Reese
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 9:58 am
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Well, I guess that at 27 I'm probably as young as anybody would want (if they really wanted someone who what specifically 'young') but as far as the non-traditional aspect goes, I'm out. My playing sounds like good ole rot-gut country, and I'd refuse to play steel to hardcore, metal, punk, hiphop or anything that wasn't real country. I've played those other styles on other instruments, but I've basically always said that I don't like country and rock (for example) mixed any more than I like spagetti and chocolate cake mixed.
STEEL GUITAR IS A TRADITIONAL-STYLE COUNTRY MUSIC INSTRUMENT ONLY.
(Just kidding Jim) |
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CrowBear Schmitt
From:
Ariege, - PairO'knees, - France
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 10:02 am
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Thanx Pat  |
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Chris LeDrew
From:
Canada
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 10:32 am
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There has always been a demand for younger players because they can physically and mentally handle the road for months on end, have less ties to home, less monetary demands, and are more accepting of less than acceptable accomodations and travel arrangements.
As far as I can see from old footage, the guys in the bands of the 50s, 60's, and 70's were pretty young as well. Seems like a continuous trend to me. But the younger musicians are not necessarily hired on thier musical expertise. Talent is only one small ingredient in the recipe of the road. Some of the other ingredients are listed above. I'm 35 and a little sick of the road, after being on it since 17. I can't imagine how someone over 50 feels when they're out there for weeks with a gruelling travel, sleep and eating schedule. The road is custom-made for the young and single. |
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Nate LaPointe
From:
Los Angeles, California, USA
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 11:57 am
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I am 28 years old and I live in Los Angeles. I make my living playing guitar. I get called for more sessions on steel than I do on guitar! I think in LA it's a bit of a novelty instrument. The Evangenitals(Artsy-Country) hired my buddy Bryan to play steel. They played in a hip, over-packed club in Pasadena. People ate it up. I think if I had the time and energy to pursue my steel career then I'd be doing alright with it. But like many have said, it deserves a lifetime to get really good at it. I committed myself to the 6-string too long ago to change all that now!
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www.natelapointe.net
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Bill Hatcher
From:
Atlanta Ga. USA
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Posted 28 Nov 2006 12:10 pm
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| I bet that if tomorrow a space ship landed and out walked a dozen real pretty guys who played good steel guitar they could go to work tomorrow in road bands and on videos and every place except in the studios where old and ugly can't be seen and creativity and experience counts. |
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