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Topic: Future of Steel Guitar |
Marlin Smoot
From:
Kansas
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Posted 15 Oct 2005 3:31 pm |
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| The future of steel guitar...will really depend on how good you've learned your Buddy Emmons licks. |
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Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 15 Oct 2005 3:35 pm
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| So true. If everybody copies Buddy instead of being creative musicians (like Buddy) then it's dead where it lays. |
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Jim Bates
From:
Alvin, Texas, USA
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Posted 15 Oct 2005 4:25 pm
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Who are the 'creative' steel players now? Where can I hear them?
Unfortunately, all pedal steel players are now sounding the same, with the exception of two or three.
I hope to get enlightened on this subject.
Thanx,
Jim |
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Billy Carr
From:
Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)
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Posted 15 Oct 2005 11:03 pm
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| "Creative steel playing" > Steel guitar shows is the place to find it. I've met so many great players at these shows. Each one has been creative in there own way. Different guitars, amps, effects and playing styles are one of the things I enjoy most. I'm not locked into any certain type of Psg playing. I like everything from Little Roy Wiggins to Julian Tharpe. Just like guitars. I'd just as soon play a D-10 as I had a S-12U or even a S-10. Nothing limits a steel player from changing or playing. In my opinion, I believe as long as a player is willing to try new things and is always searching for ways to make his/her playing better, then there'll be creative steel players. Just my little .02 worth. Good topic. |
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richard burton
From:
Britain
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Posted 15 Oct 2005 11:52 pm
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I'll get me coat.....  |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 12:05 am
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| Quote: |
| Who are the 'creative' steel players now? Where can I hear them? |
Here are a few for starts.
Susan Alcorn
Joe Goldmark
Ned Selfe
Robert Randolph
Chas Smith
B.J. Cole
Robert Powell
Demola Adepoju (with king Sunny Ade)
Bruce Kaphen
Marshall Hall
Hal Merrill
Jeff Lampert
Bob Tailiffer
Al Vescovo
Maurice Anderson
Julian Tharp
Dr Hugh Jefferies
Me.
(I"ll add to this list as I think of more names)
Every single one of the people on that list is playing other styles of music besides country. Most of us have CDs available though the forum. Most of us also have web sites where you can hear what we are doing.
My web site is www.mikeperlowin.com I invite you to stop by and listen to some steel guitar music that's about as far away from country as it's possible to get. [This message was edited by Mike Perlowin on 16 October 2005 at 06:27 AM.] |
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Billy Wilson
From:
El Cerrito, California, USA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 12:14 am
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| Don't you mean Jeff Lampert? |
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Ernie Pollock
From:
Mt Savage, Md USA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 3:57 am
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I agree with Jon Light, if the new guys don't stop sounding all the same, we are done for - thats what I hear on most new country a l l t h e s a m e sounds & licks, for Gods sake & steel guitars sake, start doing your own thing N O W
Ernie 
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 5:23 am
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| Oooops. Hey Jeff, I'm sorry I misspelled your name. I fixed it. |
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Terry VunCannon
From:
Greensboro, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 5:58 am
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I think the future of Steel Guitar must include a place for the Lap Steel. I have noticed an increase in lap playing in blues & Rock & Roll. Because is so easy to carry around, it is the perfect addition to any guitar players choice of sounds. Just in my area of NC, in a 2 to 3 year period, about 5 of my guitar playing friends have bought lap steels after messing around with one of my laps.
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'49 & '51 National Dynamics, Harmos Model One, Lazy River Weissenborn, Mesa Boogie DC-3, SRV Strat.
http://community.webshots.com/user/keefriff
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 6:34 am
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I'd rather look at it as "the glass is half full". Admiditly there is a lot of what appears to be "sameness" today, but if you go back and read some of the comments from pickers such as Paul Franklin, Jr on what the producers want or even how the songs are written today that don't allow the space for licks that they used to have you get a better understanding.
I'm a died in the wool "hardcore" country type but I still hear a lot of new licks and super musicianship. True there's no Buddy or Pete Drake, Hall Rugg, Weldon, Jimmy Day, etc with their signature licks and styles. But, with the performance of Paul and many others at St Louis this year, all is not lost.
Things seem to go in cycles in "country" music - who knows, in a couple of years the current "rock country" will be passe and the old traditional country will be the new country with steel in your face. A couple of years ago it seemed if it had Fiddle it was "country". |
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Charlie McDonald
From:
out of the blue
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 6:40 am
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I don't agree with the original premise, altho Buddy Emmons will always be an icon of the instrument, and I will always listen to what he played. But I think he'd want those who follow him to play licks of their own.
Meanwhile, it's not all licks, and I can't add to Mike Perlowin's list except to include his name in the ones from whom I get inspiration, altho I see a future with many names added.
When steel guitar, pedal and non-pedal, are as old as the lute and piano, there will be many, and it will happen as long as there are creative players. |
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Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 6:56 am
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I have no worries about the future of steel guitar. I would have worries if everybody believed that the future of anything--anything at all--rested in the hands of people who reproduced the great masterpieces rather than the artists and innovative thinkers who dare to express their own ideas (usually informed by their own experience. Which means influenced by who/what came before them). When is the last time you were impressed by someone who could claim that they had painted a Guernica that was almost exactly like the original! Big whoop.
Fortunately the future is in the hands of creators, not re-creators. If I am wrong, then our culture and civilization is on a steep downward spiral, aided and abetted not by those who enjoy staying in their comfort zone--no crime there--but by those who seek to prevent, ridicule and suppress new ideas.
---I might add, I am not breaking down any walls and I don't expect to. But I like to think that I have my own fledgling style and I rarely hear any music or player that doesn't in some way influence me.[This message was edited by Jon Light on 16 October 2005 at 07:59 AM.] |
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Steinar Gregertsen
From:
Arendal, Norway, R.I.P.
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 6:56 am
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For steel guitar to have a future people must start looking at it as a musical instrument, not a musical style......
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www.gregertsen.com
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Alex Piazza
From:
Arkansas, USA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 8:04 am
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| Ive been playing the PS for almost two years and have gotten such a great response. probably because im the only one here in little rock playing one thats involved in the local music scene. I geuss im a little younger than most PS players (27). Ever since ive started playing Ive had work from all different genres of music. It seems like everybody wants a little PS in some form. The younger indie rock kids love it, as well as the jam band kids, singer songwriters, whatever. In not even two years ive been able to do some really cool things that were only made posible by the PS guitar. Ive toured england, scored a soundtrack for an indipendant film, countless recordings and gigs. However, almost all of these gigs have been with young artists that wouldnt be considered country. Only one of my gigs is with a country band. I geuss a lot of the new K-Mart country acts are cutting down on PS players, but who cares. that suff is cr-- anyway. There might not be as many good paying gigs out there anymore, however there are so many new creative avenues for the PS. If I wanted to make money id be a stock broker or something. For you older guys looking for work, try getting into your younger local music scene. I was amazed at the respect as well as the amount of work that Ive had from it. Everyone loves this instrument! The PS will never die out. Whats dying out is any shred of taste in commercial music. Country or whatever. All of the younger folks know that. It seems like anyone with talent these days is on an independant label. I dont know where im going with this, but my main point is that the younger generation drouls over the pedal steel. Thats It. |
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Al Marcus
From:
Cedar Springs,MI USA (deceased)
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 8:16 am
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Steinar-Very true words. A musician who might play Piano, Sax. Bass,Guitar, or anything , even a Steel guitar, playing any styles of music that happen to be desired by the listening public at that point in time....al
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My Website..... www.cmedic.net/~almarcus/
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Bobby Lee
From:
Cloverdale, California, USA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 8:23 am
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People are implying that you can't be "creative" playing country steel guitar. I disagree! Listen to Lloyd Green's Revisited - if that's not creativity, I don't know what is!
There are beginning steelers who mimic their idols to learn how to play. There are steelers making records who mimic sounds of the past to please the producers. There are steelers playing gigs who mimic the sounds on records to please the bandleader and (perhaps) the audience. These are not very creative activities.
And then there are steelers who add their own voice to whatever music they play. I don't care if it's country, rock, jazz, classical, whatever - all forms of music allow for creative expression.
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 Bobby Lee (a.k.a. b0b) - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Williams D-12 E9, C6add9, Sierra Olympic S-12 (F Diatonic)
Sierra Laptop S-8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster D-8 (E13, C6 or A6) My Blog [This message was edited by Bobby Lee on 16 October 2005 at 09:24 AM.] |
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Bill Simmons
From:
Keller, Texas/Birmingham, AL, R.I.P.
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 9:32 am
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This is just my thought, but as much as I love the steel guitar and as much as I love all the steel greats before and presently, the steel shows are sounding alike (again, just my personal thought) with the exception of a few players. A couple of very good players stated recently, 'that there are very few creative players who are playing the 'h...' out of the steel.' His comment made me ponder on the present steel position.
It appears almost the same people are attending the steel shows making it harder over the last few years for many of the players to sell product...the people have already bought most of them!
The good news is there are a number of wonderful steel guitar players who are taking the instrument outside the country - western swing music genre as already expressed. However, the challenge as I see is IF a player does go "outside" the trational musical styles, their opportunities to perform at the present steel guitar shows is almost nil. I don't think many of the present crowd are ready to except the "musical stretch" at this time.
Maybe in the future the larger shows will entertain giving designated time slots for additional musical styles to be introduced and featured -- classical -- new age -- or whatever...it really is an educational thing for many of us...learn how to appreciate the steel guitar as a MUSICAL INSTRUMENT with unlimited potential.
I agree with the statement -- "For steel guitar to have a future people must start looking at it as a musical instrument, not a musical style..."
For example, I'd love to see a segment at one of the major steel shows that featured the great players such as Buddy Cage -- Rusty Young, Al Perkin, etc. who took took the instrument into a new musical field years ago...
We need to also accelerate helping the younger generation learn the steel guitar. For example, I admire MSA for helping the young Chandler boy with a new steel -- what a future he has! I bet he will take the instrument to some new and interesting musiccal heights. All in all, I do believe the instrument's future is good!Thanks for letting me express some thoughts...
[This message was edited by Bill Simmons on 16 October 2005 at 10:35 AM.] |
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Chris Lasher
From:
Blacksburg, VA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 9:50 am
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Emulating heroes is part of the learning process. At least, it's a critical one in my learning to play instruments. The truly excellent players see this not as an end, but as a means to acheiving their own voices.
Famed (and my favorite) jazz guitarist Wes Montgomery openly cited premier jazz guitar soloist Charlie Christian as his primary influence, and indeed, began learning to play by reciting Christian's solos note-for-note. Further down the timeline, there is excellent musician, songwriter, guitarist Eric Johnson. He cites his main influences as Eric Clapton in his Cream years, Jeff Beck in his solo years, Lenny Breau, and (surprise, surprise) Wes Montgomery. In his instruction videos he demonstrates the tricks and licks he learned from each. Yet, although you can hear these influences in his playing, the derived end product of this crazy amalgamation is an original, creative, and musical sense of phrasing and style. And none other than pedal steel legend Buddy Emmons played and recorded Wes Montgomery tunes, and indeed, incorporated some of Wes' phrasing and style in his own playing and compositions.
One of the fan-favorites in performances by world-renownd pianist/comedian Victor Borge was his medley rendition of "Happy Birthday" in the styles of various famous composers. The creativity was in his combination of derivative works. And what of other classical and concert musicians? They play the same notes every performance, and oftentimes the very same notes played by musicians centuries ago, yet it is they who must interpret what is written to how it should actually sound, right then, in the present. Is that not creativity?
Why reinvent the wheel when you can stand on the shoulders of giants? Pick what you like, leave behind what you don't. The creativity comes in forming your own opinion about the music, and in using your tools to express something intelligent and/or interesting.[This message was edited by Chris Lasher on 16 October 2005 at 10:58 AM.] |
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Rick Schmidt
From:
Prescott AZ, USA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 10:06 am
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| Right on Steinar! |
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Mark van Allen
From:
Watkinsville, Ga. USA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 10:14 am
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As with so much of life, a lot of this is perspective, and what you allow yourself to be exposed to...
Pure Country steel seems far from dead to me- some of the Nashville production decisions may be questionable, but there's plenty of great steel playing coming out of there still, and although much of it may not be earthshakingly innovative, Paul F. and some of the other guys are keeping "traditionalists" hopping trying to keep up with some of those new pedal ideas and speed picking.
Franklin's stuff with Dire Straits, on the other hand, is (to me) wildly innovative and extremely appropriate. There's a guy with a foot solidly in both camps! I just wish more of the Nashville machine would embrace some of that stylistic creativity, and the rock machine would further embrace the concept!
Alex is right on the money about the younger crowd- while there are obviously a few millions buying the latest Simpson sister's efforts, there are far more thronging the Indie songwriter and Jam band scenes, and they recognize and love pedal steel, with virtually no constraints on style, tone, and creativity. Anybody feeling unappreciated on the VFW circuit would be tickled to death by the response they got with a Jam band...
And as Mike often mentions, there's a whole world of Ambient, Blues, Sacred Steel, Rock, Classical, and "world" music being played and recorded on lap and pedal guitars, and legions of fans eating it up. I wonder how many "traditionalists" have heard of guys like John Keane or Daniel Lanois, who have played on hundreds, if not thousands, of very popular records?
It does seem the current steel shows are supporting a style as much as the instrument itself- (or, rather several closely related styles) and for the folks that love those styles, there'll probably be new music for a long time to come- but there's already a whole lot more to enjoy for those who long for other sounds.
It's all in where you look...
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Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 10:27 am
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| Quote: |
| people must start looking at it as a musical instrument, not a musical style...... |
| Quote: |
| the steel guitar (is) a MUSICAL INSTRUMENT with unlimited potential. |
I've been saying this for years.
I have to agree with Bobby that there can be creative playing within the country music genre. But the problem is that for every creative player like Buddy or Lloyd or John Hughey, there are hundreds of re-creative players who are content to learn The Way To Survive from tab and never go on to create anything new.
Another problem is the stereotyping of the steel guitar as a country instrument. I'd like to relate several personal incidents here.
The first took place about 20 years ago. I walked into the office of a local jazz radio starion with an armfull of steel jazz records. S.G. Jazz and Minors Allowed by Buddy Emmons, Doug And Bucky by Doug Jernigan, Volume one of Reece's
"Moods of" series, and maybe one or two others that I don't remember. I spoke to the program director and offered to donate them to the station if he would occasionally play them on the air. The guy condescendingly told me "This is a jazz station. We don't play country and western records." I told him that these WERE jazz records and that these players were pioneering the use of the steel guitar to play jazz, but he still rejected them all without even bothering to listen to any of them. He refused to even consider the possibility that a steel guitist could play jazz.
incident #2. I met a well known jazz guitarist, and told him I'd like to play with him. As soon as I said the words pedal steel guitar, he became indignant. "I don't play no country music." I told him I didn't either, and that I had just transcribed and recorded Stravinsky's Firebird Suite for the instrument, and he sneered "Well you must have done it country style."
It must be mentioned that this man is Black and he associates the steel guitar and country music with bigotry and prejudice. Now that may be unfair but the stereotypeing does exist.
#3 Two different music college professors have refused to even listen to my Firebird CD (as did the aforementioned jazz guitarist) because they "knew" without listening that the steel guitar can "only play country music" and I MUST have interpreted the pieces I recorded a C&W in that style.
#4 A highly respected classical music critic, and the owner of a new defunct classical music record company also "knew" the same thing, but listened to the CD anyway, out of courtesy or perhaps curiousity. Both were surprised, (and very impressed) and commented that they never realized that the steel could do anything other than the Nashville stuff.
#5 A violinist who has supported herself playing music all her life expressed the opinion that the steel guitar is not a real musical instrument, and likened it to a kazoo as a musical toy. She actively resented my CD, saying that I didn't have the right to play legitimate music on an illegitimate instrument.
And finally, I want to call attention to the controversy within our own community when the recording was first made public. One reader review in SGW review began with the words "Warning" Stay away from this tape. it's as far from country as you can get." Another reviewer admitted that it was very good, but said that it "didn't serve the needs of the steel guitar community" and ended with the words "Michael, go back to playing country."
I received a hate E-mail from one person (who subsequently apologized) and I heard that somebody who defended the recording actually received a death threat as a result. I don't know if that's true, and I prefer to think that it is not. But it was not until guys like Buddy and Paul Franklin praised the recording that it got any acceptance in our community. Before that it was not country, therefore it was not any good.
These are the kinds of obsticles the steel guitar faces. And the players who learn Emmons licks off tab and never progress beyond that, and the people who say "If it ain't country it ain't music" are only making it worse. |
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Les Anderson
From:
The Great White North
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 12:32 pm
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I have to agree with the bad habit of learning from tabs then sticking to that arrangement of the piece. I would suggest to these tabbers, get the tune in place from the tab; then, start the process of a signature style of your own.
I got the tab for Maria Elena from Roy Thomson: however, once I got the melody in place, I started playing it from how I feel when I play the tune. Some of the notes are sustained a little longer while others have been shortened and, I arranged it so it blends in with our horn (sax) back up. Did I screw up this beautiful song? It seems not because that non-pedal steel solo is one of three tunes that our band plays at dances that brings a very generous round of applause from the audience. Is that not what every musician strives for?
Unless the new players get away from emulating the styles and licks of their country steel guitar heroes and take the instrument to expanded fields, it will remain stuck in it’s country music only stigma.
One more thing I want to mention, I will dare to suggest that the players who tend to have the more emotional personality are able to bring more out of that steel guitar than someone who loves it only for its sound and tone.
And no, I am not gay nor a cry baby!!!!!!!!!
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(I am not right all of the time but I sure like to think I am!)
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Eric West
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 16 Oct 2005 1:24 pm
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Marlin.
I agree totally.
Les.
That didn't sound "gay" to me.
Not that I would know anyhow.
Not that there's anything wrong with that...
EJL |
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Charles Davidson
From:
Phenix City Alabama, USA
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Posted 25 Oct 2005 6:46 pm
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| I bet I am the most creative guy on this forum.I dont sound like ANY ONE else,and NO ONE in their cotton picking right mind would WANT to sound like me.Guess I'm just to damn hard headed to quit trying!!!! |
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