Robert Randolf! is it just me or what!?

Terry Edwards · From: Florida... livin' on spongecake...

Right you are, Jim. Les Paul invented multi-track, the other Paul used multi-track to produce recordings that were innovative.

Terry

Danny Kuykendall · From: Fullerton, CA, USA

I watched the Eric Clapton show on channel 28 the other night and can only say, that even with my limited pedal steel guitar experience what he was doing did not seem all that difficult. Do I feel that I could do it? Yes, I do.
And, does the distortion (the fuzz) cover mistakes? My experience was (the one time I played a gig and used a fuzz) that it did allow for a lot of free-picking and seem to "muffle" or obscure the sound, as opposed to a clear steel sound.
No offense to Robert, just an observation.

David L. Donald · From: Koh Samui Island, Thailand

What Steinar said. ^

Bill Hatcher · From: Atlanta Ga. USA

I have a friend here in Atlanta that works in a funky music store that deals mostly vintage. He loves the PSG and plays a little. Usually keeps a used one in the store. He tells me that the black kids come in and check out the pedal steel guitars all the time. They dig RR. They are becoming interested in the PSG because of him and also the church thing. Some of them can actually play! THAT is promotion of this instrument. It is certainly not the promotion of the PSG in the typical tired E9 whining thing.
The black kids don't know or care about Emmons or Nashville, they just know that RR is cool and that he has sparked something that has drawn them to the pedal steel guitar. That's promotion.

I saw that concert with Clapton. From the beggining of Claptons career until right now, when is the last time you saw a pedal guitar player on stage with him? THAT is promotion of the instrument.

We keep talking about RR here until everybody is blue in the face pro and con---he keeps on playing and furthering his career and the instrument.

RR is not a complex player. He is a groove player. His fan base is color blind. They are just into the groove. They see and hear no groove in Emmons and country. For them to feel this from a pedal player--THAT is promotion of the instrument.

You guys know where I have stood on the RR issue from the start. He is good for the pedal guitar!

David Doggett · Posted 11 Feb 2005 11:03 am

Should we criticize country steelers for not using the full potential of the instrument and playing some RR style and some classical music? Should we ask them to include one RR style song in each set, just to educate the listeners? I appreciate it for some steelers to say they are not too impressed with RRs playing and his type of music (although I have never heard these complaints about any other steeler). But that is their problem, not his. Playing blues and gospel on steel guitar goes back to the '20s and '30s. It's not even new. Will RR help country steel? Remains to be seen. Will RR help blues and gospel steel? It's already happened. I used to play blues on steel for myself when I started back in the '70s, but no blues band ever asked me to play with them. Tonight I will be playing my Zum with a group that plays mostly Chicago Blues, with a little fusion. My old slide guitar is gathering dust since RR came along. Pedal steel is much more versatile, and now I am more free to play anything I want on it.

Al Marcus · From: Cedar Springs,MI USA (deceased)

What Len Amaral said makes some sense. When RR is on Tv for 3 or 4 songs, after tiring out his fan base with his high performance playing.

It would be nice if he slipped in just one tune, nice and quiet, using the pedals and showing the Other side of the Steel Guitars possibilities.

The audience might even want a breather. I don't think he would hurt his image, one bit, if he did that.

I know that he can do it! Probably increase his fan base at the same time...........al

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My Website..... www.cmedic.net/~almarcus/

Terry Edwards · From: Florida... livin' on spongecake...

I would venture a guess that most of those critical of RR not using the pedal steel guitar to its fullest potential are probably guilty themselves of not playing C6 and utilizing their D-10 guitars to to fullest potential.

But then there is nothing wrong with that. You play your instrument the way you choose to play it.

It is not RR's responsibility to promote the pedal steel guitar. He's just a musician and an artist making music that he enjoys and he's making a living at it.

Terry

Ad Kersten · From: Beek en Donk, The Netherlands

I thought the whole idea was about making MUSIC, not about which instrument you use or how you get "a" sound out of it...........

Ad

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Zumsteel S12U

Yo, Man! homepage

Rick Schmidt · From: Prescott AZ, USA

I'm glad that RR is around and doing what he's doing, but I have to agree with Skip in that he just hasnt grabbed me yet, even though his talent, charisma, and enthusiasm is undenialble.

I think for me its more of a tone thing. (And believe me, nobody likes NON-country steel playing more than I do!) I just wanna hear something else.

I'm thinking that any blues/rock guitar player around here (which is what RR is clearly trying to emulate most of the time) who has that brittle of a tone, and plays that frenetically, would be hard pressed to get anywhere near the attention that Robert's getting. In fact I know a few blazing 6 stringers who nobody will hire for that very reason.

I still say the best thing I've heard RR do is the Ebow "vocal" sounding stuff. It's killer!!! I'd like to see some TONE and VIBE guru like Daniel Lanois etc. produce his next album.

[This message was edited by Rick Schmidt on 11 February 2005 at 11:49 AM.]

Thomas Bancroft · From: Matawan, New Jersey, USA

Frank Zappa said it best. "Shut up and play your guitar!"

Larry King · From: Watts, Oklahoma, USA

How about Tom Morrell? Before some hot shot jumps on my case by saying Morrell doesn't have pedals, I'll be happy to remind you that we all saw him for years with his Bigsby Pedal Steel and never touching his pedals.
The other side of the coin is Billy Robinson who gets all the pedal "sounds" playing 'slant bar' on a non pedal guitar. RR probably isn't my cup of tea but he's highly visible and the instrument is getting exposure so.......

Brian Herder · From: Philadelphia, Pa. USA

Ron is correct..RR is on Fountains of Wayne "Welcome to the Interstate" Hung Up On You. A sort of country number that RR plays on. You can hear a little on iTunes..you can hear the whole thing for 99 cents.

Charles French · From: Ms.

"The Robert Randolf Steel Guitar Forum"

You guys are a trip. You all sound my 10 yr old son and his friends playing ball in the back yard.

"That's not fair, you can't do that, yes I can, no you can't, can too, fine then, I ain't playing with you then."

"I like Robert's playing, he's making young folks aware of the steel."

"I saw him on such & such and he is Great"

"I bet he can't play no country steel"

"He's a bum"

"He don't impress me"

"He really impressed me"

"If you don't like him, you don't have to listen"

"Why does he have pedals, he don't use them"

etcetcetcetcetcetcetcetcetcetc&on&on

JIMMY CRACK CORN AND I DONT CARE!

[This message was edited by Charles French on 11 February 2005 at 01:08 PM.]

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

What we tend to forget is that as musicians, out ultimate goal is to play music, and the instrument we play is just a tool. With that in mind, let's pretend that we are furniture builders who use a certain type of screwdriver, and we are talking about somebody who makes radically different style of furniture.

Somebody once commented that if RR's style of music was the future of the steel guitar, it would be better to let the instrument die. If we use the analogy of the screwdriver, you can see how absurd that is. - It's like saying that if style of furniture becomes prevalent, it's better to get rid of all the screwdrivers.

The pedal steel guitar is not a country instrument, it is a musical instrument, capable of playing many musical styles and limited only by the imaginations (or lack thereof) of the players.

Whether you like RR or not, there is no question that he is bringing the pedal steel guitar to the attention of people who would otherwise never know anything about it, and by doing so, he is opening up doors for other players. This is something that not even Buddy and Lloyd have been able to do.

I fail to see a down side.

[This message was edited by Mike Perlowin on 11 February 2005 at 01:13 PM.]

Dan Tyack · From: Olympia, WA USA

All these conversations about RR remind me of a discussion I had in a music store a couple of years ago. I was talking to one of the guys working there who complimented me on some playing I had done on a local rock band's record. The subject came up that I had played pedal steel on said recording. Whereby a fellow employee (young shredder guitar hero wannabe) commented that he could play *anything* that could be played on the pedal steel with his strat with whammy pedal. Whereby said shredder dude proceeded to demonstrate (with said whammy bar equiped strat) how little he understood about the pedal steel. You couldn't really talk to the guy. He really thought he was doing it, but he just didn't get it.

IMHO a lot of the comments on these RR threads show about as much understanding of what RR is doing as that guitar player showed towards the pedal steel.

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www.tyack.com

Charles French · From: Ms.

Dan, you just summed it up. Now that ought to be a thread stopper.

John Pelz · From: Kettering, Ohio, USA

What Dan said. Now let's all do something useful, like practice our steels...

John Macy · From: Rockport TX/Denver CO

quote:

"I'm sure but this kinda musicianship is NOT helping promote pedal steel in any way."

I don't know about anyone else, but my session calls are definitely up do to RR and his visibility. Now I happen to really like him, but even if I didn't, he sure is promoting the steel...

Steinar Gregertsen · From: Arendal, Norway, R.I.P.

What John said about what Dan said, and definitely this pearl from Perlowin:

Travis Bernhardt · From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada

Dan--no kidding.

I think the tone comments are fair, though. I thought his tone on last night's Conan show was better than usual, but I think he could sound a lot better.

Of course, I think that most distorted pedal steel doesn't sound as good as it could. Aside from on a couple of tracks whose names I can't recall at present, most of Buddy Emmons' distorted tones that I've heard are downright embarassing (the stuff on the "White Album" especially).

This is not to say that it can't sound good, just that for some reason it's a bit of a rarity. Lap steel and acoustic steel sound GREAT distorted, so I don't know why people seem to have so much trouble with the pedal steel.

-Travis

Dave Grothusen · From: Scott City, Ks

Ya know guys, we do not have to like RR. We are not the ones paying his bills. I for one do not care for what he does, I think it is sloppy slide guitar. However, someone must like him because he is evidently making a living doing what he likes.
I guess one of the things that bothers me is that he is a "pedalsteel guitar player". Well, did he work as hard as we did to learn how to play "Together Again" or 'Look At Us"? One would assume that he did not. Maybe though, he worked just as hard to learn to do what he does as we did to learn what we do.
He has the spotlight and that is good for him. I do not believe that he will erase the love for "our" type of PSG.

David L. Donald · From: Koh Samui Island, Thailand

Nor do I think he is trying to erase that.
He is just adding another way to what can be done.
Heck, he's still quite young too, many of you have grandchildren his age...

I think much of the embarassing distorted steel work of the past ,
was because the fuzz tones were pretty darned embarassing,
but you work with what ya got. at the time...

Bill Hatcher · From: Atlanta Ga. USA

DD is close on the fuzz thing on older steel recording. I attribute it to the fact that steel players mostly have no affinity with distortion so when they tried out that "new groovy hip cool fuzzy" guitar sounds that all the standard players were using, they mostly flipped a switch on a Jordan Boss tone and sounded somewhat like a giant bumble bee, and they really did not know that it was sort of a VERY square square wave.

Dave. When you talk about "our" type of steel guitar. Are you talking about that type of steel that is just about never heard anymore on top 40 records out of Nashville or any place else?

Unfortunatly RR is just one guy. This could begin and end with him. Anybody know of any new kids out there coming up behind him with some interesting stuff?

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

I ain't no young dude, but I'll 'splain this thing oneeee moooore time. I wan'cha all to pay attention. Especially those who simply can't understand RR's popularity.

It's not about "ability".

It's about entertainment, it's about style, and it's about being different! Yup, 'ya gotta dare to be different to catch the appeal of the masses!

Remember Tiny Tim?

Remember Hendrix?

Remember the Beatles???

Remember the Rolling Stones?

Remember.....Elvis?

Yep. They all attained fame and notoriety by doing something totally different. They stepped outside the box.

That's what it takes to create a phenomenon. That's what it takes to get you featured on TV nowadays.

I recall...back in the early '60s, I think, two piano virtuosos. One was Liberace (y'all know him), the other was Van Cliburn. They had a "technical playoff", of sorts, in Texas. Well, when it was over, Van Cliburn won, hands down!

But it wouldn't be he that went on to play Vegas for millions of dollars.

It was...(big shock), ol' Liberace!

"Mass appeal" is never about ability. It's about style. It's not rocket science, guys. You can verify it yourself...

Enter "robert randolph" in your google search engine.

222,000 hits come back, give or take a few.

Now, enter "buddy emmons".

12,000 hits come back, give or take a few.

And yet, some people (mostly older players, like myself) can't understand exactly why Robert's on Conan, Letterman, and Leno, and Mr. E is well, semi retired.

Duh???

We all know Buddy has probably forgotten more than Robert will ever know. We all have ultimate respect for this giant of the steel guitar. Makes no difference, though. RR is numero uno. The numbers (remember Madison Ave.?) don't lie. I know this frosts some people's butts, but that's the way it is. Despite the growing "grey demographic", this is still a YOUTH culture. I'll digress alittle more, then I'll adjourn for the evening.

This past weekend, I played a steel show presented by VA native Chuck Campbell. The crowd was rather typical...average age 45-55, and few (if any) youngsters (players under 20 years old). The had great local and N'ville players, as well, guys like Randy Beavers, Russ Hicks, and Buddy Charleton.

Anyway, on to the show. I played one set. Did about 7 songs. One, unaccompanied (an old Les Paul fingerstyle number), which I hadn't player much in 20 years. I warned the audience it would probably be a train wreck, and I dismissed the band.

It was.

Bringing to mind the words Hoover, and Electrolux.

I also did a "warp 7" version of Rocky Top. Paul Franklin would have been proud (except for the missed change...I still don't know if it was my fault, or the bands). Anyhow, I somehow collected my wits, and after a few boom-thumps, I was back on track, and finished the song, banjo style (using my Sharpie instead of the bar to get the genuine "plink-plunk" of a Mastertone or Deering!

I did a few slow numbers, typical "schmaltzy" steel stuff. You know, Mansion, Cold Cold Heart, and a jazzy I Love You Because (rather sloppy, but different...couldn't have them think I didn't know where the C6th neck was, could I?).

Anyhow, since I had pretty well run the gamut of my mediocre abilities, I thought I'd do something rather "atypical". I don't have much of a reputation, anyway, so I can do these things...in other words, I have very little to lose at this point in my life. I held up my Bosstone, and explained to the audience..."This is rock-and-roll"! A quick check with the band verified they knew my "rock song" selection (I had picked out 3 that I had done many times in decades past, and settled on the Rolling Stones' "Honky-Tonk Woman), and I turned on the slap-back, took two rides (growing in complexity), and finished with a distorted machine-gun verse and chorus that RR would have probably loved!

(The bass-player told me it had a "great groove"?)

When the performance was over, I was mystified (with this audience) that my biggest round of applause came from....

Well, here's a hint...

"Really big lips"

(And no, I didn't do any Ernie Ashworth songs!

)

[This message was edited by Donny Hinson on 11 February 2005 at 04:28 PM.]

Donna Dodd · From: Acworth, Georgia, USA

I agree with Dustin – THAT IS WHAT SACRED STEEL IS!!!!! It began in the House of God church in the 1930s, and is still going strong today. We can like or dislike the style – because it will continue regardless of what we think. It is what Sacred steel is!!
I first heard RR, and really got into the groove that Bill Hatcher mentions. I immediately connected with the “groove”. Not everyone is groovy

, so they aren’t going to like it. It’s my understanding that RR was surprised that so many white people liked the music, affectionately adding that they usually clap on the off-beat. Tommy and I went to the House of God church where Dante Harmon plays. It was more alive with the Holy Spirit than any church I’ve attended. It almost seems sacrilegious and disrespectful to be evaluating a tradition that is finally available for those who care to listen.

Most everyone knows the history, but here’s a piece that will give you a little insight --

quote:
A Brief History of the House of God Steel Guitar Tradition
by Robert L. Stone
The steel guitar is usually identified with country or Hawaiian music. Pedal-steel guitars are routinely found in contemporary white country gospel bands. In most African-American church services, however, the instrument is unheard of. In the House of God, Keith Dominion churches the steel guitar has reigned supreme for decades. The House of God is a Pentecostal church. Those sects are known for music-driven worship services in which the presence of the Holy Spirit is manifested by dancing and involuntary body movements. The House of God cites Psalms 150:4, "...praise him with stringed instruments...," and 149:3, "Let them praise his name in the dance," as scriptural support for the music and Holy dancing. Worship services are driven by music played by an ensemble which is led by a steel guitarist. The steel guitarist works closely with the minister to play a very important role in worship services. In addition to belting out driving "praise" or "shout" music, the steel guitarist provides dramatic emphasis for sermons and testimonies, accompanies singers, plays for offertory processions and aids in healing.
Hawaiian music, with its signature singing steel guitar sound, was a major theme in the popular music of the U.S. from the 1910s until World War II. During that period Hawaiian music schools proliferated throughout the country. Troman Eason (c. 1895-1971) took steel guitar lessons in Philadelphia in the mid-1930s from a Hawaiian whom his surviving brother, Willie (b.1921), remembers as "Jack."
Troman and Willie Eason brought the electric steel guitar to House of God services in the late 1930s. While Troman played in the straight Hawaiian style, Willie, who never had lessons, imitated African American singing with his instrument. His voice-like single string work became the basis of the House of God steel guitar tradition. Willie traveled widely playing the steel guitar and singing, first to tour with Bishop J. R. Lockley's Gospel Feast Party, then later by himself to perform street corner music ministries. He recorded a total of eighteen sides in the 1940s and 50s.
Henry Nelson was born in Ocala, Florida in 1930. His father, Bishop W. L. Nelson (1895-1973), was a prominent figure in the church. Henry's oldest sister, Alyce, became Willie Eason's first wife. Hearing Eason and his "talking guitar" for the first time in about 1940, young Henry was amazed and soon took up the instrument. Nelson developed a style of praise music which consisted of voice-like lines punctuated by a variety of driving, rhythmic "frams," or strums, under which the band played without chord changes. His praise music became the foundation of what is accepted by many as true "House of God music."
Willie Eason also influenced Bishop Lorenzo Harrison, who established the steel guitar style for the Church of the Living God, Jewell Dominion, which shares a common origin with the House of God, Keith Dominion. Unlike the driving one-chord Keith Dominion music, Jewell music has distinct chord changes. Jewell steel guitarists usual played at slower tempos and often use of wah pedals for tone coloration.
In the 1970s the pedal-steel was introduced into the House of God by musicians including Maurice "Ted" Beard, Jr, Calvin Cooke, Chuck Campbell and Acorne Coffee. Determined to incorporate the pedal steel into their musical tradition, they developed unique tunings, pedal set-ups, and playing techniques.
Developments in recent years have included more exchange between Keith and Jewell Dominion musicians, continued exploration of electronic effects and incorporation of ideas from the full variety of contemporary music. With the release of the Sacred Steel CD in 1996 by Arhoolie Records this rich musical tradition, which had been kept a secret from the world at large for nearly 60 years, started a flood of worldwide interest which continues to increase. Steel guitarists including the Campbell Brothers, Aubrey Ghent, Calvin Cooke and Robert Randolph, have begun to present their vibrant music at concerts and festivals throughout the U.S., Canada, Europe and Africa. The result is invariably standing ovations and encores.
House of God steel guitar music continues to grow and evolve. With a solid core of mature masters and a fourth generation of aspiring, inventive younger musicians, the tradition seems stronger and more vibrant than ever. (c) Robert L. Stone 2001

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