Sitting position behind a D10?

Steve Knight · From: NC

The post on tone on the pedal steel forum has me thinking more about my technique. How close do you sit to your D10 steel? Most of the pictures I can find of the great players are taking from the front of their steel & not on a profile, so it's hard to tell. Are your elbows lines up directly below your shoulders, or just in front of them?

Thank you,

SK

(Oops, maybe this should've been posted in "pedal steel.")

[This message was edited by Steve Knight on 08 October 2004 at 07:00 AM.]

Terry Sneed · From: Arkansas,

Steve, I like to sit fairly close to my Emmons D10. not too close, but close enough that I don't feel like I'm havin to reach for my pedals and knee levers. I'd say whatever is most comfortable for you, as long as it don't effect your playin.
Terry

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84 SKH Emmons Legrand D10
session 400'rd Steelin for my Lord.

George McLellan · From: Duluth, MN USA

I don't know why nobody has mentioned that it's not much differant (at least to me) than sitting in a comfortable position while driving your car or at your PC. Height is also very important. I had shorter legs and rods made for my Willy so it's the same height as my Carter. It makes all the differance to me. I am very uncomfortable playing a steel that is too high.

As for where in relation to your frets, I center on 13th.

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SUAS U' PHIOB
Geo

Gene Jones · From: Oklahoma City, OK USA, (deceased)

I agree with George. There is no "standard" position. Getting your position behind a steel is like adjusting the seat in your car......just move it around until it "feels comfortable".

www.genejones.com

John Daugherty · From: Rolla, Missouri, USA

I think the position of your knee levers will determine where you sit and also the height of your seat. The higher your legs are, the less leverage you have on the levers. Experiment with your guitar with different seat heights and see what feels best for you. You also need to be able to comfortably work all the pedals. Depending on the number of pedals you use, you need to adjust your side to side position accordingly. This will probably require tweaking the positions of your knee levers. .......JD

Rick Collins · From: Claremont , CA USA

Center you belt buckle at about the 15th fret with comfortable arms distance to the outside neck. Pick at about the 24th fret.

James Cann · From: Phoenix, AZ

I'm with John D. The knee levers are my issue: "not where they used to be" as my old rig was an S-10. I'll also have to reconcile lever travel.

James
Sho-Bud LDG

Billy Easton · From: Nashville, TN USA

I prefer not to have the guitar dictate to me where I sit due to knee lever placement, so I have had my guitars built with the left knee levers nearer the right than standard. I play more C6th anyway, and all my knee levers work on both necks. Works best for me. I believe if it is not comfortable for you, then change the guitar where it is, not necessarily moving your body's position. Just my opinion, your mileage may vary.

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Billy Easton
Casa Grande, AZ
Southwestern Steel Guitar Association

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

I sit centered at about the 12th fret, and I'm a "laid back" player, so I sit kinda far from the steel (my "middle" being 9"-12" from the cabinet). Another musician once remarked that my playing posture was like an 11th grader sitting at his school desk, but it works for me!

Seriously, I just don't see this as real important in the grand scheme of things. Just sit where it feels comfortable.

Larry Robbins · From: Fort Edward, New York

I sit at about the 15th fret if I am playing C6 and around the 12th if I am playing E9. I also like to sit back just far enough to sneak a look down at the pedals as long as no other steel player is looking!

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Sho-Bud ProII, Pro III,
Nash 400,Hilton pedal,
RV-5."There's been an awful murder, down on music row"

Gordon Borland · From: San Antonio, Texas, USA

About three years ago I developed a pain in my right sholder blade. It seemed to get worse with every gig. Iam in my late fifties
so I figured old age was setting in. The doctor tested for all kinds of reasons but, no help. I even tried acupuncture but, no help. A friend said to make sure my elbows were higher than my hands when playing the steel. I lowered the back legs just a tad and in two weeks no more pain. That determins the height and then Ricky Davis mentioned to set to the right of the steel instead of center to give your left arm better reach over the necks. Just those two moves made for a more comfortable way to pick.

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Gordon Borland
MSA D10,NASHVILLE 400,SESSIONS 2000,PEAVEY ADDVERB,SOME WIRES AND A BATTERY.

Steve Knight · From: NC

Thank you for your replies, everyone. My back usually feels a bit stiff after an hour or so of playing now. And if you feel stiff & uncomfortable, you can imagine the tone you get. I'll try lowering the back legs on the steel & concentrate on relaxing more while I'm playing. It sounds like I also need to move to my right a little bit, too.

Thank you,

SK

John Bechtel · From: Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.

Above all, you should never try to cross your legs while playing¡

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“Big John” Bechtel
(2)-Fender ’49–’50 T–8 Customs
Fender ’65 Reissue Twin-Reverb Custom™ 15”
click here click here click here click here

John Bechtel · From: Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.

There's always one horses-%^&ss in the crowd!

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“Big John” Bechtel
(2)-Fender ’49–’50 T–8 Customs
Fender ’65 Reissue Twin-Reverb Custom™ 15”
click here click here click here click here

Tommy Allison · From: Transfer, Pennsylvania, USA

I let the knee levers dictate the distance I sit from the steel. As for side to side, I was told that the middle of my body should line up with the 12th fret or there abouts. I always believed the reason for this is to minimize paralex(hope I spelled it right).

David Doggett · Posted 12 Oct 2004 10:56 am

Um, let's try to apply some basic ergonomics here. For piano playing, keyboarding, etc., the general rule is to have your forearms level and in a straight line with your wrists and hands. That establishes the proper height for your instrument.

If your upper legs are also approximately level and parallel to your forearms, that leaves enough space for a piano keyboard, steel guitar body, etc. I think it is okay for your knees to be a little lower than your hips, but probably not a good idea for them to be higher. That establishes both the height of your seat and how far your knee levers need to hang down.

In terms of horizontal position, if your forearms are comfortably crooked inward a little, your right hand should naturally be over your preferred picking position (just to the left of the 24th fret is typical), and that should leave your left hand toward the middle of the normal playing area on the neck (say nut to 15th fret). That should place your belly button somewhere between the 12th and 15th fret. Your left forearm (bar hand) moves inward easier than it moves outward, so most players turn their body a little to the left to compensate for that. So basically you are sitting toward the right end of the neck and turned slightly to the left. ShoBuds use to angle the left knee levers to account for that, but few modern brands seem to do that.

In terms of distance to the guitar, your shoulders are most comfortable if your upper arms aren't stretched out too far (except for Donny maybe). No lesser C6 authority than Jim Cohen says he likes the way you can see the pedals when you lean back slightly (or shift your butt back I guess) to play the inside neck. I don't think he means you should stare at your feet, but in the typical inside neck playing position, as you look at the fret board, you can sort of keep up with your feet out of the bottom of your eye. To me this means that a uni should have the knee levers and pedals situated so that the same thing occurs, which is one reason I don't like an arm rest on a uni. For E9 there is usually so little foot travel between pedals that you don't need to see them, even out of the bottom of your eye. So having E9 on the outside neck, even with an armrest inside, works fine for most people.

Those are my first impressions, and I ain't necessarily sticking to 'em.

[This message was edited by David Doggett on 12 October 2004 at 11:59 AM.]

James Cann · From: Phoenix, AZ

Tommy A,
One more L, and A for E.

Steve Knight · From: NC

Wow. Thank you for replies, everybody.

After 20 years of playing a 6-string guitar, a new teacher adjusted my posture & right hand technique & my tone improved dramatically in about 1 month. I went through a slew of guitars, amps, etc, before that. I guess the tone is in your hands if you've got the right technique.

Anyway, as a new steeler, I'm trying to do it right from the get-go on the psg.

Thanks again,

SK

Jennings Ward · From: Edgewater, Florida, R.I.P.

Question? Do youse guys has a favorite pair of brogans to ware whilst ues is playin????? jennings...........

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EMMONS D10 10-10 profex 2 deltafex ne1000 pv1000, pv 31 bd eq, +

Al Marcus · From: Cedar Springs,MI USA (deceased)

David Doggett, laid it out pretty well. For me on a S12 , no pad. I sit back a little , and as Jim Cohen, I like to peek at my 9 pedals once in awhile. But not very often.

Whatever is comfortable for you. I find if I am not comfortable with a new steel, I just don't play nice and easy.....al

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My Website..... www.cmedic.net/~almarcus/

David Doggett · Posted 13 Oct 2004 1:44 pm

Shoes have been discussed in past threads on the Forum. In general you need something without a sole that is too thick, and that is narrow enough to play one pedal at a time. Pointy toes tend to get stuck between the pedal rods. High heels can cause problems with the volume pedal and clearance of the right knee under the rear apron. For me the left shoe must fit snugly across the ball of my foot, so that the shoe follows my foot as I rock the AB pedals. For all these reasons, a lot of players prefer sneakers, walking shoes, moccasins, or well fitting loafers. One of the best shoes I have found is a pair of sneakers with velcro closures. That way I can easily close the left shoe tight for playing, and then release it for comfort the rest of the time (those bunions, you know).

Tommy Allison · From: Transfer, Pennsylvania, USA

Hey James,thanks for the spell check.

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