| Author |
Topic: Pro vs Pro |
Richard Gonzales
From:
Davidson, NC USA
|
Posted 25 Nov 2003 6:20 pm |
|
Most sport professionals have statistics that indicate who is the best.
What criteria do you use to rate the steel guitarist pro?? |
|
|
 |
Eric West
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA, R.I.P.
|
Posted 25 Nov 2003 6:41 pm
|
|
Which one I like the most overall.
EJL |
|
|
|
Terry Edwards
From:
Florida... livin' on spongecake...
|
Posted 25 Nov 2003 6:45 pm
|
|
How many wives he went through learning to play the steel.
Terry |
|
|
|
Bobby Lee
From:
Cloverdale, California, USA
|
Posted 26 Nov 2003 2:25 pm
|
|
Music is not a sport. What I like and dislike are very subjective, and my preferences change over time.
When I started playing, I met some people who "idolized" Jerry Byrd. I heard some of his records and thought "he's not so great". Then I bought an LP by "The Paradise Island Trio" and fell in love with the steel parts. I wrote Tom Bradshaw and asked him if he knew who the steel player was. He responded that it was Jerry Byrd.
Suddenly I became a BIG Jerry Byrd fan. The lesson: don't let other people's opinions cloud your evaluation. Listen to the music, not the hype.
Back to the topic: I find it astonishing that we can make real music on these contraptions. Anyone who can play in tune and in time gets a high rating in my book. When people are playing better than I can play, I have no criteria for judging one better than another. I just try to learn from what I hear, and hope that some of what they do rubs off on me.
------------------
 Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9),
Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax |
|
|
|
Bob Carlson
From:
Surprise AZ.
|
Posted 26 Nov 2003 3:25 pm
|
|
I sometimes wish I was a person that liked all kinds of music. But I don't. I like country music and I like for the steel to sound country.
Jerry Byrd and little Roy. Then came the pedals and Lloyd Green, Jimmy Day and Buddy Emmons. Lot of others also but the sound of Emmons is a very nice sound that just makes me happy.
I just happen to have had Ray Price "Time" CD playing in the CD on the computer when I first turned it on and you know who plays on that. It,s playing "No One But You" right now.
Bob |
|
|
|
Chris Morano
From:
Rowe, Massachusetts, USA
|
Posted 26 Nov 2003 4:59 pm
|
|
| I had a guitar teacher 20 years ago who responded to a similar question. He said "Don't kill your dog and dissect him to find out why he was such a good friend." |
|
|
|
Dave Van Allen
From:
Doylestown, PA , US , Earth
|
Posted 26 Nov 2003 6:52 pm
|
|
“It’s just music. It’s playing clean and looking for the pretty notes.” Charlie Parker
"If it sounds good, it is good." Duke Ellington |
|
|
|
Tony Dingus
From:
Kingsport, Tennessee, USA
|
Posted 26 Nov 2003 8:22 pm
|
|
For me, it was as I got older I appreciated
players that I didn't when I was a teen ager.
All I was interested in then was someone burning the walls down. Now, it's tone and and feeling. When I hear someone play with that be it fast or slow it makes my hair stand and chill bumps run up and down my back.
Tony |
|
|
|
Walter Stettner
From:
Vienna, Austria
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 4:05 am
|
|
It's all a matter of taste and personal likes. You probably didn't like beans years ago, but now, all of a sudden, you start to like them.
Same thing with music!!!
------------------
|
|
|
|
Perry Hansen
From:
Bismarck, N.D.
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 5:53 am
|
|
| b0b: I agree with you. A very good friend and exellent Lead guitar player, Bill Pence, told me years ago to pay attention to the beginner also. You might learn something. It works. |
|
|
|
Richard Gonzales
From:
Davidson, NC USA
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 5:57 am
|
|
Great inputs !
The reason I asked the question is, attending steel guitar shows I hear some no names that sound as good as the top pros. Maybe the pros who would make the top 20 list can play any genre and sound excellent. The other players that sound great at the shows might be very selective in what they play.
|
|
|
|
Perry Hansen
From:
Bismarck, N.D.
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 6:13 am
|
|
| Richard: I practaced with a man in Fairbanks Ak in 1972, I was with Paul Harper at the time. The mans name is Ed Hunicut. He was another Curly Chalker. But he would not play in public. He was always willing to help me, though. You never know who might be watchin and listening. |
|
|
|
Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 6:24 am
|
|
I've often wondered what it would be like if musicians had to play under the same public scrutiny as sports figures, with every move cataloged, statisticized, and spat back at you over and over. Imagine your next gig having an announcer with the following voice-over:
"It's almost time for Cohen's solo... do you think he'll make it, Ray?
I'm not sure, Joe. Last time, he choked on the intro, and that wasn't a particularly hard move. This solo's gonna be at a much faster tempo, and he hasn't been hitting the strings as accurately as we've seen over recent gigs.
That's true, Ray. But that drummer's not helping much is he? Why, I haven't seen so much rushing since last Monday night's Green Bay Packers' game!
Well, here comes the moment of truth. The guitarist is just finishing a really nice modal solo and if Cohen uses a lot of those hackneyed A-B licks like he did on the last two tunes, it's not gonna win him any points... Here it comes... and... and...
"OK, he's starting off nice and easy, starting out of key but working his way back into the key center. The band is keeping up a pretty good groove. I think he's feeling pretty good! He did it again! Started the solo on the flat 9. Nobody expected that move, Ray.
What's this? He's switching necks? In the middle of a solo? Only Jernigan does that!
Or Emmons.
Yeah, or Emmons. The band is following him over to the E9 side, they're doin' alright, Joe, but.. WAIT! He's gonna, he's gonna... Oh NOOO! He kicked in one of those awful, hackneyed A-B pedal licks and now EVERYone's groaning! It's incredible! The ENTIRE AUDIENCE is starting to Booo! Cohen looks undeterred. He's doing it again, just cuz he's mad.
I'll say he's mad, Joe!
What a night this is, Ray! Cohen is absolutely defying the audience and all critical judgment, now standing up, literally JUMPING UP AND DOWN on those split pedals and going wiiiiild! I've never seen anything like it, Ray.
Except Emmons, Joe.
Yeah, except Emmons.
We'll be right back after this word from our sponsor, Jagwire strings: the cat's outta the bag!
(fade to black)
|
|
|
|
Richard Gonzales
From:
Davidson, NC USA
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 7:35 am
|
|
| Great work Jim!!Very original, that would separate the men from the boys! |
|
|
|
Bill Llewellyn
From:
San Jose, CA
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 8:12 am
|
|
Richard, he still has a long way to go. He hasn't played with his teeth yet, or from the front of the guitar, or holding it over his head. (Just try that with my heavy ol' MSA!) Hopefully he won't go the way of Pete Townsend and finish off both PSG and amplifier. But then, I'm sure he'd make history if he did.
------------------
Bill, steelin' since '99 | Steel page | My music | Steelers' birthdays | Over 50?
|
|
|
|
Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 8:33 am
|
|
| Quote: |
| what it would be like if musicians had to play under the same public scrutiny as sports figures |
PDQ Bach did this years ago (you must imagine the 1st movement of the Beethoven 5th in the background here) :
New Horizons in Music Apprecitation: Beethoven's 5th Symphony
And now it's time for New horizons in music appreciation. Different approaches to the problem of popularizing the 19th century classics. Now unlike the baroque master works, 19th century pieces such as the Beethoven Symphonies are usually so long and melodramatic that the average listener has to be informed through the use of program notes as to what's going on in order to prevent him falling into a confused slumber. The only trouble is that they always turn the lights down in concert halls so that you can't read the notes while the piece is being played so here is a new solution to a perennial problem.
PS:Good evening music fans. Here we are at Philharmonic Hall in New York Mills Minnesotta. It's a beautiful night for a concert. There's not a cloud in the ceiling and there's quite a crowd out here. About How many do you think there are Bob?
Bob: Oh, I don't know Pete.
PS: Well, neither do I but it's quite a crowd and I think they're looking forward to hearing the New York Mills Philharmonic playing against the Danish conductor Heile Gedankesan and here he comes now ascending the podium and the players are all lined and ready to begin the first innings of Beethoven's Symphony number 5 in C minor.
And they're off with the four note theme. This is very exciting, the beginning of a symphony is always exciting folks. I don't know whether it's slow or fast yet because it keeps stopping. It doesn't seem to be able to get off the ground yet and it looks like, yes it looks like we're coming up to a cadence here folks. Oh the violins didn't cut off there. They weren't watching and there's that four note theme again folks and another stop. Just can't seem to get this piece off the ground. Now it seems to be rolling a little bit, seems to be building up. Tell me Bob do you think you'd call that four note idea a theme or a motif?
Bob: Well Pete the technical term would be a motif that he uses to build a theme.
PS: I see, thanks for setting me straight about that Bob. Well we're heading into the second theme section here. We can expect a little modulation down there. Wow did you hear that Bob? Somebody down there in the horn section really flubbed that note. That was one of the worst fumbles I think I've ever witnessed in all my days. I think it was number one, wasn't it Bob?
Bob: Yes it was Pete. That was Bobby Cornwall in the first chair and that's the third major flub he's made this season giving him a solo average for the season of approximately point 247355 which is pretty darn low for a first chair man.
PS: Do you think there's some chance he might be sold to another orchestra?
BD: Well it's hard to say Pete. Cornwall's very good in the long solos. Things like the Rachmaninoff pie-aner concerto so I think if he pulls himself together a bit they'll probably keep him around although I suppose...
PS: Well I think it's development time down there now Bob, let's see what's going to happen. The horns are starting it off. They seem to be in pretty good shape now and I get the feeling that we're probably going to be hearing a lot of that four note motif, don't you Bob?
BD: Yes, I do Pete.
PS: So do I Bob. Well they obviously are stuck with that 4 note motif and are going to be fooling around with for quite a while. You notice it's pretty hot in here, Bob?
BD: Yes I do Pete.
PS: Yeah I think the air conditioning is gone off which is just one of the things...Wait a minute, wait a minute there's something going on down there on the stage, folks. There's something happening down there. It's really building up tension. The crowd is getting very excited. The brasses have come in and the timpani and everybody and it's extremely exciting. It think we're building up to a fugue. No the bases are not picking up the theme, folks. It is not a fugue. the violins try to make it one but the basses are not following on. No instead of a fugue folks, he seems to be taking the theme and breaking it up into little pieces. Just 2 notes left of that theme now being thrown around form player to player and it's getting softer and softer down there folks. I think they're losing steam. They seem to be running out of steam and it's just getting a little bit lethargic down there if you want to know the truth. It's gotten down to one note now and things are...Wait a minute, the brasses have come in and tried to pep things up. A welcome relief but I'm afraid to no avail. Things are still pretty soporific...Wait a minute. here they come again. They're really determined. It sounds very familiar and I think we've reached a recap Bob, don't you?
BD: No doubt about it Pete. Your average Beethoven symphony usually has a recap right after the 2nd quarter and this one is falling right into line
PS: Well let's see if those violins can cut off with the rest of the orchestra and the cadence that's coming up...Wait a minute, this time it's the oboe holding the note too long. He's playing a cadenza. He must be out of his mind. He thinks it's an oboe concerto. The conductor's standing down there. He doesn't know what to do. Have you ever heard anything like that Bob?
BD: I certainly haven't Pete. I think it was a disgraceful display of lack of teamsmanship and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Heywood's name wasn't on the roster next season although I must say that the fans really seem to go for these outbursts of temperament
PS: Well I always say Bob professional music teams wouldn't exist without the spectators. Anyway we're into the home stretch here with the 2nd theme coming up and we should be in C minor right up to the double bar Wait a minute that's really something Bob, the piece is billed as being in C minor and yet it looks like it's gonna end in C major.
BD: That's really something Pete
PS: Well I think it's something that the Composers Commission oughta look into and I suspect that they will as soon as this gets out but it looks like it's gonna be an ending anyway. Things are building up a little there, the violins have really gotten hold of things, they're really beginning to roll and he's adding all the woodwinds there. He's thrown in all his brass and the timpani and it's tutti all the way folks. He's got a great piece on his hands here and he looks like he's really coming into the home stretch. Well I guess that about wraps it up hey Bob?
BD:Yeah Pete. It's been a good piece
PS:I think he can really have something to be proud of himself there...Wait a minute the brasses have taken the theme and they're not letting it stop. They're taking the theme and running ahead Bob. This piece is definitely going to go into overtime. I can see that the crowd is going wild, they're standing up on their feet, they're jumping, they're stomping, they're yelling and let me tell you that out on that stage the players are doing a bit of running around themselves. Nobody but nobody knows where the theme is. The audience nor the players, nobody knows where the theme is. Everybody is running around and believe me it's very exciting. This is the kind of thing that only happens once in ten years folks they've got a new theme going on down there I can't believe it Bob. Do you know where this new theme comes from?
BD: Well Pete it probably comes from...No I don't Pete
PS: Well they're tossing it around now the woodwinds have it and then the strings have it. Nobody seems to be able to keep his hands on that theme. It's getting tossed around from player to player, from section to section and believe me folks the audience is just as confused as the players as to who is going to have that theme finally...Wait a minute the strings have got a hold of it. The strings have got a hold of that theme and they are not going to let go...What's this. I can't believe my ears. It sounds as if it's another recap. It sounds as if he's going right back to the beginning. If this is true it's the first time it's happened in ten years of concert casting...Wait wait a minute those sound like final chords though this may be...that may be it folks. I'm looking down at the referee. Yes yes that is it. That is the end of the piece the players are taking off their helmets and the conductor has turned around and is acknowldeging the cheers of the crowd. Well it was quite a symphony wasn't it Bob?
BD: It was quite a symphony Pete and I think that the fans feel that they got their moneys worth
PS: So do I Bob and I don't think there's any doubt about who won this contest either as a matter of fact I wouldn't be surprised if the critics slap a stiff penalty on some of the players, particularly Bobby Corno
BD: Neither would I Pete and of course this was a very important victory for Heile Gedankesan since it puts him right up there at the top of the Conductors league
PS: That's right Bob that means that he'll be up a gainst the Fargo Moorhead Symphony in the World 12-tone series next month and let's see they not only lead the Orchestral League but I think they're unbeaten this season, aren't they Bob?
BD: You said it Pete and if Dankesan can win 4 concerts of them he'll be the first conductor to earn the pennant since Toscanini
PS: That's quite a challenge Bob. Now I think I'd better be heading down to the locker rooms to have a chat with Dankesan himself
BD: Well Pete I think he was supposed to be doing a baton commercial after the concert but why don't you give it a try
PS: I'll do that Bob. Well for now this is Pete Schickele...
BD:...and Bob Dennis...
PS:...signing off for the Wonderful Wide World of Notes
|
|
|
|
Gene Jones
From:
Oklahoma City, OK USA, (deceased)
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 8:43 am
|
|
|
|
|
|
Bob Carlson
From:
Surprise AZ.
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 9:13 am
|
|
Jim Cohen...I don't care what the rest of these people say about you, you're alright.
Bob |
|
|
|
Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 1:54 pm
|
|
I have a saying..."Everyone does what they do", and that about sums it up. No one is good at everything, and no one can "do it all". Some guys are great soloists, and some are great back-up players. Some are good at country, some at pop, and some at rock stuff. Some play smooth and sweet, and some sharp and staccato. Some play blistering single-note scales and runs, some are great at fast chords. Some players know every chord in the book, and others can make just a few chords sound so much better. Some are real nice guys, and some are just attitudes with picks. Some know music theory, and others know almost nothing...but still play some nice stuff. Some have good imaginations, and some can't play anything original. Some are great technicians, and some can only tune the thing, and rely on others for mods.
So, who's really "best"?
It depends on what you're talking about. Every one of us is in there, somewhere. |
|
|
|
Damir Besic
From:
Nashville,TN.
|
Posted 27 Nov 2003 5:13 pm
|
|
Jim Cohen just got offer to change teams and come to Nashville,he got offered $5.000.000.00 to play with the local band "The Titans" with Eddie George on bass...
wouldn`t that be nice???
------------------
 |
|
|
|
