Some questions on playing in stereo

Richard Tipple · From: Ohio, USA

I saw a guy last night who said he was set up to play stereo. I asked him about his set up & heres what he said.
He runs his steel into a Profex 2 then into a stereo power amp, out one side of the amp to the right speaker & out the other side to the left speaker. He uses the 3 band Eq , revurb & delay.
I told him this really wasnt playing in stereo at all but simply using two speakers with one power source.
Later I was thinking to myself if he had used the splitter effects on the Profex 2 & assigned different effects to each side,, example, chorus to side A & reverb to side B, this still really wouldnt be a true stereo effect to my way of thinking.
When I got home I read through the Profex 2 operators manual, especialy the Stereo Effects (ST) effect. Also the PN1 & PN2 effects talk some of a stereo effect.
I find myself wondering how would one set the Profex up to play in true stereo after all. Can the Profex or say a Tubefex produce a true stereo output ? Maybe some of you who play a stereo set up can set me straight....

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

First, you have to define what "true stereo" is. Identical sound coming from multiple speakers just isn't true stereo. In order to get the proper effect, the signals must be of different phases or harmonic content. The only way to get stereo from a single pickup is to split the signal and route one of the signls through a delay or a phase shifter.

At best, it's a gimmick, sounding good to the performer and those nearby, and progressively ineffectual as the distance from the speakers increases and the wavefronts finally merge.

Jack Stoner · From: Kansas City, MO

When I was using a Peavey Transtube Fex (the next generation Profex II), I had the delay and reverb set differently for each channel. That tended to give more of a "stereo" sound. But, true it's not really "stereo", just two channels but "stereo" is used commonly to denote two channel sound.

Bob Snelgrove · From: san jose, ca

If you are using stereo delays, choruses, and/or reverbs, you are playing in stereo.

bob

Brad Sarno · From: St. Louis, MO USA

Yea, what Bob said. Especially with reverb. Stereo reverb is stereo because the left and right reverberations are not coherent with eachother. They're not exactly the same. That means that there is some randomness to each side's reverb process which gives a wide, stereo sound. Even if the source is mono, as soon as a true stereo reverb is introduced into the mix, it becomes stereo. Simple delay is less often a stereo thing unless there is some left/right panning to the consecutive echoes, ping-ponging. Or in some more complex delay setups, you can have different, discretely timed delays on both the left and right channels. That would be true stereo delay. Traditional stereo chorus leaves one side unaffected and the other channel is slightly delayed and pitch modulated. I don't care much for chorus on steel, but I do like a hair of delay and a nice reverb. If I were running stereo, I'd probably keep the delay in mono and then get some width with a stereo 'verb. The popular setting #7 on a Boss RV-3 is just this, mono delay into a stereo reverb.

Left/Right coherence is the central issue with mono vs. stereo.

Brad

Miguel e Smith · From: Phoenix, AZ

Richard, although I've resorted to a single amp setup recently (taking a break from carrying soooo much gear...I also play keys), I love the feeling of playing the way you're talking about. Donny is right about it not making much difference by the time the audience gets it (unless the house is run stereo which is not common) but I sure have spent many hours live and in the studio being inspired by the effect. I don't use a Profex but have used two primary systems for many years now...either an Evans pre with an efx unit thru the loop in/out and then into power amp/speakers or most recently a two Steel King setup with an efx in the loop (and the other side of the efx unit (right side) run to the loop input of the 2nd King).

I'm working on getting an intern or an all-out roadie soon and going back to the stereo setup on stage. With respect to opinions, I don't agree with the term "gimmick" at all...if it sounds good, it sounds good. With my own band, we do run the house PA in stereo so the audience gets the same thing I do. In the studio, my preference is stereo.

Mike

Bob Martin · From: Madison Tn

About the simplest way I can put it is that anytime we hook up two amps to an instrument it will be perceived by our ears as a stereo signal.

Just the nature of our ears being set on each side of our head makes it sound like two different signals due to the fact that both ears will never hear the same exact sound due to many different conditions but mainly our ears having different degrees of diminished capacity for hearing.

That being said no two amps will ever send out the same signal and then if we run a stereo effects unit in line it will then color each separate signal differently so there is even a greater degree of stereo separation.

Now there are a lot of discussions as to whether this effect is true stereo or just two mono signals split to be made pseudo-stereo. Or some would even say that this type of setup is binaural. I'll just leave you with Webster's definition of stereo and you can then come to your own conclusion :-)

Stereo sound is constituting sound reproduction involving the use of separated microphones and two transmission channels to achieve the sound separation of a live hearing

[This message was edited by Big Bob Martin on 19 September 2005 at 05:17 AM.]

Mark van Allen · From: Watkinsville, Ga. USA

I used that exact setup (ProfexII into Mosvalve Stereo Power Amp) for several years, and many of the available effects ARE definitely true stereo. (In the sense that the signals are a different phase or coherency for ecah side- there are also many patches where the length of delay and feedback are different for each side.) Most of the Newman presets use stereo reverb and delay, and the choruses are also stereo. It's debateable about the sound getting out to the audience in a club situation, but it does thicken and broaden your stage sound, and as Mike says, it's quite inspiring to sit in a wash of steel. When I toured with Blueground Undergrass the sound crew always ran a stereo house PA, miking both of my cabinets, and the steel was full and thick in the mains. Our "Live at the Variety Playhouse" CD has the steel mixed just as it was miked, panned hard left and right, and the delays and effects are very noticeably stereo, and very effective. On the weight end, I've gone to a full Walker setup, and it's very light and easy to schlep. Best sound I've ever heard for steel.

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Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com

[This message was edited by Mark van Allen on 19 September 2005 at 08:26 AM.]

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