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Topic: Keith Hilton Volume Pedal |
Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 10 Mar 2003 6:41 pm |
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I've been playing a Keith Hilton pedal for a week now. I just got tired of futzing around with pots that get scratchy within a couple of months... or less... after installation.
What a great pedal! I never knew my guitar sounded like that! Complete clarity. I haven't opened the pedal up and wouldn't know what I was looking at if I did, but I've been told there's some serious audiophile components in there in a great design. From the way it operates, I believe it.
They're a costly little item, no doubt... around $270. But if you've got the bucks to spend, I think the pedal is worth the expense, without a doubt.
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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association
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David L. Donald
From:
Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 1:49 am
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| I have heard NOTHING but praise for this pedal. Nice to hear another respected voice added to the chorus. I hope Keith sees my posted ideas for a next generation of this fine pedal. |
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Paul Brainard
From:
Portland OR
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 2:46 am
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| From everything I've heard, I'm very anxious to try one of Mr. Hilton's pedals. But I have one concern, which is that I've always kind of preferred NOT having my steel's signal buffered by an impedance-matching preamp - I tend to think that the tonal variation across the travel of a pedal is part of the character of the instrument and adds more expression to it. Of course, once I get ahold of one I may change my mind. . . but in the interest of trying everything, does anyone have any recommendations for light-beam type volume pedals that do not have this kind of circuitry built in? Probably an older one, I imagine (I do have a Goodrich tone-wheel model but don't like the taper) or maybe this is inseparable from the electronics that control the volume? Are there any where it could be bypassed? |
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David L. Donald
From:
Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 3:59 am
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I find the tonallity of the pedal is the pedals itself's and that it is CHANGING the instruments tone.
But if you like that effect then use it.
Impeadance matching means a minimum of loss anywhere and for me that's a positive.
I have suggested an multi adjustable taper feature to Keith, indirectly.[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 11 March 2003 at 04:00 AM.] |
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Gino Iorfida
From:
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 4:56 am
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| my ONLY complaint about the Hilton pedal, is that you NEVER see one for sale used!!! I've been eyeing the Buy/Sell area for some time looking for the 'deal of a lifetime' on a used one... no one seems to ever get rid of theirs-- they like them TOO much!!! ... and thanks to Keith building in such reliability, you don't hear of anyone carrying a spare either... |
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David L. Donald
From:
Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 6:05 am
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Probably the best buying argument around :
Never found used![This message was edited by David L. Donald on 11 March 2003 at 06:05 AM.] |
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Johan Jansen
From:
Europe
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 9:06 am
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Yes, and you can buy them in Europe also, at Venmans music! http://www.mp-venmans.nl/
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 Click on the pic!
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C Dixon
From:
Duluth, GA USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 11:25 am
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Buffering is never a factor in an impedance matching device. Buffering means something is being stored for later use. In any matching device, what goes in is instantly seen at its output. If this were not the case one would hear AND feel a delay from a picked string to the amps output.
To remove the mystery about "matching devices". They simply "match" a high impedance device such as a microphone or pickup, to a low impedance (or vice versa) delivery system such as a volume pedal and/or cable.
A matching device has one purpose. And that is to improve the "signal to noise" ratio. In layman's terms this means it prevents volume pedals, etc from "loading" down the signal from the Mic or PU; so that noise does not become a larger proportion of the signal. Noise of course is always present. Impossible to eliminate it entirely. But it needs to be kept as low as possible.
If we can keep the noise "floor" low enough, it is rarely heard, UNLESS the sound level is unbearably loud. This is achieved by "matching" the Mic or PU to any device; between them and the input to an amp.
When noise has been reduced to a bare minimum, human ears always perceive a more clear tone. This is not the case, but since sound is all perception anyway, a matching device achieves its purpose.
Also there is NO scientific proof that volume pedal and/or cable capacities have ANY "audible" effect on tone. The reason players feel that a pedal affects tone is due to a phenomenon in the human ear. IE, we do not hear lower and higher frequencies the same at different levels of sound. Actually the lows suffer much more than the highs at lower levels. ANY audiologist or audio engineer learns this as one of the basics in audio engineering.
This is why "loudness" controls are always put on high end stereo equipment. Because people loose high and low frequency perception as the volume level decreases.
ANY capacitive reactance* a volume pot might exhibit, would be sooooooo high at audo frequencies. that NO human would hear the effect. You can test this instantly by converting a pot's capacitive reactance to ohms. In a word, 100+ megohms across a 500K pot is for all practical purposes nil.
What is happening is this. As one decreases volume with the pedal, "the loudness" problem in human ears, is perceived as a tonal change; when there isn't a tonal change at all. So for all practical purposes, a volume pedal is a purely resistive device.
To blame the percieved tonal change on capacitive or inductive* reactance just does not bear scientific testing. Since these reactances are sooooo very very high (low in the case of unductive reactance) at audio frequencies. If we were talking about RF (radio frequencies) then that is horse of a different color.
But NOT at audio freguencies. 
carl
* Inductive reactance works just the reverse of capacitive reactance. IE, in the aforementioned scenarios, the capacitive reactance would be astronomically high and the inductive reactance would be astronomically low at (audio frequencies).
[This message was edited by C Dixon on 11 March 2003 at 11:37 AM.] |
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Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 3:21 pm
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I tried a Hilton Digital Sustain unit, and it had a huge effect on tone (similar to a BBE Sonic Maximizer in my mind).
I heard the the same circuitry is built into the Hilton Volume Pedal (including a tone adjustment).
If the volume pedal effects tone like the Digital Sustain unit, well no wonder everybody likes the sound of their steel going through it!
I'm sure I'll get one someday.
Anyone want to trade for a Peavey Profex II?
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Keith Hilton
From:
248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 5:13 pm
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| Herb thanks for all the kind words about my pedal. Also thanks to everyone else who has said nice things about my products. I feel very humble with the many famous players and bands using my products. It is all about sound quality and these top payers hear something they like. More than having a great product, I want to be a good person. |
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steve takacs
From:
beijing, china via pittsburgh (deceased)
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Posted 11 Mar 2003 6:53 pm
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| It works just great in China too with a stepdown transformer! Thanks, Keith. |
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Paul Brainard
From:
Portland OR
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Posted 12 Mar 2003 8:01 am
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Bufferring is a term I've heard electronics techs use for this - I think it's more along the lines of a buffer zone or bufferred aspirin than a computer buffer, e.g. something to soften or absorb the effect of one thing on another thing. Putting any battery powered effect pedal between your guitar and volume pedal will do this, whether it's engaged or not. But I'm sure Keith's Digital Sustain circuit does more than just match impedances, and it may well be that this part of the pedal is more responsible for the amazing sound that everyone reports than anything else.
Myself being a single-coil pickup/tube amp/spring reverb kind of guy, I'm always hesitant to put anything "digital" in my effects chain. I wish I knew more about exactly what this circuitry does! However, I agree that in the end what matters is what you hear (or think you hear) so I am certainly planning to try one out. |
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Chuck McGill
From:
An hour from Memphis and 2 from Nashville, R.I.P.
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Posted 12 Mar 2003 8:50 am
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| Just got my Hilton and couldn't be happier. |
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Brad Sarno
From:
St. Louis, MO USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2003 10:10 am
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To comment on the use of the term "buffer". This is common in audio and refers to the isolation or protection from one stage to another. Just like DC coupling capacitors are often called DC buffers as they protect the second stage from any DC present in the first stage. In the computer world it refers to storage of data to be used at a later stage, but in audio it refers to a protective layer, like Buffered aspirin creates layer to protect the stomach lining. The idea of buffering in a guitar situation is to "buffer" the pickup from the capacitive load of a volume pot driving a long cable. The pot isn't really a capacitive load but it will effect the impedance of the line, thus effecting how much the cable want's to act like a tone capacitor and remove high frequencies. With a buffer/preamp, the pickup only sees the input to the buffer and doesn't know or care what happens after that. This is how the tone can remain consistent in an active buffer preamp situation. With a passive setup, the pickup alone has to drive the entire cable which is a capacitive load and will reduce high frequencies as the cable length increases. This is clearly audible to anyone who's tried to play guitar into a 50' cable and then switch back to a 10' cable. Furthurmore, when a passive volume pot is turned down below full volume, the capacitive load of the cable becomes more of a high-frequency absorber. The frequency response of a passive volume pedal clearly becomes duller as you decrease the volume. This is what many people are used to. That's why they're startled when they hear a Goodrich Matchbox or a Hilton pedal, where the tone stays flat and clean all the way thru the volume pedal travel.
My $.02
Brad Sarno
Blue Jade Audio Mastering
St. Louis, MO |
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Brad Sarno
From:
St. Louis, MO USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2003 10:17 am
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And in response to Paul's comment about not liking anything digital in the signal chain. I'm 100% with you. You know I asked Keith why he named the unit "Digital Sustain" and really it's quite misleading. There is NOTHING digital about it. It's a completely analog audiophile preamp. There is absolutely no digital processing or conversion in there. The term digital gets used a little too loosely these days. So Paul, dont let the name scare you, it's really a very sweet sounding analog device.
Brad Sarno
Blue Jade Audio Mastering
St. Louis, MO |
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David L. Donald
From:
Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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Posted 12 Mar 2003 11:40 am
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| And a fine $.02 it is! |
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Tim Bridges
From:
Hoover, Alabama, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2003 12:48 pm
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| Playing PSG is alot like golf...if you lack raw tallent, buy technology. Well in golf, it helped drop a few strokes... in PSG, it's all about the sound. I just recieved my new Hilton pedal and it definitely helped my sound. Keith, if you do make the next generation pedal, pleasew wait at least a year...I'm runnin' low on cash between my golf game and PSG. Oh, I forgot about the boat and fishing...you can buy a few more fish too. Thanks Keith! |
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Larry Behm
From:
Mt Angel, Or 97362
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Posted 13 Mar 2003 5:10 am
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Paul come to my house again and we can plug my Hilton into your stuff. You can not take it with you for any price.
Herb, good morning now that you are amoung the living, with the Hilton Pedal that is.
Larry Behm
503-722-7562 |
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Paul Brainard
From:
Portland OR
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Posted 13 Mar 2003 7:03 am
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| Larry, I will - thanks! There doesn't seem to be a dealer in town. . . |
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SteveTodd
From:
Manchester, CT, USA
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Posted 13 Mar 2003 8:12 am
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| I ordered my pedal from Keith last week. Can't wait to get it and try it out ! |
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Wayne Morgan
From:
Rutledge, TN, USA
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Posted 13 Mar 2003 4:43 pm
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Hey Herb, where can I buy one for $270.00 ?
Some people want $289.00 for them, I like the $270.00 better.
Thanks
Wayne
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Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
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Posted 13 Mar 2003 4:55 pm
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'Spoke to Keith today and ordered a Hilton Pedal!
Check is in the mail... as they say!
Anyone using one in a Steel > Hilton > Boss RV-3 > 2 amps, configuration?
Any tweaks needed following your field testing of this system?
Thx,
~pb
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Buck Grantham R.I.P.
From:
Denham Springs, LA. USA
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Posted 14 Mar 2003 1:15 pm
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| I never leave the house without mine. It is the best. |
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Brandin
From:
Newport Beach CA. USA
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Posted 15 Mar 2003 10:43 am
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I barrowed one for my gig last night. I liked
it! I REALLY LIKED IT!!
GB |
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Rick Ulrich
From:
Gilbert, Arizona
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Posted 15 Mar 2003 4:00 pm
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| Can you buy them direct or only from dealers? |
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