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Topic: Does anyone make a keyless lap steel? |
Don McClellan
From:
California/Thailand
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Posted 7 Nov 2003 9:08 pm |
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| I'd like to build a keyless lap steel but I must find a keyless system for sale first. (10 string) thanks |
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Bobby Lee
From:
Cloverdale, California, USA
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Ron Victoria
From:
New Jersey, USA
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Posted 8 Nov 2003 7:47 am
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| Excuse my ignorance, but what does keyless mean? |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 8 Nov 2003 9:47 am
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No tuning keys of the type commonly found on guitars. If you click on "links' above and find the GFI website, you will see what Don is talking about.
Don, how are you? Why keyless on a lap steel? |
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Roy Thomson
From:
Wolfville, Nova Scotia,Canada
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Jeff Strouse
From:
Jacksonville, Florida, USA
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Posted 8 Nov 2003 11:24 am
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Interesting info on the GFI website. Without pedals though, and since you need a tool, how quickly and easily can strings on a keyless tuner be re-tuned? Is it possible for non-pedal players to quickly re-tune a couple of strings between songs to get a different tuning?
I like the part about better sustain and tone, and it would definitely make for a shorter overall guitar. I wonder if it would be enough to make a short scale neck sound like a long scale (with regard to harmonics and stuff)?
[This message was edited by Jeff Strouse on 08 November 2003 at 12:35 PM.] |
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Don McClellan
From:
California/Thailand
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Posted 8 Nov 2003 2:24 pm
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Hi Richard. I'm fine, thanks. How are you? Long time no see. I'm not really making a lap steel. I'm going to help paint a house for a guy who makes resonator guitars and he has offered to make a 10 string, square neck, reso for me. But I don't want keys on it . So I thought I'd look around and see if anyone makes something like what Joe Kline made. Maybe I should contact Joe(?) Anyway, that's the story.
I have fallen in love with non-pedal steel and resonator guitar playing. And I think I have a good 10 string, C6th/A7th tuning in mind for myself. Don |
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HowardR
From:
N.Y.C.-Fire Island-Asheville
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Posted 8 Nov 2003 3:19 pm
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| Would you kindly post that tuning for us? |
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Don McClellan
From:
California/Thailand
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Posted 8 Nov 2003 6:34 pm
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The 10 string tuning I intend to try out will be an extended version of a C6th/A7th (from top to bottom) D B E C A G E C# C Eb. The 2nd string (B) is 1/2 step lower than the 4th string (C), and the 10th string (Eb) will be 1/2 step lower than the 7th string (E). I play Hawaiian, blues, rock, country and a little swing. No bluegrass. (not because I don't like bluegrass but because I've never tried it)
I'm wide open to suggestions about this 10 string thang. Please help. Thanks. Don |
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Jeff Strouse
From:
Jacksonville, Florida, USA
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Posted 8 Nov 2003 8:16 pm
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| A while back, I recall seeing (perhaps on Ebay?) a T-8 "Westwind" non-pedal that was keyless. It was a beautiful guitar, but I don't know anything about the maker, though. |
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Al Terhune
From:
Newcastle, WA
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Posted 8 Nov 2003 11:12 pm
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Jeff,
With keyless tuning (at least Gene Field's GFI guitars), you only need a phillips screw driver when you change strings, not re-tune them. And even then, I think it's faster to change a string with a keyless, because there's no winding -- you loosen the screw, pull it around once, tighten the screw, then turn the dial to bring it up to pitch. Presto. To re-tune a string, you merely need to turn the dial* in either direction, and the sensitivity is much better than a keyed tuning. Much better. I personally see no debate between keyed and keyless tuning.
*When I say "dial," each string has a "knob" that turns like a volume knob. It's priceless.
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John Bechtel
From:
Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.
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HowardR
From:
N.Y.C.-Fire Island-Asheville
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Posted 9 Nov 2003 5:38 am
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Jeff, I purchased the Westwind about 3 years ago from a member of the forum. It is a keyless T-9 and was built by Roy Thomas of Pedalmaster in Louisiana. Each neck has two pick ups with blend control. It really is some guitar.
Both Roy Thomas and Lamar Colvin have small keyless tuners that work very well.
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Don McClellan
From:
California/Thailand
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Posted 9 Nov 2003 9:10 am
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John B, My 10th string is the one string I'm unsure about. I know that an A string is what many guys would put there and maybe I'll end up with an A down there.
thanks HowardR, I'll be talking to those folks and I'll certainly keep y'all posted. Don |
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Mark van Allen
From:
Watkinsville, Ga. USA
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Posted 9 Nov 2003 10:45 am
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Don, I've been looking for the ads for the Bela keyless tuners I've seen, designed to replace traditional key heads , to sedn to you, but I can't seem to find one. Then I noticed your mention of putting it on an acoustic reso. I don't know if they'd be small enough for that, you'd need a pretty small unit to fit on an acoustic neck I think.
------------------
Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com
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Don McClellan
From:
California/Thailand
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Posted 9 Nov 2003 11:20 am
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| I 've been talking today with a man named Joe Delaronde who makes keyless tuning systems in Canada(?) and he has sent several pics to me. The tuning systems are small and beautiful. He said the one in the pics he sent was made to fit on a 1 3/4 inch thick wood frame. I see no reason why the end of the neck of a reso can't be made to accommodate that. Or am I wrong? Thanks, Don |
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HowardR
From:
N.Y.C.-Fire Island-Asheville
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Posted 9 Nov 2003 6:35 pm
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This may deserve some consideration:
While it may not be difficult (or it may be easier) to change strings on a keyless pedal steel or non pedal steel that has legs and is stationery, it may be difficult with a resonator that sits on your lap.[This message was edited by HowardR on 10 November 2003 at 08:14 AM.] |
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Don McClellan
From:
California/Thailand
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Posted 9 Nov 2003 10:05 pm
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That's a good point. I hadn't considered that at all. Now that I do though, I doubt that it will be much of a problem if any. But I'm not sure.
Please allow me to give my 1 1/2 cents about wether or not its really any easier to change strings on a keyless guitar aside from the other advantages. Its like comparing indoor plumbing to an outhouse. anyhoo.. |
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Zayit
From:
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted 10 Nov 2003 10:16 am
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Hi Don, Since you mentioned Joe Delaronde & his keyless tuning system, I figured I'd share a link to some 'pix': http://www.skobrien.com/sshawaiian/Photos/delaronde/photos.htm
Joe is a beautiful, sweet, HUMBLE genius of a man. He builds his own steel guitars & plays 'em pretty well too- especially those swing standards.  |
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Don McClellan
From:
California/Thailand
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Posted 10 Nov 2003 12:20 pm
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| Zayit, Thanks for posting these pictures. They are wonderful and I'm quickly finding out that what you said about Joe Delaronde is true. He is a very nice guy and his keyless tuning system looks perfect for my project. Thanks, Don |
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C. Brattain
From:
Balch Springs, Texas, usa
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Posted 10 Nov 2003 4:37 pm
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| Magnatone made a keyless lap steel in the 1950's, they called the Stay Tune. I think Paul Barth designed it and you tuned it with a allen ranch. We sold alot of them when I worked at the Santa Ana House of Music. Chuck |
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Joe Delaronde
From:
Selkirk, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted 10 Nov 2003 5:17 pm
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Zayit.....You're too kind.
Don...The Link II, has a nut height of 1 3/8".
I designed a keyless tuner for these steels which is very easy to install.
- You simple remove the keyheads and nut.
- Place the keyless unit in its proper position. (There are 5 mounting holes on the underside of the unit. Pointed studs are temporarilly screwed in and are used as locators.) Next press down on the keyless unit. This leaves indents where you drill the mounting holes.
- Drill the 5 holes and mount the unit.
This unit also has the pre-tuner device.
The keyless unites can be purchased from the Linkon Steel Guitar Co. Anyone wants pics email me.
So, on the Reso, the neck stock plus the nut height would have to be no less than 1 3/8".
The unit could be customized to mount on the end of the neck stock.
Makes for a very interesting project.
Joe |
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HowardR
From:
N.Y.C.-Fire Island-Asheville
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Posted 10 Nov 2003 6:49 pm
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| and from what I can see, once you attach the string, the tuning adjustment is made by hand. you don't need a hex wrench, correct? |
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Joe Delaronde
From:
Selkirk, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted 10 Nov 2003 8:21 pm
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Howard
If you are refering to my last post, an allen type wrench is needed to tune the strings. No room for finger knobs on such a small unit.
Joe |
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Roy Thomson
From:
Wolfville, Nova Scotia,Canada
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Posted 10 Nov 2003 8:41 pm
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Hi Joe,
Do you make bell cranks and square cross shafts too?
I want to replace the plastic ones on a Little Buddy and also round cross shafts.
I could send these old parts for guide
purposes?
If you don't what about Wayne?
Roy |
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