Describing a tuning

John Kavanagh · From: Kentville, Nova Scotia, Canada * R.I.P.

Rather than hijack another thread I thought I'd start a new one.

What's the standard, least ambiguous way to describe a tuning?

Even though the first string is the highest string, I always go low to high when listing the strings. This is the standard "scholarly" way to do it, if anyone cares; in all the books I've read about stringed instruments, they ALWAYS describe the violin as gd'a'e" and the guitar as EAdgbe'

Which brings me to another notion - sometimes it's even unclear which octave a string is at, especially in a re-entrant tuning. (It doesn't help that guitar, and sometimes steel guitar, is written an octave lower than it sounds.) This puzzled me when I first read about "chromatic" E9th tuning, and there's the lap steel ones with a high string in the lowest position.

There's two common ways to specify octaves. There's the old way where c is middle c and c' is the octave above it. The octave break is at c, so the b below middle c is B.

Here's the octaves (as they sound) from the low note of 10-string C6th (the same as the lowest note on a cello, two leger lines below the bass clef if written at sounding pitch):

C,D,E,F,G,A,B,CDEFGABcdefgabc'd'e'f'g'a'b'c"d"e"f"g"a"b"c'"d'"e'"f'"g'"a'"b'"c""d""...

And so on. The lowest note (at pitch) of a 5-string bass would be B,,,, written as two leger lines below the bass clef but sounding an octave lower.

The other method is the midi one, which is becoming standard for some purposes. In this the lowest note is C0 and the highest is C10. I think middle c is C5, and the break is still between b and c.

I don't really expect there'll ever be any kind of concensus about this, but I thought I'd throw it out. Opinions?

Ray Montee · From: Portland, Oregon (deceased)

Impressive post.

A lot of younger folks also tune their steel from the bottom up.

Any number will disagree with me, however if everyone tunes from the top E down, the one that reverses this strategy most likely will end up SHARP on the top string and frequently those below it as well.

For those who care, this creates needless problems.

I realize today's music is described differently than in the olden days and tuned and played differently as well.

No arguments please. Just a point of view from practical experience during the past 50 years.

Jeff Au Hoy · From: Honolulu, Hawai'i

basilh · From: United Kingdom

Here on the forum it has always been accepted that one can put forward ones own personal opinions, but, whilst the post has merit in the depth of information gathered and gleaned from so many informed sources, In the REAL world of full time pro players, It has always been from the first string down for the very reasons that Ray stated.

Also, as the different tunings developed to encompass major and minor chords with all possible top notes, and the original three were E, A and C based,ALL with E top notes, it makes more sense to describe their differences in an orderly way... from the root,(E) fifth (E)or third(E) DOWNWARDS.
Then the relationship will be more clearly understood.
Baz
Onipa'a www.waikiki-islanders.com

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Dave Boothroyd · From: Staffordshire Moorlands

Synth and keyboard players and anyone who uses Midi has just about abandoned c''' etc for the General Midi number system.
Middle C is C3, the lowest available Midi note is C-2 which is below audio range with a frequency of 8.2Hz,and the highest available Midi note is G8 at just over 12kHz.
However with our students, we always use EADGBE low to high order, and call the Low E string the Bottom string, even though it is physically above the A when a guitar is played in Spanish position. We also insist that as you play frets which are closer to the bridge, you are moving higher up the neck.
It's part of the hidden language which allows you to recognise someone who shares the secrets of the craft of music making.
Cheers
Dave

Bob Stone · From: Gainesville, FL, USA

John,

Thanks for bringing this up. What I like about the "classical" method for describing pitches is that it makes it clear which octaves one is talking about. Well, pretty clear.

One nice feature about the "classical" method of describing pitches is that there is no confusion as to whether you have listed the tuning from low to high or vice versa, as the octave of each note has been identified. The only hard part for us steel guitarists is remembering what octave a note is in. My way of dealing with that is to remember the low "E" on a guitar is E and that each octave designation begins on a "C" note. For example, "Dobro," or high-bass G tuning, would be: GBdgbd'.

The system above is used in the "Harvard Dictionary of Music" (Second edition, 1982), but the editor notes: "The chief source of confusion is that some writers designate middle c (the C in the middle of the keyboard) as c and others by c.(end quote) To avoid this point of confusion when describing the tuning of a steel guitar (or any other instrument) in writing, it's a good idea to explain octave designations. For example, "Where E is the lowest string on a guitar."

The "midi system" works too, but again, in my opinion should always be used with a note to explain where middle C (or some other reference pitch, such as the bottom string on a guitar)is.

I believe the accepted convention is to write tunings from low to high. That's what the Harvard Dictionary uses and is the system I always use. But if someone else uses high to low, it's fine with me as long as they tell me.

[This message was edited by Bob Stone on 20 January 2003 at 06:00 AM.]

Todd Weger · From: Safety Harbor, FLAUSA

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