Acoustic lap steel vs Weissenborn

Jean Jacques · From: Switzerland

Hi,

How would you compare a weissenborn versus an acoustic lap steel guitar (like a Ohau square neck)?

I would also love to know more about lap steel acoustic guitars references, if there are some iconic models i should do more research on?

Thank you

Mark Evans · From: Colorado, USA

I am a dyed in the wool Weissenborn (style) player. I’ve had a few different makes and styles (teardrop, regular) and the tone and volume are just great. I owned and played an old Oahu lap steel (regular body style, square neck). T’was nice but not nearly the same overal sound. Of course soundhole pickups really kicks it into the next gear.

I own about 4 now including a baritone. Sweet stuff - especially in open D, G etc.
_________________
Larry Pogreba Baritone 'Weissenheimer
Late 30’s Oahu Tonemaster
Hermann Guitars style 1 Weissenborn
2017 Richard Wilson Style 1 Weissenborn

BJ Burbach · From: New York, USA

Iconic? I keep dreaming about what Robert Murphy's Kleartone sounds like and of course, more of Howard R's guitars.
Anyway, a good thread overall for this discussion;

https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=386862&highlight=

BJ

Paul Seager · From: Augsburg, Germany

Obviously, personal preference is always the answer. In my opinion, Oahu and similar squareneck acoustics sell for silly prices in Europe, stupid because I believe most were student instruments that have somehow wandered across the Atlantic. They do seem to survive time but the fact that no-one of note plays them probably tells you a lot!

A few years ago, I went to a music workshop in Germany run by www.mg-guitars.eu . Beautiful instruments and I got to play a few of them but they simply were not for me. The quality and deep, warm tone was wonderful but I couldn't find the punch that I wanted. I've tried a few, cheaper Weissenborns since and still not found one that I like.

I eventually settled on a vintage Tricone which for my ears, is closer in tone to a guitar than a "Dobro". It is incredibly bright, dynamic and punchy - seems to overdrive if you hit it hard! I also have an old German F-hole guitar (I would not dare call it a jazz guitar), converted to lap steel and I like playing that for it's punchy tone. Unfortunately it doesn't hold any tuning longer than two songs!

Previously, I considered buying a mid-price Dreadnought and having a new nut cut to raise the strings but then I found the Tricone, spent about 5x more than I had planned and been in love ever since!
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\paul

Bayern Hawaiians: https://www.youtube.com/@diebayernhawaiians3062
Other stuff: https://www.youtube.com/@paulseager3796/videos

Mark Evans · From: Colorado, USA

Paul makes some good points (reminds me of too many ‘what is tone?’ Discussions at the acoustic guitar forum 🥴). Inexpensive instruments seem overbuilt and lack character. Higher priced, boutique builder instruments often sound ‘too’ deep and lush and beautiful… unless lush and deep and overtones and sustain for days is what one is after.

I like the mid ground: mahogany, mid-tones, quick to medium note decay. For bluesy stuff, I don’t care for sustain, drowning out previous notes. Lazy River weissenborns (Rance White, North Carolina)are a sweet middle ground. The Herrmann Guitar Weiss I have (made in Italy) is an example of a more Gibson-like sounding guitar. All mahogany. Reasonably priced. Pogreba guitars, too.

Of course the hands and fingers can often make lap steels sound great - despite the quality of the box
_________________
Larry Pogreba Baritone 'Weissenheimer
Late 30’s Oahu Tonemaster
Hermann Guitars style 1 Weissenborn
2017 Richard Wilson Style 1 Weissenborn

BJ Burbach · From: New York, USA

Jack Stepick has some clips on you tube with decent sound that might be useful to compare guitar types.
He makes weiss', flat tops, resos.
Good work at a fair price, too.
Like Paul, I was working with a weiss and recently flipped to a tricone.
BJ

Tim Toberer · From: Nebraska, USA

In this interview, Jeremy Wakefield talks about (and plays a sample!) of his modified archtop lap steel. I think he may be on to something. Archtop guitars have a really unique, clear tone that works very well for some types of music, especially jazz.

https://www.fretboardjournal.com/podcasts/steel-jeremy-wakefield/

I really love my spider bridge guitar, just had to get it setup right. To me is has the full tonal palette I need for anything I want to play. I have never played a tricone, going to build one soon.

Mark Mansueto · From: Michigan, USA

I play an acoustic lap steel and I also had a Lazy River weissenborn for a while. My current guitar is actually a Seagull 12-string that I converted to a 6-string lap steel after I heard that Kelly Joe Phelps played a Gibson flat top that he converted to a lap steel. I chose a 12-string for the beefier and wider neck and overall stronger construction to better withstand the increased tension of raised strings. It was a bit of work but the guitar cost me 300 bucks (used) and it sounds great. When I compared it to the Weissenborn the two sounded so close that I sold the weissenborn for 5x what I paid for the Seagull. I do miss how the weiss sat flat on my lap but that's about it.
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https://markmansueto.bandcamp.com/
https://open.spotify.com/artist/65dQ3EyZC2RaqawA8gPlRy?si=dOdqc5zxSKeJI9cISVVx_A

Paul DiMaggio · From: Fort Nelson, British Columbia, Canada

Hey Mark, I also am working an old Seagull 12 string.
Did you straighten the bridge? If so how did you do that? I am hoping to go to seven strings too but the bridge is important now.

Steve Lipsey · From: Portland, Oregon, USA

I went through a few Weiss's...a really high-end Weiss has a swirly, rich sound with lots of overtones that is different than a regular guitar, or than a medium Weiss...partially due to the big hollow neck, but also of course due to the construction...like a Stradivarius, there is magic in the good ones. And definitely I agree that lighter gauge strings were much better than heavy ones, which sounded thuddy in comparison.

I sort of compare it to a tricone dobro, with the three cones interacting to provide a sort of chorus overlay to the basic sound, again much richer and complex than a single cone, which is why Dopyera tried many different numbers of cones but settled on three as the best...(single cones only appeared to provide a cheaper option)

I regret selling my custom Weiss, but now enjoy my Oahu square neck..not as fancy a sound but a very enjoyable one t be sure, and a single-coil Fishman soundable pickup works great (with spacers to raise it up closer to the strings).

I also have a Bonham custom ResoBorn, a parlor-size dobro with light construction and a big hollow neck, not truly a Weiss but definitely has some of that vibe...
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https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor

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