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Topic: Palm blocking problem |
Chao Kang Lee
From:
Taiwan
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Posted 13 Nov 2024 5:32 pm |
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Hello everyone, I am a new member who joined the forum yesterday! 
I currently encounter the following two problems
1. When I was learning palm blocking recently, I encountered a problem. The gap between my palm and pinky prevented me from stopping the string sound.
2. I use jeff newman's right hand alpha method and the tip of my middle finger always touches the upper string. This troubles me very much. I have tried various angles for a month but still cannot solve the problem of the middle finger. Please help me. Thank you. Everyone
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Mullen G2
Mullen Discovery
Sho~Bud The pro III |
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Marco Schouten
From:
Amsterdam, The Netherlands
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Posted 14 Nov 2024 8:33 am
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Point 1: Move your hand forward a bit. It should not be above the same strings all the time, but move forward or backward when needed. (loke you would do with your bar)
Point 2: It's not needed to hook your pinky to the first string. Just stretch it and let it rest on the first string. Some steelers like to hook their pinky though.
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JCH SD-10 with BL XR-16 pickup, Sho-Bud Volume Pedal, Evidence Audio Lyric HG cables, Quilter Steelaire combo |
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Dennis Detweiler
From:
Solon, Iowa, US
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Posted 14 Nov 2024 10:52 am
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I"m trying to picture your hand from your discription? When you say middle finger, is it the finger next to your pinky finger? If so, it sounds like you need to curl that finger under your palm? Only the pinky finger should should be straight across the strings. At least that's the technique I use and I have no problem palm blocking.
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1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8. |
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Bobby D. Jones
From:
West Virginia, USA
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Posted 14 Nov 2024 6:52 pm
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If your hands are thin up and down through the palm, It is hard to palm block to near impossible.
You will have to figure out how you can block 1 string at a time, Or combination of strings. Pick blocking, side of fingers, Ring finger on left hand sliding bar back, Little finger and ring finger on right hand.
Mr. Franklin has a great lesson on You-Tube about blocking, other than palm blocking, That may help you. |
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Douglas Schuch
From:
Valencia, Philippines
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Posted 15 Nov 2024 3:18 am
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You are not alone! I've been playing for 13 years (still a novice, though) and I have never been any good at palm-blocking. I use it only when pick-blocking just isn't possible - like going from a grip on the higher strings down to 10/8/6. Paul F. says he spend years trying to master it until people finally told him to not bother and just play the way that works for him. So that's my advice - if palm-blocking is not working, but you can pick-block, then do that. But I will say it's best if you can do both.
If you decide to pursue pick-blocking, there is Paul F's instruction. But I've found Joe Wright's technique seems to work better for me. His extensive lessons on this are still available on the old Sierra Steel Guitar site. This site is not SSL (doesn't use current standard incryption for security). But you should not be entering any personal info, just watching his lessons, so I think it's no problem (others can correct me if I'm wrong).
http://sierrasteels.com/lessons/lessons-index.html
Good luck!
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Bringing steel guitar to the bukid of Negros Oriental! |
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Brian Spratt
From:
Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 15 Nov 2024 4:26 am Re: Palm blocking problem
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| Chao Kang Lee wrote: |
| ... the tip of my middle finger always touches the upper string. This troubles me ... |
I believe I know exactly what you mean. I struggled with this early on. The key for me was getting my fingerpicks bent, shaped, and secured to my fingers in just the proper ergonomical way so that my actual fingers could stay away from the strings enough to prevent exactly the problem you're describing. Even the most subtle change in shape to your finger picks can make a big difference here. I spent hours shaping and reshaping my finger picks early on until I found a shape and fit that allowed me to pick cleanly and keep my fingers from touching the strings when I didn't want them to. |
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Dennis Detweiler
From:
Solon, Iowa, US
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Posted 15 Nov 2024 6:14 am
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I forgot about mentioning the pick shape that Brian mentioned. When I started playing "decades ago" I kept reshaping my picks as time went on. I eventually ended up with them at nearly 90 degrees to get my hand/palm curled and at a good position for blocking. After analyzing my blocking now, I pick block and palm block in combination without realizing it.It depends on which strings and if blocking single notes or two or more notes together and where I am on the neck. Mixed bag, but it works.
_________________
1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8. |
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Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
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Posted 15 Nov 2024 11:07 am
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| Quote: |
| tip of my middle finger always touches the upper string |
If you mean the flesh of your fingertip is touching the string rather than the pick on that finger, the solution may be experimenting with shaping the pick, as has been mentioned. It could also just be part of the learning/muscle memory process and repositioning your hand.
One of the exercises in the aforementioned Joe Wright videos involves simply placing your thumb and fingers on alternate sets of 3 adjacent strings. This “teaches” the fingers where the strings are. If one or more of your fingers ends up with a string between the pick and the flesh of your finger, that is an unwanted result and your job is to correct it. Repeat as necessary until you can’t make the mistake.
The exercise can then be applied to all chord grips. |
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Chao Kang Lee
From:
Taiwan
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Posted 15 Nov 2024 8:11 pm Re: Palm blocking problem
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| Brian Spratt wrote: |
| Chao Kang Lee wrote: |
| ... the tip of my middle finger always touches the upper string. This troubles me ... |
I believe I know exactly what you mean. I struggled with this early on. The key for me was getting my fingerpicks bent, shaped, and secured to my fingers in just the proper ergonomical way so that my actual fingers could stay away from the strings enough to prevent exactly the problem you're describing. Even the most subtle change in shape to your finger picks can make a big difference here. I spent hours shaping and reshaping my finger picks early on until I found a shape and fit that allowed me to pick cleanly and keep my fingers from touching the strings when I didn't want them to. |
Thank you Brian
This is a picture of my hand
I tried to adjust the pick angle as you said
But it is still impossible to completely avoid touching the upper string
Moreover, the fixed ring of the pick will always touch the upper strings, which really bothers me.
 [/img]
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Mullen G2
Mullen Discovery
Sho~Bud The pro III |
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Dave Magram
From:
San Jose, California, USA
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Posted 15 Nov 2024 8:59 pm Re: Palm blocking problem
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| Chao Kang Lee wrote: |
I tried to adjust the pick angle as you said. But it is still impossible to completely avoid touching the upper string
Moreover, the fixed ring of the pick will always touch the upper strings, which really bothers me. |
Hi Chao,
The angle of the fingertip blade looks okay to me.
Those look like Dunlop fingerpicks--are they?
There are two problems with Dunlop fingerpicks:
- The bands get wider where the ends go on your fingernail--which makes them tend to catch on adjacent strings.
- The sides of the bands are flared for comfort--but the flaring also tends to catch on adjacent strings.
You can either:
- Spend some time with a needle-nose pliers and flatten out the flaring on the Dunlops, and then try to reshape the bands so they don't catch on the strings, or
- Buy some National fingerpicks, which do not have flared bands, nor do the bands get wider on the ends. (National fingerpicks were the standard fingerpicks in the 1950s and beyond for great players like Emmons, Green, Brumley, etc.)
I always spend 15 to 20 minutes re-shaping new fingerpicks until they each fit my fingers like little gloves--which helps to reduce the chance that they will catch on the strings, makes them very comfortable, and also reduce the chance that they will come off. 
- Dave |
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Dennis Detweiler
From:
Solon, Iowa, US
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Posted 15 Nov 2024 9:51 pm
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As Dave said. It looks like it does need a little needle nose plier work on the open end of the picks to get them tighter on top. I don't see the pinky finger out and that may change the cup of the hand a little. You might try pulling your palm back a little more and result in that middle finger pick angle being a little less curled? That would get the knuckle on your middle finger off of the string.
_________________
1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8. |
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Chao Kang Lee
From:
Taiwan
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Posted 15 Nov 2024 10:09 pm
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| Dennis Detweiler wrote: |
| As Dave said. It looks like it does need a little needle nose plier work on the open end of the picks to get them tighter on top. I don't see the pinky finger out and that may change the cup of the hand a little. You might try pulling your palm back a little more and result in that middle finger pick angle being a little less curled? That would get the knuckle on your middle finger off of the string. |
Thank you Dennis, but as long as I pull my hand back, it will enter the gap position of the palm and I can't mute the strings. That's why I am so troubled. Doesn't your middle finger touch the upper string? Thanks
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Mullen G2
Mullen Discovery
Sho~Bud The pro III |
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Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
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Posted 16 Nov 2024 12:15 am
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Is there some rule that says certain pick hand fingers can’t touch the strings? If there is, I am in big trouble.
Seriously. Palm blocking is not dependent on fingers not touching the strings. I am not an expert in the technique, but I have heard that one approach to is to assume that the palm resting on the strings is the default position for the hand, and only rises up to allow for strings to be picked. If anything, I would say there is far worse technique than having your fingers on the strings and ready to play.
The other thing to keep in mind about palm blocking is that it is a very tiny physical movement. Raise the palm up just enough to sound a picked string. This is one of the most difficult things to control. If your hand is flying off the deck for every picked note and banging back down on the strings to mute, well.. stop doing that 😎
I do sympathize with you about the space beyond the palm that is left open by the outstretched pinky finger. I can’t block any string that happens to be in that space either. I don’t believe the objective is to have the side of the palm and the outstretched pinky block all 10 (or 12) strings at once. In spite of that, as has been mentioned, the middle finger of the bar hand can help out. If you hold the bar in such a way that the middle finger extends past the nose of the bar, it can mute any string that is either very inconvenient or physically impossible to do any other way.
The thing that finally got me to stop obsessing about how to mute/block was to just start playing music and figuring out whatever method worked best for getting rid of the unwanted noise. For me, strict dogmatic adherence to palm blocking or pick blocking or tilting the bar upward or smacking my forehead down on the strings was never going to work as well as learning something about all the viable techniques and using whichever one is the most convenient at the time.
Hope this helps. If it doesn’t, sorry for taking up so much space here.
Also, read the esteemed Dave Magram’s post on the topic from this thread:
https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=200502&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 |
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