ZB Custom Student Model

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

I am studying on this guitar that a client brought in (my first hands-on ZB) and I may have more specific questions about its set up as I get deeper into it but up front, does anyone know what the factory knee lever setup would have been (4 levers)? It's got Day pedals and Day-appropriate left knee E raise & lowers. Right knees are my interest.

Richard Sinkler · From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana

My first ZB was an s10, not a student model although they had a pro ZB undercarraige and changer. I later became a dealer for ZB and sold a student model. I seem to remember the levers were the second and ninth string lower, the E raises and lowers, and the first and seventh strings from F# to G.
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Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting.

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

Thanks. That's conventional enough.
I'd suspected that this guitar has been messed with. RKR lowers 2 and....10 (?!) It is way out of adjustment so I can't tell if 10 is a half or whole step lower.

And RKL has just one rod that appears to raise 4 (in addition to C pedal and F lever....I'm confused and can't sort it out until I replace the broken 4th string. It's just a jungle of rods in there.

This is the first ZB I've had my hands on. I told the client that I'd look at it, clean it up & tweak it but that I do NOT experiment on any guitar except my own. I may or may not mess with the set up. I'd initially simply said no to working on it but we had a good hang and I want to help him out.

Eric Dahlhoff · From: Point Arena, California

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

Yeah -- I'll likely move that from 10 to 9.

RKL....it's just got this one puller. I don't have the ZB chops to know if it's improvised, hacked or what. My clearly stated intentions & understanding with the owner is that I will clean it up and get it playing nicely but that I will not do anything radical, invasive or risky. I'll make some decisions after I've had more time with this thing....maybe later today if time allows.

Here's RKL:

Richard Sinkler · From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana

Your pics just reminded me that they used a wing nut with one wing broken off and a hole in the other one for the second string lower.
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Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting.

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

Richard Sinkler · From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana

I had a lever that raised 4 a whole step on both my ZBs.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting.

richard burton · From: Britain

The extra tuner is the half tone raise on the 4th string
It's just a regular raise rod with a bent rod welded to it (see pics)

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

Thanks Richard. Yep -- as I discovered. Simple. Especially since I went in with the question "ok -- how do I tune the F lever? I wonder if....this...."
All mysteries should be so easily solved.

Eric Dahlhoff · From: Point Arena, California

Jon,
In this pic of yours, the nut I've highlighted in blue needs to be tightened against the cross bar. Otherwise the bolt will slide through the cross bar and cause problems.
Any other nuts like that also need to be tightened.

In the yellow circle - Why is that changer from string 4 sticking out? Is there an extra piece welded on?

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"To live outside the law you must be honest." (Bob Dylan)

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

Thanks Eric. I keep repeating my mantra
"Do no harm. Do no harm".

I'm gradually putting together ideas of "ok, this is right, that is wrong, and wft is THAT?"
I can't see myself undoing some of the things that have been done, right or wrong. On any all-pull OR push-pull I would not hesitate. But this is too unfamiliar to me.

See picture below_-
For reasons that I do not know, the LKL F lever rods run over the RKL shaft and then dive under the RKR shaft. It would seem that the nut is loosened to drop that puller yoke down to allow the LKL rods to pass thru. The turnbuckle tuning nuts on the LKL rods, passing thru the puller assembly of RKR definitely interfere with the operation of RKR.
If it were my guitar I would spend a lot of time studying it and then operate and route things more logically and efficiently. I can't see why those rods don't run under rather thru. But I can't ignore the possibility that there is a reason and I do NOT want to get that deep into disassembly only to end up with loose ends in my hands and a mess of a reassembly task in front of me.

My mission is to return this guitar with good pedal and left knee operation. And to do no harm.
In the future, if the owner REALLY wants me to, I will consider getting the right side up to snuff, including bringing the RKR puller up flush with the shaft and rerouting the LKL rods under it.

Repeating myself -- I originally told the owner that I'd have a look but that no, I do not work on ZBs. But it was so messed up with pedals that barely worked. I had to try to help. And I've already done major, basic stuff so that I believe it will play really nicely when I'm done. Except for RKR.

Thanks again!

Oh -- and to answer question #2, that extra piece for string 4 is to allow the 3rd raise on the string. It is an extension added on to the original two hole piece. I'm hazy on exactly how it is attached but it seems to work well enough that it doesn't seem like a hack job.

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