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Topic: Weird sound from my PSG. |
Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 10 Mar 2024 9:47 am |
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I do not unfortunately have an amp. I play an old student level ZB CUSTOM. Not sure of the pickup. When I record the guitar into my saw I go direct into my interface. Signal chain is, out of steel into Ernie ball VP, from VP to compression to reverb to audio interface. When I play I have a weird sound that sounds like fuzz when I’m playing the strings. There’s no ground hum, no distortion sound, just a weird fuzz. I tried going direct into my audio interface bypassing everything. So from PSG out right into the interface. Anybody else have this happen or any idea what it might be? I never noticed it before the last few months and have been trying to rack my brain…
On another side note, being that I always play direct since I do not own an amp, should I be using a preamp? |
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Tucker Jackson
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 10 Mar 2024 11:34 am
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Does your audio interface have a way to control the level of the input signal -- and turn it down? It could be that the input is overloading and fuzzing out the signal.
If this is the problem, you might also be able to see the signal going into the red on the input meter in the DAW software. |
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Ken Fox
From:
Nashville GA USA
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Posted 10 Mar 2024 2:44 pm Noise
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Also keep the cell phone away from the amp and guitar. They can inject some really bad chatter
Just bring it close to the pickup and you’ll hear the noise it can inject really well |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 10 Mar 2024 7:03 pm
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Hard to tell from the limited information. Do you get the noise at all volume levels? Or, is is something that affects only certain strings? Is it worse with chords?
Along with the cell-phone interference that Ken spoke of, you can get noise from nearby computers, laptops, tablets, TV sets, and monitors.
Also, useable amps can be had for $40-$75 from craigslist, ebay, or pawnshops. Sometimes, even music stores sell cheapie amps that will free you from using the DAW for everything. |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 11 Mar 2024 2:54 am
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Yes you need a preamp between your VP and any line level inputs, whether comp, eq, f/x, or DAW. The distortion you are hearing is likely due to an impedance miss-match and not an overdriven input, as there is no way the pickup alone can deliver enough voltage to do that.
ALSO the Ernie Ball VP uses a 250k pot, suitable for 6-string guitars which normally have pickup impedances in the neighborhood of 5k-8k. Most pedal steel guitar pickups have impedances in the 16k-22k range, thus dedicated steel guitar volume pedals use 500k or 1meg pots to provide a proper load thus deliver maximum voltage. This lower resistance VP compounds the lack of adequate signal for your DAW.
Lastly, without a proper preamp there is no way to know if the pickup itself is damaged.
Find a cheap guitar amp (which all have preamps built in) with a line out to drive your recording rig, you already have everything else you need. |
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Tucker Jackson
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2024 9:07 am
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| Quote: |
| Yes you need a preamp between your VP and any line level inputs, whether comp, eq, f/x, or DAW. The distortion you are hearing is likely due to an impedance miss-match and not an overdriven input, as there is no way the pickup alone can deliver enough voltage to do that. |
Good point. But he is using a compressor and reverb unit before the audio interface. Doesn't that handle the issue of impedance-matching and boost the signal to line level?
Jared, does your audio interface have a switch for the input to swap between instrument and line-level signals? It's a common feature. If yours has it, what happens when you hit the switch?
Do you have a 6-string guitar you could plug in to see if the problem remains? |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 11 Mar 2024 9:48 am
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| Tucker Jackson wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Yes you need a preamp between your VP and any line level inputs, whether comp, eq, f/x, or DAW. The distortion you are hearing is likely due to an impedance miss-match and not an overdriven input, as there is no way the pickup alone can deliver enough voltage to do that. |
Good point. But he is using a compressor and reverb unit before the audio interface. Doesn't that handle the issue of impedance-matching and boost the signal to line level? |
Yes they CAN often serve as an impedance buffer depending on what they are feeding, but processing devices rarely have preamps included. If it's a stompbox it will input AND output low level high impedance guitar signal, expecting to be driving a guitar amp's preamp input. If it's a rack mounted unit it likely requires, and outputs, line levels many times greater that of a guitar or microphone. A stompbox may have adequate extra gain to boost the signal quite a bit, but the resultant low signal at high distortion brings us back to the OP. |
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Tucker Jackson
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2024 10:03 am
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The interface matters too as to what it can handle. My (inexpensive, basic) interface can handle instrument level or line level, and it has a knob to adjust the input. The designers half expect you're going to plug a guitar straight into the interface to get to the virtual amp in the DAW, so it's able to handle a high-impedance instrument level signal without issue. No preamp required (though it might sound better with one).
Jared, does your interface have these features? You could get light distortion if the 'input' knob were set too high. |
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2024 7:06 pm
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| Thank you everyone for the info and troubleshooting. My DAW does not have the option to change the input signal. I do have volume control on it. And the guitar does it no matter the volume. Definitely have some ideas to try. |
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2024 8:32 am
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| If I could track down an affordable option for an amp or at least a preamp, what are some recommendations? My budget does not allow for more than $200ish |
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2024 12:12 pm
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| So I was able to track down two different amps to see if it is something in my signal chain. And when I go direct out of my steel into the input of an old yorkville bloc 150b and a cheap drive 25 watt, it sounds like distortion at any volume. Like I can make out the notes just fine, but there is a slight fuzzy sound that rings out with the notes. My pickup is not adjustable as far as height without me taking it off and physically removing a spacer underneath. My pickup height seems to be at the standard for what I’ve seen on PSGs. Roughly two stacked quarters on the high and low string right? Could a bad pickup be the problem? It didn’t use to do this when I started playing years ago. And nothing has really changed. But it is a ZB student model 3x1 so is it just the pickup is finally “dying” or whatever?? Really frustrated and it is very distracting on recordings. |
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2024 12:13 pm
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| Tucker Jackson wrote: |
The interface matters too as to what it can handle. My (inexpensive, basic) interface can handle instrument level or line level, and it has a knob to adjust the input. The designers half expect you're going to plug a guitar straight into the interface to get to the virtual amp in the DAW, so it's able to handle a high-impedance instrument level signal without issue. No preamp required (though it might sound better with one).
Jared, does your interface have these features? You could get light distortion if the 'input' knob were set too high. |
My interface has a simple volume knob but at any level it still makes the fuzzy sound and is nowhere near clipping.
I did try running telecaster through it exactly like the steel and my tele sounds normal…. |
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2024 12:18 pm
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| Donny Hinson wrote: |
Hard to tell from the limited information. Do you get the noise at all volume levels? Or, is is something that affects only certain strings? Is it worse with chords?
Along with the cell-phone interference that Ken spoke of, you can get noise from nearby computers, laptops, tablets, TV sets, and monitors.
Also, useable amps can be had for $40-$75 from craigslist, ebay, or pawnshops. Sometimes, even music stores sell cheapie amps that will free you from using the DAW for everything. |
My guitar sits about 3 to 4 feet away from my computer and any other electronic device. However I can maybe try moving further away? But when I turn off everything except my guitar and now amp… I still get the same sound. Even playing in the dark haha…. |
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Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2024 2:36 pm
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But anything else I play through the interface works beautifully. It’s an MAudio profile 4. And the steel does it through an amp. |
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Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2024 5:13 pm
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| Pedal steel out jack might not be making good contact. Douse a q-tip with some isopropyl and swirl it around the inside of the jack. Also check the solder connections to the jack and make sure they solid. |
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2024 5:41 pm
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| Fred Treece wrote: |
| Pedal steel out jack might not be making good contact. Douse a q-tip with some isopropyl and swirl it around the inside of the jack. Also check the solder connections to the jack and make sure they solid. |
I’ll try that! |
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Tucker Jackson
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 13 Mar 2024 7:46 am
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Thanks for doing all that troubleshooting. Hopefully cleaning the jack or swapping cables fixed it up.
If not:
If the tele sounds fine through the chain... and the steel still fuzzes even when plugged into two different amps, it really narrows it down to the pickup, pickup wiring or the jack.
Donny Hinson has suggested in other threads to simply unscrew the jack from the guitar and then screw it back in. That might knock off years of corroded gunk, and you need a good metal-to-metal connection since that provides the ground (or Earth).
I'll throw this out to the electronics gurus: could it be a failing solder joint at the jack? Or would that give more of a crackle than a light fuzz? |
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Bobby D. Jones
From:
West Virginia, USA
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Posted 16 Mar 2024 9:55 pm
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| Check outlet voltage, Lower than 110V or more than 120V can cause problems. With some electronic equipment. |
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Samuel Phillippe
From:
Douglas Michigan, USA
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Posted 17 Mar 2024 7:25 am
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A stupid question....Do you wear hearing aids?
I do and shut them off while playing because they make it sound like distortion.
Just a thought.
Sam |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 17 Mar 2024 8:53 am
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| Jared Wehry wrote: |
| ...when I go direct out of my steel into the input of an old yorkville bloc 150b and a cheap drive 25 watt, it sounds like distortion at any volume. |
Your pickup is trashed, plain and simple |
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Howard Parker
From:
Maryland
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Posted 17 Mar 2024 8:58 am
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Where in PA are you. Might well be some local folks that can help you pin this down!
h
_________________
Howard Parker
03\' Carter D-10
70\'s Dekley D-10
52\' Fender Custom
Many guitars by Paul Beard
Listowner Resoguit-L |
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 21 Mar 2024 12:08 pm
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| Dave Grafe wrote: |
| Jared Wehry wrote: |
| ...when I go direct out of my steel into the input of an old yorkville bloc 150b and a cheap drive 25 watt, it sounds like distortion at any volume. |
Your pickup is trashed, plain and simple |
Kinda my thought.. any recommendations for a decent pickup that won’t break the bank?
Last edited by Jared Wehry on 21 Mar 2024 12:09 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jared Wehry
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 21 Mar 2024 12:09 pm
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| Howard Parker wrote: |
Where in PA are you. Might well be some local folks that can help you pin this down!
h |
I’m from central Pa. About an hour north of Harrisburg. |
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Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 21 Mar 2024 12:25 pm
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| Jared Wehry wrote: |
Kinda my thought.. any recommendations for a decent pickup that won’t break the bank? |
I really like the pickups I've gotten from Scott Swartz.
https://www.steeltronics.com/
He happens to make a wonderful reproduction of a ZB pickup but I have a feeling that your ZB student model doesn't have the classic ZB pickup in it. You need to talk with him and make sure you are on the same page regarding what you want in terms of single coil, humbucker, wide mount, narrow mount etc. |
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