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Topic: Quilter 202 as a DI |
Tom Wolverton
From:
Carpinteria, CA
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Posted 10 Jul 2022 8:21 am |
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I recently had to play on a festival stage with no backline amps. I brought my Tone Block 202 to use as a DI without any speaker connected. The Quilter says in this configuration to not use the XLR out in the back, but instead to use the Sig Out on the front panel. The Sig Out is a 1/4” TRS jack that gives off a line level signal. The soundman didn’t have anything that would work for that. Am I supposed to carry an adaptor with me? 1/4” TRS to a male XLR jack? What would you use?
I ended up using my backup Red Eye Twin as the DI. It worked fine, but had no reverb like the 202 does.
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To write with a broken pencil is pointless. |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 10 Jul 2022 10:19 am
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The short answer is that if you want to use the SIG OUT, it is definitely a good idea to have a TRS to XLR adapter, in case the sound people don't have mic-level TRS inputs. That would surprise me if true on a good modern board, but I suppose it might be. I keep one in my gig bag just in case I need it. But I rarely need to use it since I don't use stuff with TRS outs these days - I used to, and generally just used the TRS to XLR adapter and handed them an XLR to avoid confusion. I think a lot of people just wanna see an XLR.
But I use the XLR Direct Out on my TB 201 routinely with no issues. I believe it's the same as the one on the 202 - the description is basically the same, and the 202 manual goes into detail about when it's better to use the SIG OUT TRS output:
201: Provides a mic-level, isolated signal that may be used instead of placing a microphone in front of the speaker. The signal is equalized to match the response of most cone-type speakers.
202: Provides a mic-level, isolated signal that may be used instead of placing a microphone in front of the speaker. The signal matches the level of typical mics, and uses the speaker as part of the tone-shaping system, so it is intended for live performance. For "silent stages" where the speaker is not desired, use the front panel SIG OUT in PRE mode, as described above.
Then the 202's SIG OUT description is as follows:
SIG OUT and PRE/POST switch: In PRE position, SIG OUT sends a balanced, TRS line-out that is not afected by the MASTER setting, making this a good "house feed" that is independent of stage volume. In POST position, it sends a mono headphone signal controlled by the MASTER, to obtain a comfortable listening level. In both cases, the signal is fat with the Input switch on the FRFR position, and has cabinet simulation (cab-sim) on FULLQ and VINT positions, which is independent of any speaker connection.
Pro Tip: In the PRE position, the Master may be turned all the way of to silence the speaker without afecting the SIG OUT level. Unplug the speaker to use headphones silently in the POST position.
So the difference is that, in Pre mode as they suggest, the SIG OUT is unaffected by the Master Volume so you can silence the speaker without affecting what is sent to the sound board. Since you're talking about working without a backline amp, I don't see a problem using the XLR out. Without a backline amp, you're relying on the house for your monitor signal, right? So I would think the Master Volume would just be a set-and-forget-it deal. Assuming they know what they're doing.  |
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Tom Wolverton
From:
Carpinteria, CA
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Posted 11 Jul 2022 4:32 am
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Thanks Dave for the info. I guess I should get an adaptor and carry it with me. Of course, then I’ll probably never need it again.
_________________
To write with a broken pencil is pointless. |
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Aaron Brownwood
From:
California, USA
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Posted 1 Feb 2024 5:12 pm
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| Does anyone know, when using the SIGNAL OUT, if you need to set the gain knob to the sound guy's preference? |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 1 Feb 2024 7:25 pm
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| Aaron Brownwood wrote: |
| Does anyone know, when using the SIGNAL OUT, if you need to set the gain knob to the sound guy's preference? |
No, if your level is consistent the mixer has adequate gain control to adjust to it. The intended advantage of using the "PRE" TRS SIGNAL OUT is that it takes the signal directly from the preamp independently of the amp's gain control and speaker processing.
The XLR output on the rear of the amp takes its signal ("POST") from the amp's
final output at the speaker, and thus the level WILL change with your gain knob settings. It also appears to include some extra speaker-related processing.
Hope that helps. |
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Joel Jackson
From:
Detroit
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Posted 2 Feb 2024 3:19 am
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| Aaron Brownwood wrote: |
| Does anyone know, when using the SIGNAL OUT, if you need to set the gain knob to the sound guy's preference? |
Set gain/limiter to your preference. If you’re using the 202 to monitor on stage, selecting pre sends full volume level from signal out to line in on the board and allows you to use volume on the 202 to independently control your stage volume. Selecting post normals both levels to the volume knob. This is maybe more helpful for recording if you’re going direct and want the cab sim available on the sig out and want to be able to attenuate the level you’re sending to the board. There’s a video where Travis does a good job of explaining this stuff. Great design. Great amp. |
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Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
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Pete Bailey
From:
Seattle, WA
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Posted 2 Feb 2024 8:41 am
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Tom, if you do go the adapter route instead of just using the XLR out (which is fine, as explained above), then I recommend using a short 1/4" to XLR cable instead of a solid adapter as you have pictured. The reason is to prevent a long, solid connector from sticking up out of the line out input jack, which could easily get knocked or banged and tweak something inside the quilter head. Monoprice sells a short 1/4" to XLR cable for under $10.
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Tom Wolverton
From:
Carpinteria, CA
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Posted 3 Feb 2024 8:04 am
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Pete. Thanks for the tip. That’s a very good idea.
_________________
To write with a broken pencil is pointless. |
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Brett Lanier
From:
Madison, TN
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Posted 4 Feb 2024 12:49 pm
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| Wouldn't a passive di box have worked? A festival stage will usually have several on hand for keyboards, acoustic guitars, and noisy bass amp di's. |
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Scott Morgan
From:
Maine, USA
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Posted 5 Feb 2024 3:16 pm
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| Brett Lanier wrote: |
| Wouldn't a passive di box have worked? A festival stage will usually have several on hand for keyboards, acoustic guitars, and noisy bass amp di's. |
Yes and no. Most DI's are expecting 1/4 ts mono guitar/keyboard level. In the scenario above the sig out in pre mode(cab sim) the quilter puts out fully balanced trs line level and would overload a DI box since there is no way to turn down the signal with the master.
What might have worked with a DI box is unplugging the speaker cable (for silent stage) and setting the sig out to "post" mode, then use a regular ts guitar cable as explained in the manual below. Then you can you use the master to adjust the signal to FOH and not overload the DI.
From the 202 manual
"The POST position converts SIG OUT to a headphone driver, with level controlled by Master, putting identical signals on Tip and Ring terminals (center-mono signal). This will not work into a balanced input, which rejects this common mode signal An unbalanced (mono) cable
will work, if it is necessary to use the Master volume to reduce SIG OUT level" |
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