| Author |
Topic: C6: lowering the 5th from G to F |
Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
|
Posted 29 Oct 2022 3:53 pm |
|
I've put this change on my LeGrande (on P4, also raising the 10th to D), and it functions.
But it's very stiff and far too heavy. That change needs to be fast.
Any suggestions as to what bell-crank hole I should use, please?
Mine are 14-hole cranks. |
|
|
 |
Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
|
|
|
|
Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
|
Posted 30 Oct 2022 6:47 am
|
|
It's a pretty change and better, in my opinion, than raising 6 to F.
Junior Mercer suggested that I go from an .024" to an .026. That has certainly helped buy the pedal is still slow to lower that 5th. |
|
|
|
Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
|
|
|
|
Johnny Cox
From:
Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
|
Posted 30 Oct 2022 9:46 am
|
|
| Roger Rettig wrote: |
It's a pretty change and better, in my opinion, than raising 6 to F.
Junior Mercer suggested that I go from an .024" to an .026. That has certainly helped buy the pedal is still slow to lower that 5th. |
For some reason Le Grandes are difficult on that change. The one I had was very long. I ended up using a Jagwire string with a thicker core and it helped a bit.
_________________
Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967. |
|
|
|
Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
|
Posted 30 Oct 2022 9:57 am
|
|
Johnny:
I just flipped the guitar and got m6self some more travel. I also put an .026" on there.
No trouble getting the pitches I want, bit I still wish P4 was as light and 'fast' as my E9 A pedal (or a the others, actually).
The chord - minor9/aug7 - is nice. I can see me getting use from that.
While I was at it, I took off my B to A lower (LKV - 5th string, E9) and moved it to string 6 where it now raises the G# to A#. I had that pull a while ago and took it off. I can't think why. It's useful - for one thing it gives you a 6th chord pedals down (F# at zero fret). It on my vertical and using it is a challenge with my short legs.  |
|
|
|
Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
|
Posted 30 Oct 2022 2:06 pm
|
|
It's possible that just loosening the lowering return spring would solve the problem. Assuming there are no raises on that string, it only needs to be tight enough to return and hold the scissor against the stop plate when you release the pedal. Lowers on a LeGrande changer can be quirky, particularly with thinner strings, or wound strings with a thin core like a .024 or .026. The raise scissor can begin to lift off the stop at a certain point on a long pull, which actually begins to counteract the lower before the pull is complete (thus creating a longer pull). This is caused by tension from the lower return spring, which uses the nylon tuning nut as a fulcrum and begins to lift the raise scissor mid-pull, even when the spring is properly adjusted. The tighter the spring, the worse the problem. You should be able to see if this happening by just looking at the raise scissor in the end plate window to see if it is lifting as you engage the pedal.
It's slightly counter-intuitive, but the changer finger's scissor geometry is such that when pulling from the inner lowering hole, closest to the axle, this behavior is more likely. Long lowers seem to work best in the lower hole of the changer on a LeGrande, furthest from the axle. The bottom hole is closer to the spring so it has a better leverage advantage in the scissor mechanism to resist this behavior. Just a thought, but if the problem described above is actually happening... the P5 F# lower is normally in the inner hole closest to the changer axle, if it happens to be the other way around in your setup, with the F lower in that hole, you might try swapping them, move the pull rod toward the outer holes on the bell crank for the F lower to compensate and vice versa for the P5 F#.
_________________
All lies and jest, still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest - Paul Simon |
|
|
|
Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
|
Posted 30 Oct 2022 2:40 pm
|
|
Thank you, Ian, for that comprehensive explanation.
I will look again.
I did have a problem putting reverse P6 on my MKL; the kneelever stop needed backing off to allow more travel.
These things aren't simple, are they?? |
|
|
|
Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
|
Posted 30 Oct 2022 6:44 pm
|
|
| Roger Rettig wrote: |
| ...These things aren't simple, are they?? |
 getting everything to play nice together and do what we want isn't always! That's half the fun though, right?! 
_________________
All lies and jest, still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest - Paul Simon |
|
|
|
