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Topic: Notation Software Options |
Carey Hofer
From:
South Dakota, USA
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Posted 20 Sep 2022 8:21 am |
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For those of you on the Forum that use or have tried various types of notation software, do you have any opinions on what is the best software? Is it hard to use, for the most part? I have been playing non pedal steel now for a little less than a year. Since I have a jazz guitar background I lean towards standards/Great American Songbook stuff. I enjoy nice chord progressions and harmonies and my single string stuff comes out of that. Its taking me longer, to learn a tune than if I were to use maybe just a I, IV, V7 progression. As we all know some of the most beautiful tunes ever written have come about via three chords and the truth .. . and maybe a capo.  Guess I'm just a glutton for punishment.
Anyway, my problem seems to be, I will learn/arrange a few bars of a tune at a time. As I go through the tune I forget the stuff I learned/discovered a few days ago.  I decided that if I could find a professional looking, easy to use and understand notation software, I would copy it down and it would be easier to remember what I have learned. Ultimately, at some point when I have the tune down well enough to not embarrass myself, I would post the audio on the forum and also the transcription. That way if someone liked it well enough, they could learn it from the transcription. You could also give comments on my audio/transcription if you wanted. I think this would be especially helpful to guys like me who are newer and are trying to find their way harmonically, tuning wise etc.
For instance, it was really helpful when Doug B. put out a YouTube version and transcription of Moon Tide. Fairly simple for me to learn and to play but a beautiful tune for anyone from a beginner to a pro. There are others also, that is just the first one that came to mind. There are so many different tunings that its mind boggling.
Anyway, as far as the software, I would like it for 8 string, a way to enter chord symbols and where to the place the bar and which notes I use under it. A music staff above, to name the actual notes would be helpful but not necessary. For me at least, the end of the matter is just to be able to play a beautiful tune and share it with others. The notation is just a helpful means to an end
Any thoughts? Everyone here on the forum has been so helpful, I just thought this might be a way to give back in my own way. |
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Michael Lester
From:
Illinois, USA
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Posted 20 Sep 2022 9:41 am Tabledit
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FWIW... I have the same problem with remembering. I use Tabledit for both 8 string lap steel and D10 pedal steel.
Works for me and I don't have to guess what I wrote through my bad handwriting.
Here's a screen shot of the setup tab. You can toggle to add standard notation along with or without tab.
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David DeLoach
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 20 Sep 2022 12:09 pm
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I made 6 string and 8 string tab paper that I print out and just write my arrangements in pencil...
_________________
https://www.MasterGuitarists.com/ |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Carey Hofer
From:
South Dakota, USA
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Posted 20 Sep 2022 2:40 pm
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| Come to think of it, I would have to have the notation above the tab just to remember the actual notes and rhythms. |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 21 Sep 2022 7:57 am
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When I write tab, besides the tab I also include the musical notation, lyrics and chords. 
Erv |
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Bill McCloskey
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Posted 21 Sep 2022 8:38 am
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| Andy, does Guitar Pro let you choose 8-10-12 lap steel string options in the tab or is it limited to guitar |
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Mike Neer
From:
NJ
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Posted 21 Sep 2022 8:49 am
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Tabledit has always been good to me. Little bit of a learning curve but vast possibilities and a developer with a keen interest in catering to the steel guitar player. Not the sexiest interface but turns out nice results.
_________________
Links to streaming music, websites, YouTube: Links |
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Gary Anwyl
From:
Palo Alto, CA
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Posted 21 Sep 2022 8:59 am
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I use MuseScore. It is free open source software. It runs on a Mac or PC. It has been around for a while. It seems pretty stable.
I use it for composing and creating tabs of transcriptions for dobro and lap steel. Like Carey, I wanted to write stuff down so I don't forget it.
It is very capable. There is a learning curve, but once you get the workflow down it is pretty easy to enter a score and generate a tab. There are tutorials on the website. When you run into problems or wonder how to do a particular operation you can usually Google it and find answers.
I use it for standard 6 string tunings, but you can define custom tunings with 8 or more strings. You enter the music using normal notation. It will automatically generate the tab. Sometime you need to tweak the tab to get the right fret/string combination. MuseScore lets you play back the score so you can hear if the notes and the phrasing are correct.
Two MuseScore transcriptions I've done:
- The Running on Empty solo, Open E tuning
- Transcription of Steve Cunningham's arrangement of My Sweet Lord, also Open E. (Youtube video is here). Fairly complex rhythmically & lots of multiple string grips. This is the '.mscz' file for My Sweet Lord if you want to open it up in MuseScore and play around with it.
Last edited by Gary Anwyl on 21 Sep 2022 12:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 21 Sep 2022 9:28 am
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Bill, I don't have it loaded on my laptop where I'm working today but GP7 allowed you to notate for up to 10 strings and GP8 just came out, so I'd be surprised if it doesn't offer 12 or more strings. Terrific program!
Update: looks like still max of 10 strings in GP8.
_________________
Steel Guitar Books! Website: www.volkmediabooks.com
Last edited by Andy Volk on 22 Sep 2022 2:03 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Carey Hofer
From:
South Dakota, USA
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Posted 21 Sep 2022 12:20 pm
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| I will check this stuff out guys. Thanks. |
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Chris Brooks
From:
Providence, Rhode Island
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 4:58 am
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| I use MuseScore for making lead sheets and simple arrangements. Haven't used it for Tab. |
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Bill McCloskey
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 7:43 am
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| Quote: |
| Update: looks like still max of 10 strings in GP8. |
That's unfortunate. Wonder if any of the other brands/products support 12 string instruments. |
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Greg Brouelette
From:
California, USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 8:34 am
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I'm also a big TablEdit fan.
I've taught acoustic and electric guitar, banjo, and mandolin for several years. TablEdit is a standard tool for me now. |
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David DeLoach
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 8:50 am
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Sibelius has a bit of learning curve, but I just created a tab set up for a 12 string lap steel tuned
B D E F# G# B C# D E F# G# A (low to high)
You can assign any pitch to the strings. You can have as many lines of tab as you wish. I saw the ability to have up to 50 lines of tab.
_________________
https://www.MasterGuitarists.com/ |
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Bill McCloskey
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 9:38 am
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| Now you are talking. Do you know which version of Sibelius you are using? |
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David DeLoach
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 12:16 pm
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| Bill McCloskey wrote: |
| Now you are talking. Do you know which version of Sibelius you are using? |
I'm using version 6. Stand by for some more info...
_________________
https://www.MasterGuitarists.com/ |
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Bill McCloskey
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 12:28 pm
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| Not sure that exists anymore. Now they want you on a monthly (or yearly plan) and have 3 levels: Free, Sibelius Artist and Sibelius Ultimate. https://www.avid.com/sibelius |
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David DeLoach
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 12:54 pm
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Bill, I'm not sure about those versions. My laptop and its applications should probably be in a museum.
I just did this screen capture video showing how to create tab for a 12 string lap steel. I'd be glad to help anyone out with Sibelius as I've spent some time with it.
https://youtu.be/GXxKQJqlxO4
_________________
https://www.MasterGuitarists.com/ |
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Bill McCloskey
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 1:13 pm
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| Thanks for doing that David. Your version must predate 2018, when they switched over to monthly plans and you can't purchase it outright anymore. Looks like this is Sibelius Ultimate, the $200 a year package. |
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Guy Cundell
From:
More idle ramblings from South Australia
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Posted 22 Sep 2022 9:13 pm
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| Actually, you can purchase Sibelius outright. I chose to do so when upgrading to the latest Mac OS. I was on Sibelius 8 but had to update. Versions 5 and above offer the same great facility for lap steel. I love it! It offers many advantages and continues to be easier to work on Tab than Dorico, the current leader in scoring. I updated so it didn't cost the earth but a new license would be pricy. Musescore looks like a great option at the right price. |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 23 Sep 2022 11:44 am
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I have been using Sibelius for about 20 years and I don't recommend it. Complicated and somewhat bloated. Plus there are all sorts of stupid problems because of the parent company Avid. It seems to randomly force you to re authorize and deal with a dongle iLok. They are pushing for a fully subscription based payment plan also. Plus there customer service which you will need when they lock you out is basically non existent. The attitude at Avid is "We don't care, we don't have to"
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Bob |
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David DeLoach
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 23 Sep 2022 12:54 pm
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| Bob Hoffnar wrote: |
| I have been using Sibelius for about 20 years and I don't recommend it. Complicated and somewhat bloated. Plus there are all sorts of stupid problems because of the parent company Avid. It seems to randomly force you to re authorize and deal with a dongle iLok. They are pushing for a fully subscription based payment plan also. Plus there customer service which you will need when they lock you out is basically non existent. The attitude at Avid is "We don't care, we don't have to" |
I'm still running ver. 6 which came out in 2009. It's been pretty stable, with no issues - hopefully that will continue for awhile.
_________________
https://www.MasterGuitarists.com/ |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 23 Sep 2022 10:12 pm
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| David DeLoach wrote: |
| Bob Hoffnar wrote: |
| I have been using Sibelius for about 20 years and I don't recommend it. Complicated and somewhat bloated. Plus there are all sorts of stupid problems because of the parent company Avid. It seems to randomly force you to re authorize and deal with a dongle iLok. They are pushing for a fully subscription based payment plan also. Plus there customer service which you will need when they lock you out is basically non existent. The attitude at Avid is "We don't care, we don't have to" |
I'm still running ver. 6 which came out in 2009. It's been pretty stable, with no issues - hopefully that will continue for awhile. |
David, after version 6 things got weird and they keep getting weirder. Be careful with your OS if you want to stay functional. I regret updating past 6.
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Bob |
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Guy Cundell
From:
More idle ramblings from South Australia
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Posted 24 Sep 2022 3:08 am
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Version 7 of Sibelius was the last major update in which they instituted a ribbon directory at the top, just like Word. It takes a bit of getting used to but it's fine.
The reason that it was the last major update is that it was then that the new owners, Avid, sacked the British development team. Clearly, they saw it as a cash cow. Screw them!
It was originally written for the British Acorn computer platform, now defunct, I guess, and it has some illogical architecture that was never sorted out. The development team headed off to Steinberg and had the luxury of designing a new app from the ground up, with the knowledge of all the pitfalls that they had encountered with Sibelius. Hence, their new software Dorico is superior to Sibelius in almost every way EXCEPT steel guitar tablature, which has remained the same in Sibelius since version 4, I think.
What makes it the best available software (that I know of) for steel guitar?
Firstly, you can create your own templates with however many strings you wish.
Secondly, you can copy and paste from any stave or tab to any other stave or tab. That means you can put in notes and then paste them to tab or visa versa. ie, you can make notation from Tab though I generally work the other way around.
Thirdly, notes on the tab can be dragged from string to string with the correct fret for the pitch on the new string. This is invaluable for editing arrangements and when combined with point 2 above you can see how passages on one tuning can be achieved on another.
These things make it a very powerful piece of kit, very quick once you are familiar with it and well worth the effort to learn. That said, here in Australia we start kids of 12 years on it so it isn't that difficult. |
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