Struggling to make decent quality sounds

Jake Bopp · From: Tallahassee, FL

If you look at my induction date to the forum, you'll see I've been around a little while. I mostly came here for the buy/sell/trade game, but in time learned to love the instrument. I didn't even care for country until maybe five years ago? I'm predominately a metal/rock guitar player ( Laughing

)

I've had several steels now, getting into it, getting discouraged, selling stuff off, etc. I've been repeating this cycle for the last couple years. Steel is nearly impossible to learn for me, without some sort of musical backing. I'm not good at it, so I'm very shy about playing with anyone. I know the instrument itself very well, know how it functions, the sum of the parts making the total working steel. I understand it. The major roadblock in my psyche here is that hardly anything I play sounds quite -right- to my ears. The steel is perfectly in tune, E9th, but the chords always sound somewhat off. I can just loop a guitar chord, and follow it with steel, and it's always perceptibly off. Is it just my hands? I've watched it on an accurate tuner, the tuner shows perfectly in tune.

Am I just overthinking it? I desperately would like to progress at this instrument, I think I have fair fundamental understanding of it (but the musical background of a metal guitarist... so none at all Sad

) My usual go to of just banging my head into something until it sounds good isn't working for me. What do I do? If I could find a local 1 to 1 instructor, that'd probably get through to me, but so far online lessons just leave me with chops that I can't apply because I don't really understand the application.

Please help!

Thanks, Jake

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Tuners help you tune; they don't do a thing as far as helping you play. No, that's not uncommon that you're having pitch issues. What you have to do is develop your "ear". Look, regular guitar is really easy, tune it with a tuner, and just about everything you hit sounds fairly good. That's because it's an instrument of fixed pitch, so the mechanical design makes the battle half-won when you start. Not so with pedal steel, or even non-pedal steel for that matter. It's an instrument of variable pitch, and what has to happen is that you have to constantly make micro-adjustments of the bar for it to sound good with whatever you're playing along with. And that's not easy! Whoa!

I'd recommend just playing along with songs on your radio, albums, smartphone, or what have you, and play very simple stuff at first, while listening very carefully. Play just chords at first, or just a few notes until they sound good. Do it at least an hour every day. It's only through constant repetition, unending trial and error, and hundreds of hours of playing time that anyone gets through this part of the challenge.

You might also find someone who plays, and get some one-on-one (in-person) lessons. That will help you tremendously. (Much of the online stuff is way too advanced for someone starting out and having pitch problems.)

Good luck! Mr. Green

Steve Leal · From: Orange CA, USA

I used to tune straight up with a standard chromatic tuner. When I decided to try a Peterson tuner that had tempered tuning programmed as a preset “SE9” for 10 string E9th, it made a world of difference for me instantly. Have you tried one yet? I found on my steel that the preset was pretty spot on when tuning both open notes, and pulls. When I raise Es to Fs, I tune the F’s a bit sharper than the preset.

Frank Freniere · From: The First Coast

What Donny and Steve said.

Also, when you’re playing along with your practice songs stick to 2–string harmonies, e.g., strings 3 & 5 and 4 & 6. Adding another string to make a fuller chord can be tricky on the ear. Plus the 2-string grips will force you to use the C pedal more.

Daniel Bailey · From: Massachusetts, USA

I've also definitely noticed this. I'll put on something like Hank Williams Greatest Hits and just play along using the middle 6 strings, making 2-note chords as suggested. The fret markers are mere suggestions and you have to compensate for where the chord actually is.

Stefan Robertson · From: Hertfordshire, UK

Like any instrument

If you want to play well and know what and how to play scratch the first 5 years off as learning to play.

Guitar you can play in a year but you can't play guitar well in a year next to high level musicians. So understand it takes time like anything else. No shortcuts or magic bullet.

Know your fretboard and on pedal steel your changes (what changes what). I play 12 string lap steel and daily I still have to keep looking at the fretboard notes and intervals layout. Imagine my toilet time I look like Buddy Emmons on his album cover. Constantly staring at the fretboard. So even when I'm not playing I'm learning.

The better you understand this the faster you can start to commit it to muscle memory.

Or brute force it and noodle around - not know exactly what you're playing - learn by ear but add an additional 10 years to the learning curve like others.

All instruments are the same. No shortcuts.Enjoy the journey. Very Happy

_________________
Stefan
Bill Hatcher custom 12 string Lap Steel Guitar
E13#9/F secrets: https://thelapsteelguitarist.wordpress.com

"Give it up for The Lap Steel Guitarist"

Jake Bopp · From: Tallahassee, FL

I think another problem that was mentioned, I'm very visual in terms of where I'm putting the bar, so the idea of the lines being a mere suggestion sorta hurts. I will record a video and pop it up on YouTube to maybe give you guys a little better example. I haven't moved into arpeggios or anything, I'm simply just trying to swell into chords and move them around.

As far as a tuner, I use a Peterson Strobostomp, very highly regarded.

I have serious trouble with the index and middle picks, as well. Thumb pick I'm accustomed to, it feels natural. I would say that I'm a very grabby player, so the index and middle with no feeling breaks my concentration.

Marco Schouten · From: Amsterdam, The Netherlands

Also, don't forget that you're looking at the bar and fret markers from an angle. When the bar seems to be exactly on the marker, it's not. Place your eyes straight above the bar and put it exactly on a fret marker, than move your head to your normal playing position and see where the bar appears to be.
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JCH SD-10 with BL XR-16 pickup, Sho-Bud Volume Pedal, Evidence Audio Lyric HG cables, Quilter Steelaire combo

Bobby Hearn · From: Henrietta, Tx

FYI, Some of those old songs aren’t exactly true to frets, not sure why unless they they juiced them in the studio. They’ll be a quarter step difference.
Also what Marco said. If you’re playing at the third fret, the bar will look like it’s to the left of the fret when it’s straight over it.

Andrew Goulet · Posted 9 Sep 2022 8:56 am

Maybe try putting on a cello drone (find them on YouTube) in any key and play the root note on different strings and frets all over the fretboard. Adding a metronome in is a bonus. Focus on playing just the root in tune with the drone. Try to play just that, as perfect as possible, for a set amount of time (10 minutes, etc...)

You can move through the scale, as well.

I feel mostly ok about my intonation, but I try to remember to come back to this exercise regularly, to remind myself of how each fret "feels" in tune.
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Marlen S12 and a ZT Club

K Maul · From: Hadley, NY/Hobe Sound, FL

Wear your fingerpicks around the house a bit, even when not practicing. They will become more a part of you- not numb. I’ve been doing this so long that I feel the strings right through the picks now.
You might try what Buddy E did. Practice in the dark! You’ll develop a sixth sense.
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KEVIN MAUL: Airline, Beard, Clinesmith, Donner, Evans, Excel, Fender, Fluger, GFI, Gibson, Hilton, Ibanez, Justice, K+K, Live Strings, MOYO, National, Oahu, Peterson, Quilter, Rickenbacher, Sho~Bud, Supro, TC, Ultimate, VHT, Williams, X-otic, Yamaha, ZKing.

Michael Sawyer · From: North Carolina, USA

When you say you sound bad-
Flat? Sharp? Bad harmonic tones? No sustain?Choppy sounding?
Cause i had all them issues when i first started.

Describe what you hear,if you will...

Michael Hill · From: Arizona, USA

It could be your guitar. I struggled with sour chords early on. I eventually discovered my problem was cabinet drop. It took a while to find this as when I tuned my changers I was only looking at the string being changed. Here's what I discovered that helped me get in tune:

When activating A & F, string 6 would go flat due to cabinet drop.

When activating A & B, string 8 would go flat due to cabinet drop.

My workaround was to install compensators on strings 6 & 8.

Andy Henriksen · From: Michigan, USA

I think it’s a good sign that you hear that your playing is “off.” That means you will be able to tell when it’s “on.” Some musicians don’t know when they are flat or otherwise not sounding musical.

I have no idea what you are playing and how, but it’s always way easier to make micro adjustments to your left hand when you are only playing two notes at a time. If you are defaulting to three note grips to play chords frequently, try dropping one of the three notes. Then you can “tune” the other two notes by adjusting the bar angle ever-so slightly out of perpendicular. If something still sounds off, work on one note at a time.

With three note grips, you lose the ability to individually intonate the notes in real time, so guitar set up becomes more critical.

And, really, in most applications, less is more, and it sounds more steel guitar-ey, with double stops, rather than full chords.

Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

Get in touch and I’ll show you how I deal with that same problem on a FaceTime or video chat. It’s pretty straight forward once you know what to listen for.
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Bob

Rick Heins · From: Phoenix, AZ

Larry Jamieson · From: Walton, NY USA

Make sure when you are playing that your bar is straight in line with the frets. If it is slanted a bit, you will be out of tune. Make sure when your press pedals and knee levers that they are fully engaged. Somebody else mentioned that when playing with a recording, you may have to place your bar slightly ahead of or behind a fret marker to find proper intonation. Your ear will tell you when you find the proper point. Good luck, hope you stick with it and begin to enjoy it.

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