Buddy Cage's 1970s E9 Copedent

Tom Brooks · From: Melbourne, Australia

Howdy folks, I was wondering if anyone had an idea of what changes Buddy Cage was using on his E9 neck during the '70s for all those classic NRPS records? I've done a bit of a deep dive and haven't found much aside from copedents for his later steels, I have a vague memory of it being in the Winnie Winston book but for the life of me I can't find my copy!

If anyone can shed some light on this for me it would be greatly appreciated!

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Here's the Cage setup according to Winston:-

It could be described as straightforward-with-additions. I have a question in return - what is P4 for? It gives Eb9 when D9 is only a fret away on P6. There must be more to it than that. My old 60s D10 had signs of it but it had been replaced. Strangely, Jimmy Crawford (the next entry in the list) had it on P9 and Doug Jernigan is also shown as having it, but I don't think I've seen it anywhere else and no-one mentions it nowadays.
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Tom Brooks · From: Melbourne, Australia

Many thanks Ian! As to your question re P4 it's a mystery to me too, my only thought is that it was a legacy change that he'd not thought to change or perhaps it was ergonomically convenient for a particular phrase or lick? Honestly I haven't examined Buddy's C6 playing in great detail, the bits and pieces I've come across have been mostly Charleton-esque single note solo work.

Roger Rettig · From: Naples, FL

That pedal 4 looks very close to Doug Jernigan's #4. From what I can see, Doug's also gives him an Eb9.

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Not just close but identical as I noted above!

Perhaps it's like P8 in that you seldom use the whole thing but use the 7th string raise a lot. Maybe this mystery change was mostly used to raise 6, but with three raises and only one lower it may have been a bit heavy.
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Roger Rettig · From: Naples, FL

Sorry, Ian: I missed that. I read your opening remark and studied the chart, saw the similarity and posted.

I'd been giving that change some thought lately and had concluded that it's not a change I'm ready for. My P8 is seldom used; this could fall into the same category.

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

I hardly use P8 either as I have the 7th string raise on a lever. If I ever commissioned another guitar I'd leave it off.
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Jordan Siden · From: Nashville, TN

New-ish to the steel guitar, getting really in to Buddy Cage these days. I like the way this copedent is written, but I want to make sure I understand it.

Do the arrows refer to the knees depending on the left or right side of the page? For example, in the chart above, does LKL lower string 2, LKR lower string 5, RKL raise E, and RKR lower E? I've tried looking around for other handwritten charts with arrows like this one, but wasn't able to compare this to anything after a quick search.

My first and only guitar, a single neck Marlen, came with I think what's known as the knees switched (LKL lowers E; RKL raises E, more below), which I understand is not the most common. I love my set up though, it was explained to me Paul Franklin happens to use it, too.

To the best of my understanding it's more typical to have the E's both on the left knee, and it looks like Buddy's are completely flipped, on his right knee??

I'd love to learn more about naming conventions for common set ups, including mine:

LKL - E's raised
LKR - string 1 (+2); string 2 (+1); string 7 (+2)
RKL - E's lowered
RKR - [mine is a bit broken, but I believe:] string 2 (-1/-2)

Thanks very much!!

Roger Rettig · From: Naples, FL

Yes, the arrows indicate which way the KL is pushed (arrow straight-up means a vertical lever).

Moving the Es on different 'knees' is a much-debated topic. I fail to see why one would limit one's options by splitting them. I raise my Es (LKR) and lower them LKL. I will never need to use them together so it makes sense to me to have them on the same side.

It's common now (and VERY useful) to have your RKR also lowering the 9th string to C#.
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Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

My reason for splitting the Es is simple. In the A/F position I can drop the third smoothly without there being a notch where your knee is pressing neither lever.

It's important to me to be able to drop the third in all three positions (I lower 6 to F# on LKL, raise Es on LKR and lower them on RKR)
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Roger Rettig · From: Naples, FL

Sorry, Ian: I shouldn't have said 'I fail to see...'. I do understand that view.

I find I can move smoothly through that change (raise/off/lower the Es with pedals down) by sliding my left knee right-to-left.

In any case, we all have slightly different musical priorities.
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Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Jordan Siden · From: Nashville, TN

Roger Rettig · From: Naples, FL

Hi, Jordan.

I don't think there's a name as such. On E9, we mostly just differentiate between 'Day' or 'Emmons' (CBA or ABC respectively); of course, whether you have one or the other 0edal setup will affect placement of KLs.

Going into more detail, we might discuss variations (such as splitting the Es as discussed) but, apart from archaic references to the early Sho-Bud practice (I think Es were lowered on the right knee at Sho-Bud), we'd just say 'Emmons or Day'.

Basically, the columns on the left of BC's E9 chart show the left knee, the ones to to the right, the right knee.
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Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Tommy Mc · From: Middlesex VT

Jordan, there are a couple of ways to chart out copedents. The above one for Buddy Cage is more of a graphic representation from the viewpoint of a seated player. The arrows on the left side represent the left knee, pedals in the middle, and the arrows on the right are for the right knee. Another way of charting the changes relies more on labels LKL, LKV, LKR for left knees, and RKL, RKR for right knees. Since they're named, they don't have to be shown in their relative positions. If you check out common copedents in the Forum "Links" section, you'll see that the pedals are to the left and all knees are off to the right side (but labeled).

With regard to the position of the E's, I guess "split E's" is about the closest we have to naming your setup. There have been polls here showing that E's on the left is the most common arrangement, but there are some of us (myself included) who split their E's for various reasons. In my case, that's how I learned, and muscle memory is pervasive. As you noted, Paul Franklin also splits his E's, so we're in good company. https://b0b.com/wp/copedents/paul-franklins-e9th-copedent/ I'm a little confused, because you described your Marlin as lowering the E's on LKL, but then later said LKL raises the E's. I suspect it's a misprint, but if you have the standard ABC Emmons setup on the pedals, you'll want LKL to be the raise. If your setup is as you noted:
LKL - E's raised
LKR - string 1 (+2); string 2 (+1); string 7 (+2)
RKL - E's lowered
RKR - [mine is a bit broken, but I believe:] string 2 (-1/-2)

I wouldn't change much except to fix RKR. It's common to lower string 9 with that same change. If you're looking to get some of the same changes as Buddy Cage, you might consider adjusting LKR to raise 1 & 7 to G rather than G#.
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Jordan Siden · From: Nashville, TN

Very much appreciate your thorough response, Tommy. You're correct, LKL lowering E is a typo: my LKL is a raise, my RKL lowers. (I love my split E's!!)

The main impetus behind my question was surprise that Buddy Cage has his E's on his right knee, and wanting to clarify that I correctly understood the chart I was reading. Like I've mentioned, I'm relatively new, but figured that if the knees aren't split, I would expect them to be both on the left.

As far as I gather (thanks to Roger's response), I understand that Buddy Cage was playing a guitar with an old school Sho Bud set up: E's on the right. Not exactly inconceivable, but, not what I expected!

Can't help but wonder what that implies about his introduction to the instrument and early development as a player (assuming he learned with that setup), and to what degree the knees being on his right influenced his playing. So far, copping his stuff here and there with the setup I've got, I haven't run into any difficulties or impossibilities, yet.

Thank you all for taking the time to guide my curiosity and series of questions. It's very appreciated.

Jordan Siden · From: Nashville, TN

I should clarify: his stuff ain't easy, but so far, I haven't found my setup limiting.

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