What Is Your Niche?

Larry Johnson · From: Tennessee, USA

When you play in a band you have to play it all. Kick offs, breaks ,endings, and solos. But for me back up comes easiest. How about you ? Are you a soloist or accompanist primarily?

Will Ellis · From: Nashville TN, USA

Playing breaks is fun but I love exploring different accompaniment styles as well. I think I feel more joy during a show when I find a cool new way to comp than when I nail the break.
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Sho~Bud Professional D-10 (1972)
Fender Twin Reverb (1979)

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

I am a solo, chordal melody player.
I don't play licks. Very Happy

Erv

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Chris Brooks · From: Providence, Rhode Island

I have been working on my backup styling--chords, single low notes. Still, when it's time to play a lick, I attempt to play it.

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

Donny,
All I do is solo work, no need for licks.
Erv

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

When I play in a band, a duo or a trio, etc... I do what the LEADER wants me to do. Its kickoffs, turns, endings, solos, licks, whatever. I'm not limited and I don't put limits on what I can or should do. Very Happy

If they want me to play, fill up a song, thats what I do. If they want me to sit back and do very little, thats what I'll do .

IF they want me to pack up and go home, I'll do that too ! Laughing

_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders , Eastman Mandolin ,
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

I've heard some steelers play a song and they throw in SO much stuff that you can't recognize the melody, you don't know what they're playing. Whoa!

Erv

Dennis Detweiler · From: Solon, Iowa, US

Depends on the size of the band, type of music, studio vs live. It varies. Creative band or cover tunes. All in good taste.
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1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8.

Jon Voth · From: Virginia, USA

In my band I am all of those things. For classic country anyways. We go between guitarists and are losing ours currently so I am the standard as of now. I am relatively new so it has been a learning curve, which is good for me. Some guitarists can play bluesy over changes but don't know how to comp or strum or lay low.

I'm not quite adept like Erv at chordal melodies -I know my chords, but that is advanced. I'm getting there though.

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

Floyd Lowery · From: Deland, Florida, USA

I agree with everything Tony said. Back when I played it always depended on the band and what was needed. I think I got a lot of jobs because I knew when not to play as much as when and what to play.
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Carter 12 string 4petals 5knees, Mullen G2 3 petals 4 knees
Alesis QuadraVerb, Goodrich Match-Bro II
Peavy Nashville 400 & Session 500

Dennis Detweiler · From: Solon, Iowa, US

If worth our salt in a band a steel player should be able to take a ride and play the melody line with harmony notes. Keep the melody on top and the harmonies below if you know your neck, floor pedals and knee levers. Try playing a major scale with this in mind.
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1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8.

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

Dennis,
You are right.
I know some steelers who have been playing for many years who can't play the melody of a song, all they know are licks.
Erv

ajm · From: Los Angeles

WARNING!!!!! Sensing the opportunity for a rant and stress relief here............

Here's a couple of "niches" fer ya.

Show up on time.....or early.

Be pleasant and easy to deal with. Being sober is a key component here.

Have all of your gear, AND any spares/back up items.
Strings.
Cords.
Batteries.
Picks and bar.
A notebook and writing apparatus for jogging down chords and arrangements, in case you get asked back for another gig.
And maybe even a spare back up amp. It doesn't need to be a Dumble. Something bare bones and cheap off of Craigslist like an old Peavey Bandit. And not just for you, because Lord knows the guitar/bass/keyboard/etc player won't have one in case theirs goes down. Before the Covid virus infected peoples' brains and made them insane, and the supply chain became a factor, I saw Bandits on CL routinely for $30-$70.

Know the material as best you can. Get their set list ahead of time if possible.

Know when NOT to play. Steel IMO is not really a rhythm instrument. Fiddle and harmonica and sax are even LESS of rhythm instruments. It's Ok to not play.

While it's great to be able to play 3-4 note chordal solos and melody lines, you can probably 90% of the time get by with two notes or even a single note. It will get the point across.

If you happen to stumble and miss one of the criteria outlined above, you may be history.
Remember, Paul McCartney or Garth or _________ (fill in the blank) do not care how fast you can play a harmonic minor diminished scale over a flat 9 7th cemented chord.

Ok, back to our regularly scheduled programming.

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

Most of the time you're not playing for other steelers, just play what the audience wants to hear and they really don't give a hoot about fancy licks. Very Happy

Erv

Mike Neer · From: NJ

Gee, imagine if Buddy Emmons just stuck to the melody. Maybe he would have been a good player! Laughing

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

He was a great player and you could recognize the song he was playing.
Erv

Dennis Detweiler · From: Solon, Iowa, US

On Country or swing tunes, Buddy was good at tagging the end of his ride with an ear twisting lick to perk you up. Example: at the end his ride on Bottle Baby Boogie. He was just plain full of suspense and anticipation. Play it straight, then throw you a curve.
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1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

This innocent thread already has the distinct "scent" of a mine field.
I am unsure I can contribute without "stepping on one".

It's a highly subjective thing. And I just hope nobody throws the word "musicality"... I did 25 years ago, and it didn't go down to smooth (but I made 10-thousands post!).

I like to believe that I understand what Erv refers to. First he evidently made a statement about how HE feels he is living HIS music, and that was what I would have thought the thread was about.
Jeff Newman called upon all of us to "just play the melody"... and it was a bit of a challenge in how he brought that up. Because indeed, some who could get by playing "licks" would have struggled with playing the melody.
BE mentioned "clichés" often when trying to answer a question which was often put to him "what are you thinking?". I feel his answer "I don't really think" and the "cliché"-statement were in my opinion just a genius trying to "explain not thinking". His revolutionary work "Steel Guitar Jazz" album reflected much of what Jazz had become over the decades preceding his 1962 album... playing "PHRASES" over chord changes. I don't see that as licks... I truly believe, BE had by then developed the ability to improvise freely over typical "Sequences" like ii, V, I's over certain patterns (he called "pockets") without "thinking"... just by "knowing" his way around intuitively and thus being able to play his heart out. He himself mentioned "playing himself into a corner" every now and then, which is typical of Jazz improv.
Evidently, especially on E9th, many of the phrases he recorded became "licks" we all avidly tried to pick and incorporate in our playing.

My mother, who met Salvador Dali in the 50's in Barcelona, said "he could draw ANYTHING he wanted to". BE among only a very few others, not just PSG, had that capability in music.

I often go back to Maurice's "The Universal Way" gospel album... some may call it dated and a bit "cheesy"... but his playing was almost "free" of licks and even typical phrases. There is a LOT to study of that album, for me at least there is.

Steel players behind Hank Thompson, especially after very young Bob White set the "record" on his Bigsby for how to play behind the dearly missed Western Swing "Institution", was almost entirely based on licks, phrases and "clichés" and it was great!

So, there are different disciplines... or niches and none is more valid than the other... except when like Dali, you can paint just anything.

So where is my niche? (like anybody wants to know, Ha!)
I kind'a relate to Erv's approach, although I suspect with very different results.
I want to just play music on the greatest sounding instrument. I intentionally try to stay clear of "licks" but I am clearly practicing ii, V, I's and I, VI, ii V's etc.. in all positions and all key-centers, just trying to become fluid and natural in the pockets I find.
I try to voice-lead over changes, playing longer phrases rather than over a chord and then another phrase over the next chord.
I like complex chords which feel "lofty" or putting one to hover "an inch over the floor" and therefore added the 3rd finger pick (plus thumb) to be able to selectively grab certain strings over the whole width of my neck. I get the sound I want.

I listen to a lot of Bebop and HardBop as well as "cool"-Jazz and NeoSoul and also "big" Gospel music (which has a LOT of Soul and Neo Soul and Jazz elements and is big on big chords.) rather than "steel guitar" music.
And try to do those music styles on my S12 C6th PSG which has as many changes as a U12 would have (but no dedicated "E9th"-emulating changes).

I have long tried to play and sound like my heroes... Speedy, Jerry, BE, Lloyd... and even after having been able to once do a pretty good "BE Christmas Album", I really totally given up on that. I think that more than "given up", come to my senses and realized that IF there was ONE thing I could do LIKE THEM, was to create my own style or even lazier, let my playing grow into my own style naturally. And since my return to PSG now about 2 year, it's been the most rewarding ride on steel strings I've had since I started out on A6th non-pedal without knowing was "A6th" was.

Be yer'self-"niche". ... J-D.
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Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"

A Little Mental Health Warning:

Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.

I say it humorously, but I mean it.

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

I happen to think Erv's discussion is quite important. Its not any sort of dissing thing, nothing like that. BUT, my NICHE may not be anywhere close to someone else's Niche. I'm probably right in the middle of the pack with ability.

And thats the looming question, what is our ABILITY ? Regarding melody, can we actually transfer the melody to the instrument "cold" or do we have to go home and woodshed.

I am one who after doing this for decades, I am fortunate, I can transfer melody to the the guitar or Steel fretboard. I guess I can "hear" the music and apply it, well anyway, thats what they say.

There are many among us who can sit with an instrument and after a short period, can "SEE" the music. Yet, there are also many among us, any and all instruments , who can sit for YEARS and never see the music, even after continued study. Thats not really a bad thing .

Instruments such as the Steel , Guitars , etc, have POCKETS directly in front of us. Thats where the MUSIC lives. IF we can hum the melody and understand the POCKETS and relationships, we can probably pull off the melody lines cold, or float around something close. IF we don't understand the pockets and relationships, then probably not. Its just what it is.

How many of us have played with other players who never came close to playing a melody line but played dazzling licks over and over again ? Many times the same licks. How many of us WERE that player ? I'm pretty certain I was that player for a long time , not because I couldn't SEE the music, but more likely I was ignoring it and/or avoiding it. Melody is boring, hot licks are, well, hot licks. But then one day a band leader or another player says-- Hey Dude, can you just stick to the melody ? So we do, and another journey begins. We begin to weave melody and other phrases together around the melody . Maybe we even begin to recognize additional pockets. We even get hooked . Probably the biggest offenders of not sticking to melody or anything close are guitar players ( I R one by the way ) we go off on tangents trying to impress everyone around us trying to emulate Brent. LOL Laughing

Emmons, well thats not a fair comparison. He was Buddy. OF the many times I was able to see Buddy play, even in band settings, he just played the right stuff at the right time. I suspect that Buddy had so much music in his head that he wanted to transfer to the Steel, there wasn't near enough time on a gig or show to accomplish it !

Where am I going with all this ? A Niche is something we have individually , we may have similar Niches , but maybe not. We live and play in our own comfort zone whatever that may be. We play what we can play, we do the best we can. We are all not equal and we are not supposed to be !
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders , Eastman Mandolin ,
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website

Dennis Detweiler · From: Solon, Iowa, US

Yep, normally, we strive to bring our niche up a notch. When our niche doesn't notch up. It's not a lost niche. There's always a notch up waiting in our niche. In conclusion: Just keep trying to notch up your niche and you'll be fine.
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1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8.

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

T.D. and Tony,
Some very good comments and much appreciated!
I guess it just boils down to: "different strokes for different folks". Very Happy

Erv

Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

My niche mostly depends on what the market is.
Singer songwriter :sensitive support,
Pop band: orchestrated color , creative solos
Rock band : no brakes wild and doubling of parts
Americana and outlaw country: out of tune cliches
Experimental music: listen listen listen and wait then blend or juxtapose
Classic county: classic county licks

In NYC it was all about staying out of the way and being supportive of the singer. You do good and you make your way into sessions.

In Texas I need to play more flashy and loud than I like to for the bar gigs.

For keeping gigs it’s best if the band thinks that whatever music they play is your special niche.
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Bob

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