Gibson BR-1 Ultratone on its way!

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

Arriving next Monday is Blanche DuQuesne (pronounced "DuKane"), born 1948. Distant relative of Sir Dystic D'Arcy. After a very boring and demeaning stint posing for pictures on Reverb, she will be hanging out chez moi on the West Coast. Although grew up during the '50s, has never been known to wear hair curlers in public- or use a Hula hoop!

Although prices are up on these compared to a few years ago, I decided to order a BR-1. By today's prices, seems like a good deal at $950, plus $50 shipping from PA- assuming there are not serious flaws the seller opted not to disclose. And it looks cleaner than many others I saw for more $. But missing the cool coral bridge cover. If I like this lap steel, it will help me put together a clone. The clear plastic tone cut knob is no longer clear like the other two- any advice on how to polish? I was thinking TR-3 automotive finish restorer. I was not able to find anything same as this knob new on internet.

Jack Hanson · From: San Luis Valley, USA

You'll be glad you opted for an Ultratone instead of a Skylark. The fragile hinged covers look ultra cool, but are a nuisance. Many if not most have broken off over the course of 70 years. Some of those old knobs discolor, and some do not. Originals sometimes show up, but nice ones are spendy. Enjoy your new Ultratone!

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

Glenn Wilde · From: California, USA

Killer, i had one a long time ago, traded it away for a Bakelite that i traded away for a '50 Fender Deluxe 8 that i still have, whew! I never did figure out why it had three knobs...

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

Jack Hanson · From: San Luis Valley, USA

Kip, if you need to replace pots, be sure to order replacements with long shafts, like those commonly marketed for Les Pauls. Short-shaft pots won't work in the white Ultratones and black Centurys. On the dozen or so that I've rewired, I've used standard (as opposed to reverse audio) long split-shaft CTS 500K pots, and they sound fine to me. Some folks wire them up with a single tone control, leaving the second one as a dummy. I've followed Steve Ahola's 1948 Century wiring diagram with excellent results:

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

Jack:

Good info- didn't know needed to be long shaft. You did not use audio taper?

I'm gonna order one just to have on hand if I decide to replace it.

Jack Hanson · From: San Luis Valley, USA

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

Jack:

So my 1948 Gibson Ultratone arrived, and it's way better than I thought. By far best condition compared to others currently on Reverb. Don't know why I hesitated. Of course, there is the issue of no plastic pickup cover and one faded plastic tone knob.

The wiring looks original- and rather than patch in a new pot or two, it occurred to me it would be best to remove the whole harness with minimal unsoldering, and leave it for some future owner to deal with. I would just rather start from scratch, and build a whole new wire system and make it as original as possible. I cant make heads or tails of the way the tone control action is supposed to be, and would have a lot better chance with all new. Looks like any soldering attempts at these old corroded parts would get ugly.

So: so these bodies were actually white when new? This is obviously cream/off-white/blonde. The listing picture on Reverb made it look actually white.

What is your favorite version of Ultratone/Century family?

The salmon tuning knobs are in excellent shape- can't believe it. I'm worried they'll break- but starting to think they're pretty tough. Are they? I lubed the tuning machines with some DuPont Teflon dry lube and are working pretty smooth- so I'm not applying a lot of twisting torque when tuning.

Ryan Lunenfeld · From: Colorado, USA

Good luck with it! I'm curious to hear what you think about it's tone. I've been curious about the Ultratone series.

And now is a good time to pick up a lap steel, it seems like they're going up in price. I've been looking for a b6 for a bit, and last year the prices seemed to be about $1000 on average. Now it seems hard to find one under $1500!

What are the main differences in the early ultratones vs the others? without having to consult *the book*...mainly concerned about tonality differences than simple mechanical differences.
_________________
-Gibson EH185-Rickenbacker Silver Hawaiian-Melobar Powerslide 88-Fender deluxe 6 - Bronson Melody King -Fouke Industrial Purple Menace-Hudson Resonator lap thing-Vega something or other-

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

Jack Hanson · From: San Luis Valley, USA

Kip, I have four of the white Ultratones, and only one has its original electronics intact. Even though the controls are a little hincky, it sounds superb, so I haven't done a thing besides fabricate a new mounting plate for the output jack. This one is tuned to standard C6.

One is a 7-string that somewhere along the line had been butchered by a previous owner with inexplicable mods too numerous to list here. I took the liberty of doing a radical rebuild, with two custom Stringmaster-style 7-string pickups, and standard Stringmaster wiring with volume, tone, and blend pots. I set this one up for A6 -- high E and low A.

The third one was similar to what you describe, with corroded wiring, and pots that performed poorly if at all, but a good pickup. I replaced the pots, caps, and jack, and wired it to the specs in Steve Ahola's Century wiring diagram. It also had the issue you describe with the high pickup/low bridge. I raised the bridge by adding successive layers of StewMac aluminum shielding material under the bridge to achieve the proper height. I'm generally a C6 player, so I set this one up with the same intervals tuned down to G6. It's a real growler.

Number four is undergoing a complete overhaul as I type. I got it pretty cheap, as it was a mess. The paint would flake off just from looking at it, somebody at some point apparently spilled a (rum and?) coke in it; the pickup was shorted, the mounting plate was corroded, and the controls were frozen. I had Sentell's in Sacramento rewind the pickup, I found a plating shop to re-chrome the mounting plate, and I've finished the color coats, and plan to install an aftermarket decal on the headstock today. I hope to begin spraying clear coats this afternoon or tomorrow -- weather permitting. Someday I hope to obtain a good original fretboard.

https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=372490

All of the first generation Ultratones were white to the best of my knowledge. I've seen photos of a gold sparkle UT that was supposedly a prototype. Most if not all have yellowed to varying degrees over the course of seventy-some years. No two of my four are/were exactly the same tone of white. Gibson's postwar lap steels are notorious for losing their finish. Obviously, the factory did not pay the same attention to detail with the finish work of their lap steels as they did on their archtops and flattops.

The Klusons with the rectangular pinkish buttons have held up through the years reasonably well, the exact opposite can be said for the identical tuners with the white plastic buttons.

My favorites are the two that are occupying my Deluxe34 double stand at any given moment. But if I had to choose only two to keep, I would have a hard time parting with the black Century-6 with original electronics, and the rescue '58 Ultratone -- even though I'm not crazy about its narrow string spacing, the thing sounds fabulous. My beat-up Century Deluxe with the stoptail deserves an honorable mention. Sounds great, plays great, and sustain a-go-go.
Some observations:

* The white Ultratones and black Century's are virtually identical with the exceptions of the fragile Plexiglas covers and their body paint. They sound more alike than different.
* The cream-topped, mahogany-bodied Ultratones sound different than the blue, maple-bodied Centurys.
* The blue Centurys sound different than the blue Century Deluxes, which feature the stop-tail wraparound bridge.
* The '57 - '59 humbucker-equipped Ultratones sound different than all the rest. And they play differently too, because the PAF pickup's poles are spaced tighter than both the lap steel version P-90s, and the original wide-oval/racetrack pickups (arguably my favorites) -- which in turn required a new bridge with much tighter string spacing.

I've never played a brown Ultratone, a pink Century, or a red, mahogany Century from the mid-sixties.

Mike Schway · From: Washington, USA

[quote="Jack Hanson"]
Some observations:

* The white Ultratones and black Century's are virtually identical with the exceptions of the fragile Plexiglas covers and their body paint. They sound more alike than different.
* The cream-topped, mahogany-bodied Ultratones sound different than the blue, maple-bodied Centurys.
* The blue Centurys sound different than the blue Century Deluxes, which feature the stop-tail wraparound bridge.
* The '57 - '59 humbucker-equipped Ultratones sound different than all the rest. And they play differently too, because the PAF pickup's poles are spaced tighter than both the lap steel version P-90s, and the original wide-oval/racetrack pickups (arguably my favorites) -- which in turn required a new bridge with much tighter string spacing.

Jack,
Is it possible to describe in words the sound differences between the 40s wide oval and the 50s P90? (tone, strength, hum)?

Thanks

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

Thanks Jack for the great info.

You mentioned mahogany bodies. But mine (1948 BR-1) is maple... right? It's pretty heavy at 7 lbs, 10 oz.

I'm starting to search for a set of pots for this guy. Since I'm not sure whether or not it's important to find reverse audio taper pots, I'm looking for RAT. So happens that even normal audio taper long, split shaft pots are sold out on a lot of sites. I hadn't yet decided to just make a complete new harness last week, and I ordered one of the regular audio taper pots (CTS-686)- I think from AllParts. Now gonna order vintage shielded wire and some more pots- caps too. Reverse audio taper if possible.

So your favorite is the "Racetrack" PU? That's the one that's on mine, right? (in that picture, you can see the ⅛" aluminum riser plate I made for under the bridge)

Jack Hanson · From: San Luis Valley, USA

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

So I have a new CTS EP 0686 a long shaft split post 500K audio taper pot from AllParts to check to see if it fits, but it is too short. The original pot has a reach of 1 ⅜" from the mounting shoulder- the CTS reach is 1 ⅛". Overall height is also ¼" taller on the original. I also prefer the OE pot because the splined area on the shaft that engages the knob is longer and would help to prevent striping out. But the CTS pots had smaller diameter body, and would make the assembly much neater and easy. I have some ID numbers off the OE pot: 0.5 MEG CE VC 16289 IRC214 (could be LRC214). Also attached are some pictures.

In the process of doing this research, something happened- there is an open circuit somewhere. Now, since I'm not sure if there is a quality replacement pot available, instead of replacing the pots, caps, and wiring, I'm considering trying to remove the harness and salvage the parts- tossing the wiring. Some non-OE wiring was done, and I'd much rather start from scratch. The large bodies of the pots and caps make the cavity quite cramped. Very carefully remove solder and corrosion, disassemble, clean, and test pots and caps. Do complete rewire with shielded vintage wire.

I'm going to start searching for quality pot replacements now. As far as caps, I have a nice Russian K40Y-9 PIO(?) 0.033 uF- but 0.001 uF is not typical.

For jollies, I connected the jack straight to the pickup with new wire with negative leads grounded to the mounting plate and assembled without the bridge spacer that I made to raise the strings. Controlled volume/tone with the amp. WOW! Any audio circuit benefits from removal of stuff in the signal path. Very clear ringing voice thru the '64 Super Reverb. 8.04k DC Ohms across pickup leads.

I'm also gonna start trying to decipher the codes on the pots to see about a replacement and get a date. Any help appreciated.

Everything I've found coincides with Steve Ahola's thread. If I find a good replacement pot, I will add info to that thread.

Kip Duff · From: California, USA

Answering my own questions here.

Removed entire wiring harness with pots and caps. There is no more writing on the pots than what I've already seen. "VC 16289" is probably a product code/part number. "IRC 214" identifies the manufacturer by name and manufacturer code: 214 is the code for IRC (International Resistance Corporation). Apparently, there just plain ain't no date codes on Blanche's pots.

After looking at the new CTS pot- and comparing it to the IRCs that were in the guitar, I realized that the old ones looked considerably better constructed. There's no comparison. Also, I noticed on eBay that people were paying considerable amounts of $ to put these "vintage" pots in their guitars. No-brainer to use the original pots if they work. Deoxit D5 in the pots and reinstalled them- but eliminated the treble bypass (0.001 uF) circuit just to keep things simple-left the pot in place for safe-keeping. Used unshielded cloth covered wire. The tone knob works, but it's kinda steep- most of the action in the first ¼ turn. I have a capacitance meter, but didn't take the time to check the 0.022 uF cap- later project.

Jack Hanson · From: San Luis Valley, USA

Greg Forsyth · From: Colorado, USA

Hi Kip,
What a great name for a beautiful steel guitar. Sounds like a nice journey your on getting to know Blanche, and your picking up quite a bit of knowlege in the process. Awesome!

Hi Jack,
You mentioned having Jerry Sentell rebuild one of your pickups, and I think you've also purchased new PUPs from him also. A question please, is the replacement pickup Sentell builds for BR-6 & 9 similiar to the oval / racetrack pickups that you and Kip are discussing?

Sentell builds a P90 style PUP named Tennessee Honey that I installed in my first built lap steel and love the sound of it so much I had him build me one for an 8 string that I'm building.

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