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Topic: Franklin Guitars |
Rex Lindsey
From:
Ellisville, MS USA
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Posted 18 Oct 2021 3:31 pm |
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I have a SERIOUS QUESTION AND WOULD LIKE AN SERIOUS ANSWER. Why is a Franklin selling for twice what everything is ??
$5,500 is the price of a G2---- when it is just a copy of a Sho-Bud ------ maybe the best copy ever but still a copy of a Sho-Bud. Updated material but still a copy of a Sho-Bud. In fact over 1/2 of the pedal steels ever made are/were made by people who once worked for Sho-Bud. If someone will pay you a million dollars for it more power to you. But day in and day out there is no way it is twice as good as other top line steels. If I get kicked off here asking a question well have at it. It is a serious question. Everyone love Paul Franklin Sr. & Jr. ---- but Sho-Bud LDG have never sold for anything like that ?????
Everyone will just get mad ---- take an asprin. |
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Douglas Schuch
From:
Valencia, Philippines
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Posted 18 Oct 2021 4:19 pm
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| Quote: |
| I have a SERIOUS QUESTION AND WOULD LIKE AN SERIOUS ANSWER. Why is a Franklin selling for twice what everything is ?? |
It's called a "free market", and illustrates supply and demand. They sell for that much because people are willing to pay that much. We can debate if it's "just a copy" of a Sho-Bud, if it is superior to other pedal steels (I do know a lot of pros use Franklins for recording, feeling like the recorded tone is superior to other instruments), etc etc. But the fact is that's a pretty reasonable price for a Franklin based on my casual observations in the past. Too much for you? Don't buy it!
Beyond that, though it is considered bad form to post such concerns on a "for sale" post - this has been reiterated repeatedly here on the forum. A general question such as yours should be posted in the "Pedal Steel" section. And, of course, the seller may request the moderators to remove your comment (and my reply) as irrelevant to his particular item for sale.
I wish the seller good luck with his sale. I'd love to play a Franklin someday!
_________________
Bringing steel guitar to the bukid of Negros Oriental! |
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Dustin Elmore
From:
North Mississippi
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Posted 18 Oct 2021 4:22 pm franklin
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| Well, there's plenty of searchable threads on the question at hand, and they all end about the same.. personal preferance. This looks to be a fantastic guitar and if I were in the market, would really consider. |
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Jon Zimmerman
From:
California, USA
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Posted 18 Oct 2021 6:28 pm Stereo?
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| If I may, one unique feature of some Franklin builds, not mentioned in Duke’s initial print, is the stereo output plugs, enabling a pair of amps to be run ( and is that Vol. Pedal the Franklin stereo as well?) No factory Sho Bud set ups came that way, far as I know. Duke, you should let any potential buyers know of this ‘extra feature’, if so equipped. GLWTS 😎 |
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rick andrews
From:
Westminster Co 80031
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Posted 18 Oct 2021 8:54 pm
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| Rex, it's OK to ask if you start your own thread. But your question has no place in somebody else's ad. |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 19 Oct 2021 12:03 am
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I moved the posts off-topic to the For Sale thread to their own Pedal Steel thread. I agree - it's fine to discuss the reasoning behind the value of Franklin guitars, but not on a For Sale thread for a Franklin.
I have an early Franklin. It is a great guitar, and every Franklin I've played has had a fairly unique sound, as compared to other guitars I've owned or played. But to cut to the chase - if you can't feel and hear the difference, then you probably won't want to pay the extra $$$.
I also have some ZumSteels. They are also great guitars for exactly the same reasons. And let me point out that the prices for nice examples have also been seriously escalating the last few years. And also for good reason. I fully expect that within a few years, people will be asking similar questions about Zums. |
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John Larson
From:
Pennsyltucky, USA
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Posted 19 Oct 2021 5:30 am
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The same reason Roland Jupiter-8 and Yamaha CS-80 sell for the astronomic sums they do.
Scarcity vs demand.
_________________
Rejoice in the Lord, O ye righteous; praise is meet for the upright. Give praise to the Lord with the harp, chant unto Him with the ten-stringed psaltery. Sing unto Him a new song, chant well unto Him with jubilation. For the word of the Lord is true, and all His works are in faithfulness. The Lord loveth mercy and judgement; the earth is full of the mercy of the Lord.
- Psalm 33:1-5 |
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Ricky Davis
From:
Bertram, Texas USA
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Posted 19 Oct 2021 7:07 am
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The Franklin is NOT in any way a copy of Sho~bud. Paul Sr, designed every part of the Franklin; so short list of completely every part not being a copy:"the changer pivots differently and ratios and material; unlike Anything ever used on Any steel"; crossbars; pullers rods; pedal rod pullers; stops; front apron brace and bracket system...all these are not even close to the parts of shobud; and were NEVER made and used until Paul Sr left Sho~Bud to start his own brand pedal steel. I can go on and on...but if you haven't taken apart over 100 Sho~bud's of every model, like I have....and Spoke to Paul Franklin Sr. on the phone for hours a time; then you would NOT understand at all why the Franklin is far beyond anything made...>>> PERIOD.
It is worth of course anything asked and what anyone will pay; and is really the only pedal steel I would say that about; other than the Sho~bud Fingertip I restored that was Lloyd Green's that is behind glass for historical reasons at the Country Music Hall of Fame Museum in Nashville.
These are my opinions of course from my own experiences and pedal steel guitar research for last 30 years.
Ricky
_________________
Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com |
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Patrick Thornhill
From:
Austin Texas, USA
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Posted 19 Oct 2021 9:11 am
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I think the relative rarity of Franklin guitars probably makes them more desirable too.
There a lots of Mullen G2s and LDGs out there, but only a handful of Franklins. Same reason people are (evidently) willing to pay $7,000 for a Klon Centaur. |
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Patrick Thornhill
From:
Austin Texas, USA
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Posted 19 Oct 2021 9:12 am
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Oh, oops. Already stated by John Larson.  |
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Norbert Dengler
From:
germany
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Posted 19 Oct 2021 12:27 pm
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i am lucky enough though living in Germany to have tried a bunch of pedal steel guitars.
Emmons Push Pull, Shobud, WBS, Mullen G2, GFI, Carter, Sho Pro, Schild Steel and the Franklin a friend of mine owns.
The Franklin is a great guitar, no doubt, but some of the other ones are too. The high price of the Franklin is a result of it's rareness and the talents of Paul Franklin Jr as a player in my humble opinion. |
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Ben Godard
From:
Jamesville NC
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Posted 19 Oct 2021 3:11 pm
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The Franklin’s changer is unlike any other changer. It allows pulls like a 1 1/2 tone raise with ease. Like Frankliin’s vertical knee lever for example. I think Franklin Sr redesigned the fingers to have a slight more mechanical advantage and it’s almost like a whammy bar as far as the raise or lower goes.
I loved the very pristine clean tone that mine had but I’ve played a black Carter that sounded identical to it. As far as the feel and playability, nothing beats it in my opinion but other brands do come very close . My Franklin was a little temperamental to the temperature. If the temp swayed too much it would be a little out of tune but I guess most all-pulls do that. I’m a little spoil and bias to Emmanuel push pulls. I believe I can tip over my push pull and it would still be in tune. And my Emmions would easily out-sustain the Franklin up past the 12th fret.
My ideal guitar though would be the Franklin changer mechanics and MSA mechanics elsewhere. All put into an Emmons or Sho-Bud cabinet, but the neck be made out of Dekley’s packawood. then having the lacquer finishing and inlays done by Leonard Stadler from Marlen Guitars if he were still alive. |
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Paddy Long
From:
Christchurch, New Zealand
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Posted 19 Oct 2021 6:01 pm
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Rex a "Closed Mouth will gather no Foot !!! "
_________________
14'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
08'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
94' Franklin Stereo D10 9+8
Telonics, Peterson, Steelers Choice, Benado, Lexicon, Red Dirt Cases. |
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Richard Lotspeich
From:
North Georgia
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Posted 20 Oct 2021 3:03 am
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Same reason that Newman picks just a few years ago were 8 or 10.00 a pair,, can now fetch 75.00 or more. Sure,,NP2's are the same pick with a hole instead of the diamond,,but supply and demand will determine the cost.
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Dick Lotspeich |
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Larry Bressington
From:
Nebraska
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Posted 20 Oct 2021 4:35 am
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I Love Franklin guitars and they are definately hard to come by, in a free market though you can ask any price you want. There's a Sho-bud on reverb for 20 grand, it's been there for awhile...
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A.K.A Chappy. |
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Patrick Thornhill
From:
Austin Texas, USA
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Posted 20 Oct 2021 5:05 am
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| Larry Bressington wrote: |
| I Love Franklin guitars and they are definately hard to come by, in a free market though you can ask any price you want. There's a Sho-bud on reverb for 20 grand, it's been there for awhile... |
It’s dropped to the oh-so-reasonable price of $17,000…
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Bill Miller
From:
Gaspe, Quebec, Canada
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Posted 20 Oct 2021 8:06 am
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| I'm interested to hear that my G2 is just a copy of a Sho~Bud. I've had both and I can't see it, but if you say so. |
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Mike Mantey
From:
Eastern Colorado, USA
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Posted 20 Oct 2021 9:27 am Mullen G2
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Supply and demand.
As for the G2, pretty much an insult there. Sho Bud is great, but the G2 is not a copy in any way. Del Mullen worked his whole 50+ years building guitars to develop the G2 and the changer for instance is unlike any other guitar out there, same for the Royal Precision. We have been doing our own thing for a very long time and haven't built a scissor changer since the 90's.  |
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J D Sauser
From:
Wellington, Florida
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Posted 20 Oct 2021 11:13 am
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Mullen, Emmons, Carter, MSA, even ZumSTEEL and back the ShoBud were Manufactures with various people working there, some offering a variety of steel models and configurations. Many of these companies have driven various inovations to the instrument.
Franklin is along with select few, from what I understand pretty much a one-man & one woman operation that functioned for a very long time which is rare in this "business". Evidently, only like Emmons and to a certain extend Sho-Bud, the name is also attached to a famous Artist, Paul Franklin, but more and historically consistently than any other brand.
If I, you or any other "Nobody" ordered a steel from Franklin Senior, that person would get a VERY well built guitar built by Paul Senior part by part and from what I've seen with always the same quality standard just like if "Mr. So&So" had ordered one. Many other manufacturers kept or are keeping the same standard, but not all.
I have GREAT respect for THAT sort of integrity.
The process was known to be slow and waiting periods well known. So, I don't know how many guitars PF Sr. cranked out over all the decades. Additionally, people like to hold on to their Franklins. So even fewer hit the marked and as long PF "Jr" still keeps his and thus his father's name up "there", I think some will dream to own a Franklin and may pay the extra money to fulfill that dream.
I am not sure, but I BELIEVE the neck and maybe even the end plates are cast Aluminum like on an Emmons or ShoBud. I am a strong believer that cast aluminum is a far superior sounding material than machined billet Aluminum.
Above is all just my opinions... but it IS opinions which drives prices.
Yet, I remember 20 years ago, some name baring Bigsby's were offered around for astronomic prices and today... oh well, I think some "investors" may have had to regret their "strategies".
I think that there are a couple of HIGH quality MFG's around today which offer top of the line instruments. It's at time difficult to predict which purchase was the smartest one. But with musical instruments, it often has to do with caprices of the markets, the music and preferences.
... J-D.
_________________
__________________________________________________________
Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"
A Little Mental Health Warning:
Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.
I say it humorously, but I mean it. |
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Chris Templeton
From:
The Green Mountain State
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Austin Tripp
From:
Nashville TN
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Posted 3 Nov 2021 7:22 pm
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Franklins are great guitars. I owned one a few years ago. Engineers and producers in Nashville swear by Franklin guitars. They do record better than most other guitars (for some reason). Their unique midrange sounds awesome in a studio. But live, I didn’t like the guitar. And the way it played wasn’t to my liking either. Idk, I just never connected with the guitar honestly.
All this to say, I believe they are worth whatever someone is willing to pay. Like Mike and several have stated “supply and demandâ€. I believe if Paul Jr was to play an Emmons p/p from now until the day he retires, Franklin steels will still be in high demand. And my comments aren’t knocking Franklins at all! It’s just my personal preference about them.
_________________
"Hotrod"
Steel guitarist for Cody Jinks
Member CMA |
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Johnie King
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 4 Nov 2021 9:11 am
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FRANKLIN PEDAL STEELS ARE SPECIAL PERIOD. !!!!
No and's or but's about it.
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Scott Denniston
From:
Hahns Peak, Colorado, USA
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Posted 4 Nov 2021 12:56 pm
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| Kind of like gold. They aren't making any more of it so the price goes up. There are so many wonderful guitars out there to choose from I guess it doesn't make much difference that a Franklin is way beyond my pocket. Sure love to have one though. |
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Steve Spitz
From:
New Orleans, LA, USA
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Posted 4 Nov 2021 7:27 pm
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I think Austin’s comment carries the most weight.
Aside from the obvious supply and demand ,free market issue, something contributes to the demand.
I think as Austin mentioned , producers and engineers like the way it “sits in the mix†.
If your playing heavyweight sessions , it’s easy to see the value. |
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Jeremy Moyers
From:
Lubbock, TX
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Posted 9 Nov 2021 7:47 pm
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I now own three Franklin guitars, and I can tell you that they play unlike any guitars that I have ever owned. Incredibly precise, quick and solid. They also sound unbelievably good. The note separation on these guitars is just something special. It's funny how this question always comes up, and most of the time it is brought up by people who have never spent any time sitting behind a Franklin guitar. There are a lot of good guitars being built today, and I have owned most of them. I can tell you that from my experience the playability and tone of the Franklin guitars are second to none.
If I am completely honest, the only thing that I do not like about the guitars is that they are a bear to work on... Making a simple change to the guitar is much more in-depth and complicated than on most other guitars. This being so, I am not one to change my "copedent" very often, and I enjoy working on guitars, so this is not a deal breaker for me...
Here's a link to a quick video that I shot last year of my playing my Blue Franklin after I had just received it. The playing isn't perfect, but I think that it shows off the tone and sustain of the guitar from open strings to up high on the neck. I just love these guitars..
https://www.facebook.com/jeremy.moyers.96/videos/3948124748533972 |
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