Issue with new Hilton volume pedal

Peter Haverkamp · From: Ontario, Canada

Hi Everyone. Very Very Very new noob to pedal steel guitar. Just bought my first one a few weeks ago, A GFI Ultra and very very happy with it so far. When I first bought it, I didn't have a volume pedal and was learning/practicing without one. I finally picked one up today and I find I am having an issue with it. It is a Hilton Low-Profile VP, and even without the guitar on or the Pedal plugged in, it is making a bothersome acoustical noise when fully opened, it sounds like when I fully open the pedal there is metal hitting metal somewhere which just doesn't seem right to me. The seller said that he never noticed that because most pedal players only play between 20% and 80% on their VP, but still doesn't seem right to me. I should be able to open it to 100% without an annoying noise. Uploaded a vid of the issue which you can watch here:

https://youtu.be/PXU0WdOT50c

Any help is appreciated, hope I'm posting in the right place. Question

Tom Sosbe · From: Rushville,In

mine does that too. it's just bottoming out. not a problem

Bill Miller · From: Gaspe, Quebec, Canada

...deleted...

Peter Haverkamp · From: Ontario, Canada

As I said I am a complete beginner and just bought my first steel last week and volume pedal yesterday. So yes, my nonexistent-volume-pedal-technique is probably the issue. It is a marketplace purchase, however, and I wanted to double check as I've owned cheaper volume pedals for 6-string guitars in the past without this issue and my window for a refund was small. So, just making sure I didn't buy a lemon, and now I know. Thanks. If there is a seperate steel guitar forum for beginners where I should be posting to receive less pedantic answers implying that my concerns are stupid because they haven't previously been voiced please advise. That notwithstanding, I do appreciate the advice.

Richard Sinkler · From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana

There's no separate "beginners" forum. This has been discussed here many times and it was always determined to be best to not have a separate beginners forum. Seasoned pros might not read that forum and you would miss out on their experience. And you might get advice from another beginner that might be "bad" advice. Your question (concern) was 100% valid. Hang in there and enjoy the ride. Welcome to the insane world of the pedal steel guitar.
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K Maul · From: Hadley, NY/Hobe Sound, FL

Advice will come in different ways because people have varying ways of communicating. It is all in good faith with the goal of helping you.
Practicing WITHOUT the volume pedal is not a bad thing. Many beginning players greatly overuse it, as I did when I started. You do need to learn that co-ordination - but spend time with your foot on the pedal at full volume and get a feel for dynamics in picking and blocking JUST using your hands. That will help your general technique greatly and teach you how to be truly expressive with this instrument. Good volume pedal technique will only add to that. So much of your tone and feeling really is in the hands.
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Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Peter, feel free to ask anything and don't be put off by blunt answers. I still consider myself a relative beginner after 8 years. No-one knows everything.

As to the Hilton, it's a great choice. Mine has never let me down. It's true what others have said: in the normal course of playing you never approach full throttle other than gently. Crank the amp up so that somewhere half way feels comfortable.
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Bill Miller · From: Gaspe, Quebec, Canada

Peter Haverkamp · From: Ontario, Canada

Thanks for the love and support everyone. You too Bill, and thanks for the apology, maybe I was being sensitive too. Thanks for make ng me feel welcome

Steve French · From: Roseville CA

Peter, you should also be aware that Keith Hilton has a great reputation here for supporting users of his products. He contributes regularly to this forum. I suggest you contact him directly with additional questions.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

Nobody I know bangs the volume pedal back and forth to the floor like that. Even for guitar, the volume pedal is generally moved smoothly, and for pedal steel, rarely does it go all the way down. There may be exceptions, for example if you want to push your pedals/amp into saturation or to really crank your volume for a solo. But most pedal steel players leave some headroom - many leave a lot of headroom - to give some extra gain to extend sustain.

I also hear the sound of the pedal moving around on the hardwood floor. If you're gonna play on a hardwood floor a lot, you might consider attaching a piece of rubber-type pad to the bottom to give it some friction. This thread on preventing a lap steel from slipping on the lap is just as relevant for preventing a volume pedal from slipping on a slippery floor - https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=369101. Or perhaps some soft rubber feet if the Hilton has feet - I don't know, I use an old Sho Bud potentiometer-based volume pedal.

Pedal steels in general are mechanical devices and there is some noise from movement of undercarriage parts, pedals, and so on. Once amplified to gig levels, that noise tends to disappear into the noise floor. But sometimes it can be an issue if an amp is mic'd too close to the steel if recording at a low volume. I've had people move my amp into another room when being recorded.

Moving to Electronics, where stuff like this is discussed.

Tucker Jackson · From: Portland, Oregon, USA

Welcome Peter.

Thanks for posting that video; it was critical for folks being able to say for certain that everything is normal here. My Hilton and Goodrich pedals bottom out and make a noise just like that when the top half of the metal chassis hits the bottom half.

As others have said, in real-world playing, it won't be slamming down quite as hard and fast at the end of the travel as in your video -- and if it did, you wouldn't hear it because the sound coming out of the amp would blow out your ears. This assumes you crank your amp such that normal playing volume is acheived with the pedal held at only 60%, or whatever midway-ish point you prefer. You do this so you have some headroom to step on the gas and sustain a note, when needed. But most of the time, you're holding it steady very near that midway-ish position.

Really, volume pedal technique is a whole other forum thread, I don't want to drift too far from the original topic here. Your pedal is fine. Smile

You got a great steel and pedal, so enjoy the ride!

John De Maille · From: On a Mountain in Upstate Halcottsville, N.Y.

Peter,
I've played many VP's and they most all make a mechanical sound when slammed open like that. However, as was said, at bandstand volume you'll never hear that noise because of the overall volume. If playing at home you would never open it up all the way like that anyway. Kind of like driving a standard stick car. You gradually apply the gas pedal while easing up on the clutch pedal. Except, of course, you're drag racing!
It's just another lesson to learn with the PSG.... volume pedal control.
You have a great VP, learn to use it correctly buddy. You'll enjoy the finesse you'll get from it.

Gene Tani · From: Pac NW

Mine boht make the same noise but if it bothers you you could probably put some kind of foam bumper in there, gun and camera case-grade Polyethylene/Polyurethane, something that won't degrade/turn to dust, to damp the motion/noise.

You can ask Keith Hilton at his website, he'll get back to you and offers superb repairs/support for his products whether you bought from him or not

https://www.hiltonelectronics.com/pedals
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Patrick Huey · From: Nacogdoches, Texas, USA

Tiny Olson · From: Mohawk River Valley, Upstate NY

Hey Peter:

I'm sending you a PM to ask about a possible relative to you. Thanks.

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