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Topic: How to find a replacement rod for a ZB |
David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 24 Feb 2021 8:03 pm |
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Hi - new pedal steel learner here.
I have an old 10-string, recently inherited, of no known manufacture. [Ed.- since found to be a ZB] I've taken a few lessons and I'm trying to get better, plunking along on the classics thanks to teacher here in Brooklyn, NY.
The rod supporting the Left-knee-vertical action recently snapped at the end by the string action and I'm looking to replace it. This has created a lot of questions -- namely, do I need to get a bending mechanism to repair it myself? I've looked at psgparts.com and don't see anything that jumps out as perfectly appropriate. And his email submission form doesn't work.
The rod is 24 inches long, 3mm in diameter. I'm at a bit of a loss as to how to get the right replacement. I don't have a lot of metal working equipment at home. (yet...)
Of the four pictures below, the first is where the u-turn broke. The second is the rod's other end. The third is a close-up of the nut at the end of the rod. The fourth is a top view of the instrument of unknown origin.
any push in the right direction apprectiated.
Last edited by David Hyatt on 25 Feb 2021 8:23 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
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Posted 24 Feb 2021 8:53 pm Re: How to find a replacement rod
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| David Hyatt wrote: |
| ...I have an old 10-string, recently inherited, of no known manufacture... |
That looks like ZB guitar. If so, the original pull rods have mushroomed ends like a motorcycle wheel spoke, but with a little patience you can fabricate a replacement with a flattened hook end like the one by your thumb from 1/8" SS welding rod. If you want to find an original part there are several folks on the forum who collect and work on ZBs and may have spare parts. You might have better luck catching their attention if you add "for a ZB" to the title of your post. Good luck
_________________
All lies and jest, still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest - Paul Simon |
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Eric Dahlhoff
From:
Point Arena, California
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 7:41 am
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Are you sure that's a ZB?
I don't remember the fretboards looking like that.
Are there turnbuckles on the rods?
Erv |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 8:13 am
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| Erv Niehaus wrote: |
Are you sure that's a ZB?
I don't remember the fretboards looking like that.
Are there turnbuckles on the rods?
Erv |
No turnbuckles
I did find a "ZB Custom" label -- down on the front of the pedal bar (orange arrow) -- the last place I looked, of course.
The rod I need to replace is at the green arrow.
My plan is to buy welding rods and the forming bender recommended by Eric D, absent any better suggestions.
Apologies for the mess!
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 8:20 am
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That last picture you posted shows either an 11 or a 12 string head.
You previously posted that it was a 10 string guitar.
Erv |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 8:22 am
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| Erv Niehaus wrote: |
That last picture you posted shows either an 11 or a 12 string head.
You previously posted that it was a 10 string guitar.
Erv |
Ah, true. It is an 11 string head but strung with 10. |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 9:32 am
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Some pictures of the whole undercarriage would help. Neither of the ZBs I had, had rods that looked like the one in the picture with round barrel (I keep forgetting what that thing is called) with the set screw. Maybe someone redid some of the undercarriage.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 9:53 am
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The undercarriage. I'm quite new to this, I assume there's signs here of custom hacks.
There are turnbuckles on some of the rods (not the one I need to replace). All the rod ends seem to be of similar design.
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 9:54 am
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Richard,
The ZBs I've been around always had the turnbuckels on the pull rods. |
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Eric Dahlhoff
From:
Point Arena, California
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 2:41 pm Zb
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Definitely a ZB, a later one where they no longer had the horns on the keyhead & changer. The later ones also did not use spokes, just the J-bend on the rod. Maybe that was after Mr. Brumley sold the company?
I do see a few turnbuckles there, but it's been "modified"  
Not sure how you can set it up without turnbuckles...
What's the serial number?
_________________
"To live outside the law you must be honest." (Bob Dylan) |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 2:51 pm
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Eric,
On the 11 and 12 string keyheads I believe they cut off the horns, or am I mistaken?
Erv |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 6:19 pm Re: Zb
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| Eric Dahlhoff wrote: |
What's the serial number? |
any ideas where to find one?
Would a replacement ZB pull rod like this be likely to work? https://www.psgparts.com/Pull-Rod-Cut-to-Fit-for-ZBs-925-000-1.htm
I assume I'd have to use the bendy-bendy tool and make use of the turnbuckle for final adjustments? |
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Tony Glassman
From:
The Great Northwest
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Posted 25 Feb 2021 6:21 pm Re: Zb
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Exactly what you need |
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Eric Dahlhoff
From:
Point Arena, California
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 7:53 am horns
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Erv,
Here's my 12 & 11 string ZB's with horns intact.
I believe it's just the later (modern) ones that lacked horns.
_________________
"To live outside the law you must be honest." (Bob Dylan) |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 8:03 am
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Eric,
I think you're right. 
Erv |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 9:18 am Re: Zb
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| Tony Glassman wrote: |
Exactly what you need |
"Availability: Out of Stock"
The "contact" form on the psgparts site is busted. Anyone have an email for the gent who runs the parts site, or another lead (other than fabricating my own from scratch)? |
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Michael Yahl
From:
Troy, Texas!
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 11:44 am
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David, that would be me. I am out of stock on the older ZB rods but I have several different sizes of rod that will probably work for you.
Eric, could you guide him as to the best size to use for what he needs to do?
Thanks
Michael
_________________
"Don't fergit to kiss yer horse!"
'72 Sho-Bud Professional D10, (in pieces .....), '78 MSA Classic XL D10, '69 Emmons PP, Fender 2000
Peavey Session 500 BW, Crate Digital Modeling Amp
PSG PARTS
http://www.psgparts.com/ |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 12:02 pm
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| Michael Yahl wrote: |
David, that would be me. I am out of stock on the older ZB rods but I have several different sizes of rod that will probably work for you.
Eric, could you guide him as to the best size to use for what he needs to do?
Thanks
Michael |
Wow, what service! Thanks in advance.
I wonder who else I can manifest on this site. Beetlejuice Beetlejuice Beetlejuice! |
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Eric Dahlhoff
From:
Point Arena, California
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 12:14 pm ZB rods
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David
Check out this post for info on ZB pull rods:
https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=348701&highlight=
Your serial number should be stamped at the changer end near the 1/4" jack.
Michael Yahl makes GREAT parts, by the way.
_________________
"To live outside the law you must be honest." (Bob Dylan) |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 26 Feb 2021 12:35 pm Re: ZB rods
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| Eric Dahlhoff wrote: |
Your serial number should be stamped at the changer end near the 1/4" jack.
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Ah, there. I see "0834" stamped into the metal. |
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J R Rose
From:
Keota, Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 5 Mar 2021 9:56 am
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Yes David, it is a ZB as Eric stated but has been modified to some degree. And yes it is a later model built without horns after Tom Brumley moved the company from Austin, Tx, to Bakersfield, Ca. and sold it to someone else who died shortly after buying it. I think Jerry Fessenden worked for Tom a short time in Austin and he told me that Tom built some without horns in Austin, Tx. My suggestion would get this guitar to Eric if he would and get him to do a cleanup and fix this guitar right. He can do it. Also their is a guy in Ohio that knows as much about ZB's as anyone. Greg Jones. Was a long time friend with Tom and has a lot of info. This will make you a great player guitar. It just needs some T.L.C. I love the Z.B.'s and would try to talk you out of this one but just turned 80 and don't do much anymore. Best of Luck, J.R. Rose
_________________
NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose |
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J R Rose
From:
Keota, Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 5 Mar 2021 10:06 am
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David, Just now seen where you are in Brooklyn and Eric is in Ca. If he is still working on steels their is John Widgren in SW corner of Conn. not to far from you.
He is a Forum member and would be a short drive for you. Check with him. J.R. Rose
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NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 8 Mar 2021 8:02 am
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| J R Rose wrote: |
David, Just now seen where you are in Brooklyn and Eric is in Ca. If he is still working on steels their is John Widgren in SW corner of Conn. not to far from you.
He is a Forum member and would be a short drive for you. Check with him. J.R. Rose |
Thanks - I actually checked with him a couple weeks ago at the suggestion of my local instructor - the effort/cost/value ratio wasn't real appealing for such a hinky instrument. I've ordered some 11 gauge cycle spokes and a bending apparatus, and found some very small turnbuckles at Ace hardware. Once the spokes arrive, I'm going to give it a go myself! (fingers crossed)
I hope I don't need to use a tap-and-die set; the turnbuckles have small eye hooks at the ends rather than threading. I hope looping tightly around the eye hooks won't add too much 'play' in the rod.
Once I tackle that I hope to solve the problem whereby RKL fails to raise the pitch of the D# (2nd highest) string. Otherwise the Emmons Copedent works as it should. One problem at a time! |
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David Hyatt
From:
Brooklyn, NY
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Posted 15 Mar 2021 7:01 pm it works!
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Thanks to everyone's help, I have finally fixed it myself!
I preserved the lever end of the original rod and replaced the broken half with an 11 gauge bike spoke. The original rod was far more pliable than the bicycle spoke. I wound up having to use a Dremel (for the first time) to cleanly cut the new spoke, and the cheap wire bender wasn't really up to the task.
I found the smallest turnbuckle they have at Ace Hardware, and used a heavy wrench to fashion hooks onto it at each end. Another hook at the spring end (which I'm very glad easily fit through the slot for the spring) -- and away we go!
Figuring out where to thread it through all the other mechanisms underneath was a small challenge, but it seems to be working fine.
Not volunteering to fix other people's, mind you...
Last edited by David Hyatt on 16 Mar 2021 5:24 am; edited 1 time in total |
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