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Topic: Emmons pp - bolt-on vs split-tail |
John Groover McDuffie
From:
LA California, USA
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 8:51 am |
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I've seen a lot of references to Emmons bolt-on guitars and they seem to be a preferred era. Is this correct. What are the perceived differences in sound and/or playability/mechanical function?
If someone can post a couple of close-up pics showing the difference in what the two types look like I would appreciate that. Thanks |
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Bobbe Seymour
From:
Hendersonville TN USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 9:21 am
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| One is great and the other is just as good. |
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Mark Herrick
From:
Bakersfield, CA
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 12:06 pm
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I'm not really an Emmons' guitar afficianado. That said, I prefer the original "wrap around" better than either the "bolt on" or the "cut tail" ("split tail"). Both the bolt-on and the cut-tail were Ron Lashley re-designs. The "wrap" was the guitar that Buddy originally designed, and that's the one I like best! 
Maybe Buddy will step in and tell us the story about Randy Reinhard's "horn of plenty".  |
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richard burton
From:
Britain
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 1:17 pm
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I'll stick my neck out and say that the bolt-on will have the better tone.
The downside is that it will also have more tuning instability due to temperature fluctuations.
I own a pull-release steel, with a bolt-on changer.
The tone is superb. |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 4:40 pm
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Ron Lashley Sr. and I had this very conversation about 15 years ago. I was playing a 66 bolt-on at the time and Ron stated quite plainly he felt the bolt-on was his favorite model of Emmons guitar for *THAT* tone.
He also asked if I had any intonation problems. That guitar is a good one and had no more problems with thermoexpansion than most guitars I've owned. He said he felt the bolt-on got an undeserved reputation for tuning touchiness, which I believe it has.
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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 6:18 pm
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To my ear there is a bit of a difference. The bolt on sounds more compressed. In a good way. I toured and recorded with my bolt on for quite a while and never had any weird tuning issues with it. I was borrowing Greg Leisz's bolt on for gigs out in LA and his steel had the same caracture. Nothing like them.
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Bob
upcoming gigs
My Website
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Frank Parish
From:
Nashville,Tn. USA
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 6:47 pm
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| I've had a few split tails and one bolt-on. Two of the split tails had the best tone to my ears and a few others that play them as well. The one I have now is what I think is the best of them all. It's a wood body with alluminum necks, split tail. I never had any tuning issues with the bolt-on. The tone was compressed as Bob stated but certainly didn't hurt it in any way. The wraparounds I've heard are a thinner tone I didn't care for. |
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Randy Gilliam
From:
San Antonio, Texas, USA
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 7:03 pm
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| Bobbe I Have a 2006 Legrande 111 I dont know what kind Of tail it Has If any. But it sure does sound good . I heard Steve Palousek Sunday At the Cotton Club On A Legrande 111 It Sounded Awesome. I Have Had My new Rains about A Month Almost time Too start Shopping Again. Randy |
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Jay Ganz
From:
Out Behind The Barn
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 5:37 am
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John Groover McDuffie
From:
LA California, USA
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 7:41 am
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| Thanks everyone, I've got it now. |
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Bobbe Seymour
From:
Hendersonville TN USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 11:20 am
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Randy, I know exectly what you are saying. I have had several folks wanting to make this same trade. Seems like to "OLD" standards just keep being the standards by which all others are measured.
I am restoring two "Wrap arounds" at the time and one "Bolt on", the "Wraparound" is not the greatest one of the three because of one serious design flaw it has. This Flaw only became appearent after a year or so of use, and so the "Bolt on" was built to fix the flaw.
Ask Stu Basore about this problem, his new '64 Emmons had to be modified (after he sold it) to be playable.
Actually, the split neck is seriously the great one of the pack for, tone, dependability, and so on. Why else would they have stayed with this design for the years '67 to '88?
A nice restoration trick is to install the split neck saddle blocks in to the Wrap around neck. (requiers a simple mod to the blocks and redrilling the mounting holes) This gives you the best of both worlds.
Bobbe [This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 07 June 2006 at 12:24 PM.] |
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Bobbe Seymour
From:
Hendersonville TN USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 11:32 am
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Most people forget that there was one more Emmons design for suspending the fingers at the bridge. Guess which one it was, there were over 390 made, but will never be any more.
Yep, FOUR different Emmons changer mounts. Bolt on, Wrap, Split and the---->
Yep, guess which one, I'll be watching to who figures this one out first.
Bobbe [This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 07 June 2006 at 12:34 PM.] |
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richard burton
From:
Britain
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 12:20 pm
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I think this is the short-lived changer that you are referring to, Bobbe
 [This message was edited by richard burton on 07 June 2006 at 01:21 PM.] |
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Bobbe Seymour
From:
Hendersonville TN USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 4:41 pm
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Ha Ha! Richard, this ain't it! But I appreciate the answer.
When I tell you guys, you'll say "oh yes, of course".
Bobbe |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 6:23 pm
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Among my past bolt-ons are Dicky Overbey's and Bob Hoffnar's... excellent guitars no doubt. But I still have a weak spot for the wraparound, as do my compadres Bobby Flores, Jim Loessberg, and Randy Reinhardt.
The wraparound, at least those I've played and owned have that certain "I don't know what"... or as a country boy might say, a "Jenny Say Kwah" (pardon the hillbilly French) ... that seems to sing my song. I have two doubles and a single that are in use all the time.
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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association
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Brendan Mitchell
From:
Melbourne Australia
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 7:09 pm
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Bobbe are you talking about the bolt on style changer on the BlackRock ?
Brendan |
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Nick Reed
From:
Russellville, KY USA
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Posted 11 Jun 2006 7:28 am
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Brendan,
Yes, and your Emmons Blackrock does have that Changer. Great Guitar, you better hang on to that one.
Nick
My '66 S-10 Bolt-on
(not the Blackrock model)
 [This message was edited by Nick Reed on 11 June 2006 at 08:29 AM.] |
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TRAP TRULY
From:
Mobile , AL
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Posted 11 Jun 2006 8:57 am
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| This ia a little off the topic ..but what about the tone differences of the bolt-ons with wood neck inserts compared to the aluminum necks bolt-on? |
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Bobbe Seymour
From:
Hendersonville TN USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 11 Jun 2006 9:34 am
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No, there have been four different type saddle block changers on Emmons guitars since day one.
This includes P-P and Legrande.
What are they? This should be VERY easy, |
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Willis Vanderberg
From:
Petoskey Mi
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 7:06 pm
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| I am waiting ? |
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Bobby Boggs
From:
Upstate SC.
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Posted 21 Jun 2006 7:21 pm
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Trap,I've owned both.The aluminum necks bolt-on had more sustain and has a little brighter sound the wood neck bolt ons.
The wood neck bolt ons sounded more like the Cut tails than they did the aluminum bolt ons. At least mine did..........bb |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 22 Jun 2006 4:40 am
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Weren't there two different wraparounds made? I seem to recall a "narrow mount" and a "wide mount" version.  |
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Chuck McGill
From:
An hour from Memphis and 2 from Nashville, R.I.P.
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Posted 22 Jun 2006 5:44 am
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| Would it be the current all pull? |
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Bobbe Seymour
From:
Hendersonville TN USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 22 Jun 2006 9:27 am
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Nope, I'll tell you, four basic different finger mounting methods, the three obvious ones (Wrap,Bolt and split) and the first LeGrande models. The Sho-Bud style, with the divider between each finger. Refered to as the "divided Finger" modle. There you have it, four different systems.
Bobbe |
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