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Topic: 5/4 E9 Copedent |
Austin Spendlove
From:
Apple Valley UT,
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Posted 24 Jul 2020 9:52 am |
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I'm getting a new steel guitar from stage one steel guitars. I'm 17 and this will be my first "real" steel guitar.
I came up with this. It is based on the set up of the guitar I've ben using for the last 6 months, the stock Encore set up, and Paul Franklin's set up.
The parentheses in the diagram represent splits.
The word stop represents a half/full stop.
This is going to be the guitar that I use for several years or even decades, so I want to make sure its a good copedent.
Is there anything I might want to add or change from this? |
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Skip Edwards
From:
LA,CA
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Posted 24 Jul 2020 10:38 am
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I'm a firm believer that the KL's that raise and lower your E's should be on your left leg.
There's some really cool stuff you can do combining your vertical lever with the lever that you have now as your LKR. Having those 2 levers on different legs opens up possibilities that you can't do if they're on the same leg.
And, IMHO, I like raising 7 a whole tone...which you have. It makes the kind of movements that you would usually do with a 6 lower sound a bit different...which I like.
Just my two cents. YMMV.
Good luck with your new guitar. |
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Tucker Jackson
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 24 Jul 2020 10:46 am
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Looks good, Austin. It's all there.
One thing you might consider if you're not too far along in your learning, is swapping the changes on LKR and RKR.
The reason: that 2nd string lower is important in the AB pedals-down position -- but tricky to hit when manipulating the pedals in licks and scales, since you use 'feel' to hit the half-stop on that knee lever and hold it there. The feel-stop is easier to work if its on the other knee... where you only have the volume pedal to contend with. I'll also point out that in a world without a lot of standardization from player to player, having the 2nd string lower on RKR is super common. |
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Gene Tani
From:
Pac NW
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Posted 24 Jul 2020 1:37 pm
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That's a great choice, probably could play it for decades, You can run coped by Doug Earnest and he can tell you how easy to time pulls or change them it'll be.
_________________
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Last edited by Gene Tani on 25 Jul 2020 6:52 am; edited 1 time in total |
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John Swain
From:
Winchester, Va
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Posted 24 Jul 2020 2:24 pm
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| Paul, you may not know it but the 2nd string lower on LKR is what Paul Franklin has always had ! |
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Benjamin Davidson
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Posted 24 Jul 2020 3:31 pm
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Austin,
That is a very solid 4p5k E9th and I think serves very well, most study material I have found will cover what you have.
Franklins knee lever setup as you have it laid out works very well for some players, and not as well for others. I would start with the guitar built as you have it laid out, and get used to things before you evaluate the need to move the E lowered lever. Reference here, mine started on LKR, then experimented with moving it to Franklins RKL. When I focused on E9th it felt more logical on LKR, but thats where it started for me - I dont feel its better in either position for a begining player. You can swap those pulls around between those two levers later if you feel the need.
Starting out I wouldnt change a thing in your position, you've got a lot there before you to learn. The only non-standard changes you have are placed well.
You have the Franklin pedal over to the left (the position Paul Franklin discusses in his method for that change to most likely be put), and you have opted for the lower G# change in lieu of the often placed F# on string 6. Having the lower string 7 (F# to G#) change makes more options there the way you have it, both Franklin and Travis Toy have mentioned that here on the forum before.
Best of luck in your endevor to learn and progress.
_________________
Justice Pro-Lite (9p9k) 10 String D13th Universal Tuning |
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Austin Spendlove
From:
Apple Valley UT,
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Posted 24 Jul 2020 6:08 pm
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| Benjamin Davidson wrote: |
Franklins knee lever setup as you have it laid out works very well for some players, and not as well for others. I would start with the guitar built as you have it laid out, and get used to things before you evaluate the need to move the E lowered lever. Reference here, mine started on LKR, then experimented with moving it to Franklins RKL. When I focused on E9th it felt more logical on LKR, but thats where it started for me - I dont feel its better in either position for a begining player. You can swap those pulls around between those two levers later if you feel the need. |
I've been playing on a steel with the e and f levers both on the left knee. The main reason I decided on moving them arround is so I can go smoothly from a BE to a AF position without that break when I'm moving my knee across to the other lever. |
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Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
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Posted 24 Jul 2020 8:06 pm
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| Austin Spendlove wrote: |
| I've been playing on a steel with the e and f levers both on the left knee. The main reason I decided on moving them arround is so I can go smoothly from a BE to a AF position without that break when I'm moving my knee across to the other lever. |
There is an interesting discussion from a few years back (when you were still in diapers Austin) that includes some lively back and forth between Paul Franklin and Buddy Emmons about the merits of having the Es on opposite knees vs. on the same knee. Start here for that part of the conversation, but the whole thread is a good read: https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=235783#235783 |
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Fred Justice
From:
Mesa, Arizona
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Posted 25 Jul 2020 12:26 am
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Austin that is a beautiful copedent.
Suggestion: you might want to turn the numbers around when talking about it. pedals first, 4x5 
_________________
Email: azpedalman@gmail.com
Phone: 480-235-8797 |
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Steve Leal
From:
Orange CA, USA
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Posted 26 Jul 2020 11:44 pm
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Hi Austin,
I strongly agree with Tucker’s suggestion about placing the lever that lowers 2 and 9 on the opposite knee of the lever that raises your Es. When you activate both at the same time, you get a very useful scale across all strings.
Also, especially if you are lowering your Bs on your LKV, you want you lower 2 and 9 on opposite knee. You will use those two levers together a lot.
Note: if you have split screws on string 5 and 10 for your up lever, then you will not be able to have the PF whole tone lower on your zero pedal. If you want both of these changes on your guitar to work, you would have to use extra rods on the up lever to achieve the split. I find the half step lower much more useful. On my steel, I am currently just lowering string 6 a whole step on my zero pedal.
Another change I added is to also lower 9 a half step on the lever that lowers Es. It completes the scale notes across all strings when lowering Es. When you lower Es with B pedal, it changes chord from B6 to B dom7. Then you can squeeze in the string 1,2,7 raise for embellishments.
Have fun bud! |
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Joel Jackson
From:
Detroit
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Posted 27 Jul 2020 6:52 am
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| You could try changing the LKV to a B to D raise as PF does. I switched from the B to Bb lower to B to D raise recently and am really enjoying it. |
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Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
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Posted 27 Jul 2020 9:33 am
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| It’s basically the same as my 12 string, with LKR and RKL reversed. Also, my vertical is for a F#>G raise, but I still lust for the Bb lower and might change it. I believe it will keep me busy for decades, which I hope to have ahead of me 🤠, so I think it will serve you well. |
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