K130 vs Paul's Pf 400 by Eminence

Marty Holmes · From: Magnolia ,TX USA

I know the fine details what I want to know is does TONE justifie 22lbs, and is the tone comparable to the K130.Is this speaker a little better sounding than the eps15 or are they neck and neck.Paul please tell free to chime in.Ive seen the YouTube video but their is a difference between a 12 and a 15.

George Kimery · From: Limestone, TN, USA

I don't know if this will help or not, but here is my experience based on my ears. I am not familiar with a PF-400, but I did own a PF-350. It was a very good sounding speaker but my old back just couldn't handle the weight, so I sold it. I replaced it with a Travis Toy TT-12 and couldn't tell much difference between the two, certainly not enough to justify the extra weight. I then got a JBL D-130 which I liked much better. It just has a smoother sound to my ears. So for now, it's JBL for me. I am taking delivery of an Evans SE 200 on Sept.8. It has the stock Eminence neo in it. I will be comparing it and my D-130. So I may be changing my mind about my JBL if the lighter weight Eminence sounds just as good or better. If not, then I may be replacing the Eminence with the JBL. It all depends which one wins the shootout.

Jack Stoner · From: Kansas City, MO

I can't comment on the PF400.
But I was one of the field testers on the EPS-15C for Eminence. The first time I tried the EPS-15C my initial impression was "this sounds just like the JBL K-130 I had in a Fender Twin amp". After using the EPS-15C for several years my opinion never changed.

I now have a Quilter Steelaire combo amp. It has a "modified" (more high end) EPS-15C speaker. I don't like the too many (thin) highs and have ordered an EPS-15C speaker to replace it.

The EPS-15C sounding like a JBL is no coincidence. The EPS-15C was made to be a lighter weight replacement for the Peavey 1501-4 Black Widow that Peavey used in Steel Amps. The 1501-4 was designed to be a higher power handling clone of the JBL D/K 130 that Peavey used in the original Session 400. The JBL couldn't handle the power of the Session 400.

Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

if I want to use a different lighter speaker than a JBL I donâ€™t bring a JBL to the shoot out.
The JBLs always win by allot and I end up carrying them around for another couple years.
_________________
Bob

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm done with heavy speakers and amps. I wish the Neo speakers had come out sooner, when I was doing 5-7 gigs a week. We all have to make decisions about our own "tone" and what we prefer, and I found out after decades of playing, and thousands upon thousands of gigs, that no one but me noticed or cared much about the gear I used. To this day, neither I nor most anybody else can tell definitively what amp, speaker, or brand of guitar was used on a recording. If anything was hands-down "best", there'd be absolutely no questions about what all the greats used on everything they ever did. But, that's simply not the case.

Learn to play, and play well, and the "tone" thing will take care of itself.

Larry Dering · From: Missouri, USA

Darn it Donny, you are killing my quest for tone. We are all making a good living here selling, trading, and buying each others junk. I know you are right and lightweight gear is all the rage for us older road worn veterans. I look at my pile of amps and keep thinking why?

Marty Holmes · From: Magnolia ,TX USA

We have two major neo speakers that are 15's and neither one of them are 8ohms with 400 watts of power at least the tt and the eps.I wish I could buy a k130 at 8ohms that would handle 400 watts of power and the pf 400 seems the closest but the weight is the major con for this speaker I'm sure it has the tone I'm looking for,but it's not a neo and I need that amount of power minimum for my amp or I'll blow the speaker for not enough power.

George Kimery · From: Limestone, TN, USA

I consider GD Walker, that has built the Stereo Steel system for many, many years to be an expert on selecting speakers for his system. He bought used JBL's wherever he could find them, any model, and reconed them to be D-130's. These were the speakers that he supplied with his Stereo Steel amp that has two 300 watt power amps. If they wouldn't handle the 300 watts, he would not have used them. This is what I have and I have played them really loud without a problem. He did offer Black Widows as an alternative for those that preferred them.
Others have posted that the Eminence EPS 15 C neo sounds the same as a D-130. I am getting an Evans SE-200 on Sept.8 with the stock Eminence neo in it. I am hoping that it is the EPS 15 C and when I do a shootout against my D-130, that it will deliver the sound of the JBL so I can have a lightweight neo instead of having to replace it with the heavier JBL.

Marty Holmes · From: Magnolia ,TX USA

I am thinking the PF-400 is going to be the closest thing to a jbl k130 that will have the tone and power at 8ohms a steel player is looking for to put in an Evan's se 500 any opinions the amp see's 8ohm's.

Travis Toy · From: Nashville, TN, USA

Marty Holmes · From: Magnolia ,TX USA

Thank you for the info Travis I may ultimately do that.

Travis Toy · From: Nashville, TN, USA

John Goux · From: California, USA

I did a steel speaker shootout that included about 20 speakers. I borrowed every speaker I could and recorded just about every speaker I owned for guitar or steel. I recorded steel into a looper and played it back at a healthy level on the same amp, same mic, same sequencer program. I only changed gain levels on the mic pre to adjust for louder speakers.

The test included PF, TT, Telonics, Black Widow, JBL, EV, Celestion, Jensen, Oxford. I also tested the direct out on the Fryette Amp Station and the Kemper.

What I can add to this conversation is these observations:

1, Pedal steel speakers have been getting progressively darker over the years, having notable less highs. The JBLs, BW, had more highs than any of the newer speakers. The JBL has a magical high end. The newer speakers do not have much information up in the highs. This seems to be true of neo and traditional models.

2. 15â€ speakers seems to have more highs than 12â€. This was true of JBL and TT. They have both more lows and more highs than their 12â€ siblings.

3. The recording process and digital domain reduces the difference between speakers.
You may hear/feel a dramatic difference when you plug straight into an amp/speaker. The looper(digital), mic (Shure SM 57 because that is what we use live and in the recoding studio), the mic pre, the digital conversion in and out, all these elements in the signal chain level the differences between amp/guitar speakers.

My personal favorites for steel are the 12â€ speakers... BW12, JBL D120, EV12M, Jensen C12N, and the Celestion Greenback.

I enjoyed the TT 15â€ over its 12â€ counterpart, because it has more highs. Although I did not test the PF-400, I suspect the 15â€ will have the same difference in EQ curve as other speakers, which will be a bit more highs than the 12â€ model.

What you prefer is completely subjective. Your picks, bar, EQ settings, buffer, amp and speakers all combine to create a sonic footprint.

The speaker may be the most dramatic element in this sonic stew, but is still just one single element.

John

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