Keyless or key head

Johnie King · From: Tennessee, USA

For the best sound Iâ€™m voting a keyhead model will have a better sound hands down! At least the keyless ones I build an the name brand Keyless models Iâ€™ve owned. Iâ€™m not saying there may be some Keyless models that I have not played that may sound fine.

Looks like I might be wrong according to all the post lots of post defending the Keyless Steels.

Bob Carlucci · From: Candor, New York, USA

I have owned 2 major brand keyless pedal steel guitars.. both were lacking compared to keyed guitars in tone.. Hard to explain what was missing, but they didn't have the nuance or complexity to my ears.. Neither one was here long.. they were very small and light compared to keyed steels, but to me, that was the only advantage... bob
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I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!

no gear list for me.. you don't have the time......

K Maul · From: Hadley, NY/Hobe Sound, FL

I have a 90s GFI S12. Maybe I donâ€™t have dog ears, maybe I donâ€™t care enough, but I think it sounds great. I also have a 59 Sho~Bud Permanent which sounds beautiful. They both have a lot of character and are very good in different situations.
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KEVIN MAUL: Airline, Beard, Clinesmith, Donner, Evans, Excel, Fender, Fluger, Gibson, Hilton, Ibanez, Justice, K+K, Live Strings, MOYO, National, Oahu, Peterson, Quilter, Rickenbacher, Sho~Bud, Supro, TC, Ultimate, VHT, Williams, X-otic, Yamaha, ZKing.

Johnie King · From: Tennessee, USA

Well Sho Bud tried Keyless years ago an the Pros just didnâ€™t accept them then an very few do know. Same with 6 string guitar an bass very rare to see a pro guitar man playing Headless guitar.

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

Years ago there was someone making a keyless head to put on a Sho~Bud guitar.
I bought one and put it on a Sho~Bud I had.
I agree with some of the above comments, it lost something in the tone department. Sad

Erv

David Ball · From: North Carolina High Country

I've had 2 keyless Sierras as well as a keyed and a keyless Excel (and some Buds, Emmons, etc...) Hands down, the best sounding guitar I've ever had is my Jackson Pro IV keyed guitar. It's like a super Sho Bud, and that's still my favorite steel tone.

But the Keyless Excel sounds a lot better than my keyed Excel did--its a great sounding guitar. So in this case, keyless won.

The biggest differences I've heard between the guitars I've had seem to come down to scale length and whether the guitar has a wooden body, like most keyed guitars I've had, or a mostly metal body like the Sierras and Excels.

I've come to prefer keyless guitars overall, but mainly because of the long scale length and compactness.

Dave

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Most all the top pros use keyed guitars, and that's a good enough recommendation for me. I figure they probably hear things I don't, and know some things I haven't thought of.

Greg Cutshaw · From: Corry, PA, USA

My Excel Keyless sounds as good as any guitar I've ever played. It has excellent harmonics and sustain. My ears are not what they used to be and your mileage will pry differ. I think the combination of compactness, tone, precision tuning, light weight and cool factor make a keyless as good a choice as a keyed guitar. I do think the keyed guitars look more like a real guitar to the general public on stage and perhaps make a flashier presentation.

Len Amaral · From: Rehoboth,MA 02769

My New Sierra has a wonderful vibe and a pleasure to play. My Williams keyless is a different vibe but unique in its own way.

K Maul · From: Hadley, NY/Hobe Sound, FL

Mitch Ellis · From: Collins, Mississippi USA

Yeah, the same â€œpublicâ€ that thinks you are playing a keyboard, a Moog sythesizer or a dulcimer. Haha[/quote]

A lady came up to me one night and said "I love the sound of that machine you're playing!" Which, when you think about it, is actually a reasonable description.

Mitch

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

...especially if they see underneath while you're packing away - that can cause genuine amazement.

I echo what Greg says about the Excel keyless, and if a keyed Williams sounds better than my keyless one I don't care - lightness and compactness are everything to me.

One thing does puzzle me, though. Both the manufacturers I mention still have rollers and a small but yet real amount of spare string on the other side. My design (see left unless I've changed my picture since I wrote this) is rollerless, like a miniature pull-release changer. It is really simple to make and works perfectly.
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Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs

Stu Schulman · From: Ulster Park New Yawk (deceased)

I have never played a keyless guitar but as soon as I sell my Carter ,and GFI Ultra I'm gonna get a keyless guitar and see what I've been missing...I'm looking forward to getting one.
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Steeltronics Z-pickup,Desert Rose S-10 4+5,Desert Rose Keyless S-10 3+5... Mullen G2 S-10 3+5,Telonics 206 pickups,Telonics volume pedal.,Blanton SD -10,Emmons GS_10...Zirctone bar,Bill Groner Bar...any amp that isn't broken.Steel Seat.Com seats...Licking paint chips off of Chinese Toys since 1952.

Norbert Dengler · From: germany

I really doubt that a keyed guitar sounds better. rather the opposite I m h o. I think pros play keyed because it has advantages on stage situations where you can tune the traditional keyhead without using a tool. on the other hand keyless are even more staying in tune and don't need to be adjusted all the time.

Norbert Dengler · From: germany

I really doubt that a keyed guitar sounds better. rather the opposite I m h o. I think pros play keyed because it has advantages on stage situations where you can tune the traditional keypad without using a tool. on the other hand keyless are even more staying in tune and don't need to be adjusted all the time.

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

It is the imperfections in a musical instrument that give it its character, as long as they're not severe.

If you like what the spare bits of string in a well-built keyhead do to the sound, enjoy!
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Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

When I was a kid, if we wanted chicken for Sunday dinner we had to cut the head off a rooster.
And that's what a keyless guitar reminds me of: a chicken without a head. Whoa!

Erv

Ross Shafer · From: Petaluma, California

Does that mean keyhead steels look like chickens with heads?

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

To each his own, but I think the biggest reason players don't like keyless is visual. You can come up with all kinds of reasons to dismiss them, but most of those have little to do with the sound.

Concerning keyless brands of standard guitars, Steinberger only sold thousands and thousands of headless guitars and basses.

Far as professional players who play/played keyless guitars, Jeff Newman played Klines, probably other makes. Joe Wright still plays a keyless Sierra far as I know. Looks like Ross' new line of Sierras, like b0b plays, is gaining ground too. Probably other pros playing those too.

In the 90's, lots of pros played their, at that time, new Sierra keyless 25 guitars. Ron Elliott, Herby Wallace, Gene O'neal. Buddy Emmons played a keyless Sierra on the Church Street Stations TV shows. He also stated that guitar's sound on the C6 neck was his preference over other brands. There are also other examples that don't come to mind right now.

In my own experience, I can play either happily and just don't see the sonic difference, but I guess some players have the ears of a bat.

I have owned Williams, Lamar and Sierra keyless 14's, 12's and D10's.

At one time, I owned a keyless Sierra 14 Crown 25 and a Remington aluminum neck keyed 12 both tuned the same. I made a tape recording of ea. using the same equipment, same tunes etc. as sort of an A/B comparison. Months later, I couldn't identify which is which. I still have the tape here somewhere and I still can't tell.

It would be interesting to see if anyone here could tell the difference in a blind test as well. Perhaps someone who has both a keyed and keyless Williams of the same configuration might be the most honest test. Even then, any differences might be contributed to differences in the individual guitars rather than keyhead design.

You ought to play whatever you like. Some keyless guitars are less roomy than keyed guitars and might have pedals and/or knees with less space than they like.

I submit though, that most players dislike keyless guitars due to the look and to only a perceived difference in the sonic qualities and who cares what the general public or other musicians think.

Many of this group active here, boomers, eschew any differences with modern steel guitars, even more modern pulls and changes.

Perhaps Millennials might give more love to the keyhead challenged models.

Everyone is welcome to their opinions and free to play whatever design they like. That's the important thing.

Greg Cutshaw · From: Corry, PA, USA

How could anyone not love these? Keep in mind that the Excel has 12 strings, two unique extended 12 string tunings and the equivalent of 8 pedals and 10 knee levers:

Check out the difference in case sizes:

Johnie King · From: Tennessee, USA

Greg those are beautiful steels.
Well Tom Brumbly sure made his Keyless Steel work for him an Zane Beck also played Keyless for years. Surprised

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

Yep. I'm sure there are many others. Cowboy Eddie Long ain't no slouch on his keyless BMI either.

Hugo Knef · From: Vallejo , California

I sure love my keyless Williams when it comes time to change strings. And keyless also has a perfect straight pull on the string after the roller. Something you donâ€™t always get with keyed.
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Williams S10 moyo mini Quilter TT12

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Bob Carlucci · From: Candor, New York, USA

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