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Topic: help with the year please. # 00566 |
George Geisser
From:
Branson, Missouri, USA
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Posted 22 Aug 2018 5:49 am |
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Maybe someone here can tell me what year 1000 this is. Thanks |
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Barry Blackwood
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Posted 22 Aug 2018 7:58 am
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| It's been so heavily modified, what would it matter? That being said, I think they went to the black frame starting around 1959.. |
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George Geisser
From:
Branson, Missouri, USA
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Posted 23 Aug 2018 1:30 pm
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| Barry Blackwood, I'll have to check my previous 1000 post but the old Fender only had 2 pedals, rods and cables and make shift pulley. So I've managed to cobble it together pretty good considering. Like my antique Fords I would never bust up a complete unit but necessity is the mother of invention |
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Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
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Posted 24 Aug 2018 12:44 pm
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Fender pedal steels can't be dated from serial numbers. They were not issued sequentially to guitars as completed or shipped and there have even been repeats within models.
Black frames with "tags" that have had provenance (receipts or other date evidence) have usually been from 1960, but even if it wasn't modified it'd be irrelevant unless you're just curious. There's zero difference in value from year to year.
I don't feel like standing on my head today - could you please edit your post and flip the picture ? 
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional |
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Barry Blackwood
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Posted 24 Aug 2018 2:52 pm
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Here, I'll do it for ya..
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 24 Aug 2018 4:54 pm
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| Jim Sliff wrote: |
Fender pedal steels can't be dated from serial numbers. They were not issued sequentially to guitars as completed or shipped and there have even been repeats within models.
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With all due respect, I'll just go on record as not agreeing with those statements. I've never seen or heard of a newer guitar with a low SN, or an old one with a high SN. (But I have seen guitars with altered SN's.) Fender made these guitars for over 15 years, and they made thousands of them. Throughout those years, they made almost 60 changes in the original design, and those changes are one way to tell if there has been some "finagling" going on with a particular guitar, or it's SN.  |
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Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
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Posted 28 Aug 2018 1:04 pm
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I agree completely about dating them from features - just not from serial numbers.
Between the 7 or 8 I've owned, a couple dozen I've serviced or inspected and pictures/details either posted on my old Fender Steel Forum or set by email I've seen low numbers on later guitars, inconsistencies between models and at least 2 or 3 instances of repeated numbers. The only "altered" ones I've seen were were one digit was stamped over another at the factory.
Several years ago I started a serial number database, thinking at least early models might have dates that indicated years. But there was simply no consistency, research with Fender turned up no serial number records and there were no former employee recollections of sequential numbering.
Vintage dealers were thinking a need might exist for year identification as date-related price ranges developed. But the market never developed so there was no need.
Fender also had large batches of hardware and bodies made, which were stored and assembled on an "anticipated orders" basis - and there is no record of when the frames were stamped - by the fabricator,or by Fender when received and put on racks, or as they were assembled, or when they were shipped. As the stamping doesn't match the number of digits or style known to have been stamped at Fender or by Race & Olmstead (their primary tooling supplier) it's thought frames were manufactured by a third "mystery" hardware fabricator and very possibly numbered there.
last, numbers and shipping dates go completely random between the CBS purchase and 1970 when manufacturing essentially ceased and existing inventories were used up. They were cataloged for several more years but lack of demand meant they had raw parts in inventory that were moved several times. There was no need to keep them organized by serial number, and as with other dated parts floor workers pulled whatever was closest, and little-used or overstocked parts could be part of an instrument shipped years after the date.
When attempting to create a reliable database (like Greg Gagliano did with amplifier serial numbers) it was hoped Fender would have at least some partial records in their old files but the only things found were duplicates of the already-known patent drawings and instruction manuals.
Obviously quite a bit of work was put into the attempt, but between the astounding lack of data, Fender's parts storage and "pulling" method, period randomness and sporadic number conflicts it simply wasn't possible.
I planned to eventually get around to a date vs feature categorization, but since the vintage market still dumps each model (regardless of date) into one price range there's simply no pressing need.
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional |
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George Geisser
From:
Branson, Missouri, USA
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Posted 5 Sep 2018 8:45 am
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| Thanks again for the help and for flipping the picture. I don't know why it uploaded it that way. I was hoping it would be the same age as myself. You guys rock! |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 5 Sep 2018 9:30 am
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Yup, 1958...the year of some Fenders (and probably some Geissers).  |
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George Geisser
From:
Branson, Missouri, USA
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Posted 23 Sep 2018 9:56 am
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| Thanks |
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