| Author |
Topic: Possible solution to my lousy VP technique |
Allan Haley
From:
British Columbia, Canada
|
Posted 21 Feb 2018 11:47 am |
|
Hi steelers,
I use the VP something like a gas pedal, something like a spinning wheel treadle. Not great.
I play mostly through a recording preamp I/O on my computer, using headphones. I've turned the gain on the preamp up to maximum, so that I have to play notes with the VP at about half volume or else it will distort the pre with that nasty digital distortion. Also, if I hit a note and open up the VP too quickly, it all distorts.
This is teaching me to keep the VP volume down and then ride the volume of the note up as it decays. It has helped me to improve my volume swells as before I was sitting with the VP wide open most of the time and pumping the VP to no great effect.
It does not help with my bad habit of cutting the volume too rapidly when I hit a note. That's the flipside of my VP problem.
It is such a subtle tool, the VP. Just another difficult part of an already difficult instrument.
Al |
|
|
 |
Edward Rhea
From:
Medford Oklahoma, USA
|
Posted 21 Feb 2018 12:30 pm
|
|
Hey Al, many veteran steel players have commented and encouraged several of us newer players to play without the volume pedal...as a means to develop better techniques and picking control...it’s a great and useful exercise to eliminate the pedal, and learn some level of dynamics, with your hands? I would encourage you to search for such threads, and maybe even try it for yourself, I feel it is/was beneficial to me and my playing even after a couple weeks! Best to you!
_________________
“TONESNOB†|
|
|
|
Allan Haley
From:
British Columbia, Canada
|
Posted 21 Feb 2018 12:47 pm
|
|
Thanks, Edward. I would never have considered eliminating the VP altogether for practicing. I'll happily try that and focus on getting volume and dynamics through the picks.
I'll try to find those forum threads.
Al |
|
|
|
K Maul
From:
Hadley, NY/Hobe Sound, FL
|
Posted 21 Feb 2018 10:32 pm
|
|
Leave the vol pedal in position but just don’t use it. If it’s too tempting then unplug it but leave it there to put your foot on. That will actually increase your comfort and connection with it,even if you don’t use it. It’s like showing the darn thing who’s boss!
_________________
KEVIN MAUL: Airline, Beard, Clinesmith, Donner, Evans, Excel, Fender, Fluger, GFI, Gibson, Hilton, Ibanez, Justice, K+K, Live Strings, MOYO, National, Oahu, Peterson, Quilter, Rickenbacher, Sho~Bud, Supro, TC, Ultimate, VHT, Williams, X-otic, Yamaha, ZKing. |
|
|
|
Josh Yenne
From:
Sonoma California
|
Posted 10 Mar 2018 7:45 pm
|
|
I agree.. when i was starting many a pro told me to just forget about the volume pedal.. and I agree...
it is the LAST piece of the pedal and I try to tell students its more of a sustain and expression pedal than a volume pedal..
also many beginners try to use it in PLACE of blocking (blocking is hard) and thats when you sound like an amateur.
 |
|
|
|
Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
|
Posted 11 Mar 2018 11:28 am
|
|
I leave my VP plugged in. I’m lazy with it anyway. Most of the time I only use it for...adjusting my volume.
The way you are doing it is not such a bad way to learn what the VP is for. It is an effect, not a crutch. Use it for swells and backing off for comping and other back up. Turning your amp gain down will let you open up the VP without distortion for solos, and you’ll get the full effect of the tone settings on the amp. Unplugging the pedal will allow you to get those settings right the way you want them. But I would plug it back in and get used to not leaning on it so much. |
|
|
|
Franklin
|
Posted 11 Mar 2018 1:51 pm
|
|
Allan,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnJ6_R-TJJA
Here is an excerpt from a volume pedal lesson from the course....For what its worth, I think you are on the right track and its possibly the most rewarding skill for playing the instrument....
Because of the difficulty in mastering and the reward of expressive playing, I believe the muscle memory for developing the needed coordination between picking and the Volume Pedal are best learned together...By practicing them as one issue players will gain a quicker and more accurate path towards the coordinated timing needed to sync up those skills. Hope seeing this helps.
Paul Franklin |
|
|
|
Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
|
Posted 11 Mar 2018 2:14 pm
|
|
Why do I even say anything? 
Thank you, Paul. |
|
|
|
Allan Haley
From:
British Columbia, Canada
|
Posted 26 Mar 2018 12:45 pm
|
|
| Thank you, Paul. That video clip is very helpful. I'll keep the VP hooked up and keep working on it. It's a subtlety that makes this instrument so beautiful. |
|
|
|
David Weisenthal
From:
Arizona, USA
|
Posted 26 Mar 2018 2:15 pm
|
|
I tried setting my volume pedal so that it never fully lowers the output to zero. That way I can't accidentally go through this on-off cycle that makes a warbling quality. Has anybody else tried this? Is it a bad way to learn volume pedal technique? I find myself having a steadier output that I can still add sustain to. I just added a self adhesive rubber bumper so the pedal can't lower completely.
_________________
Derby SD10, Peavey Session 400 |
|
|
|
Will Cowell
From:
Cambridgeshire, UK
|
Posted 30 Mar 2018 4:22 am
|
|
I have struggled to get some kind of VP technique for best part of 8 years and I feel I still have not got my right foot educated. I know about the initial fade-in of the note so as to get a softer, cleaner start without pick noise etc. It's after that that I have trouble. I go too hard too early, and then have no headroom for sustain.
I am experimenting with fitting a feel stop, with springs, on my VP - or rather, the bracket it fits on - so it hits a physical increase in pressure after the first quarter or third of the travel.
_________________
Williams 700 series keyless U12,
Sierra keyless U14, Eezzee-Slide & BJS bars
Moth-eaten old Marshall 150 combo
Roland Cube 80XL, Peterson Strobo+HD,
EarthQuaker Despatch Master for reverb / delay |
|
|
|
Andrew Krebs
From:
Wisconsin, USA
|
Posted 1 Apr 2018 7:10 pm
|
|
I'm a newbie trying to learn by my own wits so any advice would be appreciated...
I've practiced for a while wondering why the hell I even needed the volume pedal other than for swells and tricks I'm not quite "at" yet. I'd set a volume and that is where it would stay for the practice.
So correct me if this is wrong, but I basically use, and would use the volume pedal in a band setting, as a "headroom bank" I guess you can say. For example, When I am singing and leading my band on six string, my guitar's volume knob is often much lower than where the amp is at. It is a hot-as-shit Mesa Boogie so not only can I control my dynamics but I can manipulate my overdrive this way...
Just practicing steel on my own, getting into some intermediate stuff, I've found this idea has been useful with the volume pedal. Basically I pick a spot just slightly less than mid-sweep on the volume pedal, around half of the "range" of it and this is my middle of the road volume. In theory, when we swell into notes on a pedal steel, is that not a "weak" moment dynamically? I suppose my idea is I have the 50-70 percent remaining to compensate for tastey swells, and then my standard playing or whatever I put it back at middle. It never would be at 100 percent full volume. |
|
|
|
Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
|
Posted 1 Apr 2018 9:52 pm
|
|
| Andrew Krebs wrote: |
| I suppose my idea is I have the 50-70 percent remaining to compensate for tastey swells, and then my standard playing or whatever I put it back at middle. It never would be at 100 percent full volume. |
This is the mystery to me also. I have read conflicting advice, and some of it from well-known masters. Banking 50-70% seems like a lot to me though. I have mine wide open on rock n roll solos, at about 80-90% on average country, maybe 60-70% for ballads with longer sustained passages. I back off when playing back up, and way off for the beginning of a swell. I’m beginning to think this is a subjective thing, like a few other technical aspects of playing. If it’s working for you, go with it. If it’s giving you fits, look for help. |
|
|
|
Alan Cook
From:
Kent,England
|
Posted 1 Apr 2018 10:43 pm
|
|
| When practicing place a 9v battery under the back of the pedal so it prevents it returning fully, you'll find when you take it out you don't pump the pedal so much. |
|
|
|
Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
|
Posted 2 Apr 2018 4:46 am
|
|
I've been reading all this with interest and drawing on my experience as a brass teacher, where poor tone production is down to either bad tonguing or bad breathing. You have to analyse what the student is doing but you can't separate them for too long as they work together.
As Paul Franklin points out, it's the same with the picks and the pedal which cooperate to give the desired envelope and must always be considered in combination. Of course your right hand technique needs to be in order first and keeping your right foot still while you work on it is obvious. But the pedal is not a volume control - that's on the amp - it's an expression device to modify the attack if required and to aid the sustain.
Just my take on four years of trying to sound decent
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
|
|
|
