recognize this copedent?

James Winger · From: Washington, USA

hmmm,
I ran into a guitar (GFI 12) with this copedent.

thoughts?

Tucker Jackson · From: Portland, Oregon, USA

Do we know what the strings are tuned to?

It's pretty close to the Newman E9/B6 universal copedent. Really, a few of the pedals match Newman on one of the strings but then veer off on some other string.

Is it possible the chart might contain errors and the guitar might actually be closer to Newman than is listed? Like, the chart shows the A-pedal only moving string 5 instead of 5 and 9, which would be more typical on a 12U.

And the B-pedal correctly moves the G# on strings 6 and 10, as expected, but not string 3.

James Winger · From: Washington, USA

Thanks

I can't be 100% sure on the tuning as the instrument wasn't tuned (or even really tensioned)

I checked a couple of times when generating the copedent chart, I suppose there could be an error, but I doubt it as I double chec ked since it didn't fit a copedent I could recognizeand was confused by the logic of it...hence the post

perhaps damage to the changers?

Tucker Jackson · From: Portland, Oregon, USA

Did you, by chance, take a photo of the nylon tuners? You can tell what strings are raised or lowered by that (although you can't tell whether they're half- or whole-tone changes... but you can often guess, based on stock changes most people use).

This GFI seems to be a close variant of a fairly common E9/B6 tuning. If you wanted to shift it to that more common setup, it seems that most of the hardware is already on the guitar; the rods just needs to be moved on a few pedals. The exception would be pedals 1 and 2. If the chart is correct, it seems they are missing one rod on each pedal, which is confusing since those are such bread-and-butter changes on PSG.

James Winger · From: Washington, USA

I'll get one up ASAP

thank you guys

Bobby D. Jones · From: West Virginia, USA

It is similar to the Jeff Newman U12 tuning. Just seeing that it just raises or lowers a string is not much help. From what you have listed there should be another up pull on pedal 2 on string 3. This would make it set up EMMONS or NASHVILLE tuning, With the pedal A-B-C in order.

This is Mr. Newman's U12 but is set up Day tuning with the pedals 3-2-1 so just reverse 1 and 3.
I have this on a GFI Ultra S12 U. Even the sweetening numbers showed up on this scan. If you need any help on your steel, Send me an E-mail. Be glad to help. Welcome to the world of Steel Guitars.

James Winger · From: Washington, USA

unfortunately I don't know what tuning it was supposed to be in

here's a pic of the tuning nuts as per MrJackson's suggestion

Tucker Jackson · From: Portland, Oregon, USA

Thanks for the photo of this 12-string, James. It solves the mystery.

It's a Good News/Bad News situation.

The Bad News: the chart listed at the top of this thread is inaccurate.

The Good News: we were hoping the chart was inaccurate.

Specifically, the chart showed the A- and B-pedals were missing important string changes, but based on the photo, they are not missing.

1) The chart said the A-pedal was inexplicably not raising string 9, which would be typical on a 12 string universal.

But if you look at the photo of the nylon nuts, you can see that string 9 has 3 nuts on the raise part (upper section) of that finger. Meanwhile, the chart shows that in the entire copedent, there's supposedly only 1 raise on string 9. So, with 3 nuts, we know there are unexplained pedals or knees that raise string 9 that aren't listed on the chart. It's VERY likely that one of those 3 is connected to the A-pedal, which is what we want.

2) The other questionable item was that the B-pedal was missing the raise on the 3rd string.
The chart lists no changes on string 3 in the entire copedent.
But the photo shows that there is a nylon nut on the 3rd string, in the 'raise' section. This is almost certainly connected to the B-pedal.

My guess is that somebody unscrewed those two nylon nuts enough so that they weren't engaging. If you checked the copedent by stepping on pedals and listening for changes... those two wouldn't have been noted. This is good news because it means the changes are actually there. The hardware is in place. All you have to do is tune up those nuts.

This copedent appears to be useable universal tuning. It's not completely Newman... Newman's pedals 6 and 7 are shifted over one position to the left on this GFI (to the pedal 5 and 6 position). And Newman's pedal 4 is in position 7 here.

Newman's P5, which should be on P4 here, are the biggest difference; they share one string change, but not two others. I can't explain what the former owner was doing on that pedal.

This might be easier to read than the sideways Newman chart posted above. Look at "E9/B6:"
https://steelguitarforum.com/b0b/jefftune.html
.

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