1rst string, G or G # ?

Chris Grotewohl · From: Kansas City (Roeland Park)

Howdy folks,
Being a banjo player of 30 yrs plus I have a stupid question which is normal from a banjo player. I know music theory, play Jazz, Swing etc... on banjo etc... and so on. Looking at previous posts and searching, I see the 1rst string change to G, and also G#. I have never been able incorp. the G change for chord changes etc.. Yes I am reborn on the steel and play a Dekley 3/4. I raise my 1rst with my RKR to a G and have since raised the string to a G#. It took some time moving stops and using cuss words to make it happen but achieved the task. Now I have excessive RKR movement and don't know if the G# change is worth it. I'm probably missing the boat here. I still can't see a huge benifit besides a drone with the 3rd and some different sounds with the B pedal mashed. I guess after spending a few hours trying to adjust everything I need to give it some time. Any feedback would be great, Thamks, Chris

Billy Carr · From: Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)

Hey Chris, I used the F# to G pull for years. Mainly because that was what was on the older guitars I played. There's a lot of good licks, mostly uptempo you can use the G note with. For me the F# to G# pull is something I had to get used to playing. I mainly use it on slow songs but sometimes I use on shuffles and such. The G# is used a lot with the 2nd string. Like this, F# to G# on 1st and Dflat(C#) raised up to E. These two are played together on a lot of licks. If I had one of the older model guitars that was designed to pull the F# to G then that's where I would leave it. Just my .02 worth! Good luck!

Jack Stoner · From: Kansas City, MO

Chris, The 1st string raise, along with several other common pedal/knee lever changes are mainly used for "licks", not for chords.

The leverage, e.g. which hole you use on the changer and which hole/slot on the rod puller will affect the travel on the knee lever. Try a different hole in the changer and see if that makes a difference. The hole closest to the top of the changer is the least travel and the lowest raise hole will be the most travel, in an all-pull guitar.

My guitar has the 1st string full tone raise (F# to G#) plus the 2nd string half tone raise (Eb to E) and also lowers the 6th string a full tone (G# to F#) with a half tone lower using a split with the "B" pedal.

Raising both the 1st and 2nd strings, as I have will give you a moving chord change and the classic steel guitar change. Strings 1, 2, and 5 at the open position is a B chord. Raising both 1st and 2nd, as I have changes the B to E, at the open position. Or if you only have the 1st string raise to G#, using it combination with the 5th string will still give you two notes of a chord.

(BTW, I'll be back in KC in late August - Keep the Gates BBQ going for me).

Bob Carlucci · From: Candor, New York, USA

Chris.. personally ,I like Jacks thoughts.. I too pull that f# up a full...
my second string is an E, but I use the first string pull similarly to what Jack was saying.

What I have done over time, is gotten used to "half pedaling" that pull... You will get used to it if you do it enough.. and you'll have the G and the G# right there.
. You might also add a half stop.. giving you the G and the G # in two steps.. just an idea... bob

David Doggett · Posted 10 Jun 2005 8:12 am

I have the 1st string (and 7th string) pull to G# on my left knee vertical. Like Bob, I have gotten use to getting the G with a half lever action. I use both these notes in rifs and runs, not chords, so a little sloppiness in getting the G is not noticeable.

If I had only one, I would want the G. With my toes holding down the A and B pedals, it is very natural to raise my knee to get the flatted 7th (minor 7th or dominant 7th). This is a much used note in rock and blues, and rock/blues oriented country.

When playing blues and jazz from the A pedal minor position, the G gives the flatted 5th, which is a very important part of blues and jazz runs.

In the small amount of classical music I experiment with, in minor keys the G raise provides the 7th with the V chord (drop back one fret from the tonic minor and hit the A and B pedals), which is a commonly used melody note.

Of course, the G changes the open major chord to a minor by flatting the 3rd, but I don't use that much.

The G# gives unisons for the 3rd and 6th strings. This is nice to have, but not as essential as the G raise.

[This message was edited by David Doggett on 10 June 2005 at 09:24 AM.]

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

Having a solid G is important if you're going to go up and down the harmony scales on your first two strings.

C scale on top two strings with G lever:


F# _1___2#__4#__6___8___9#__11__13_


D# _1___2___4___6___8___9___11__13_


notes:


    G   A   B   C   D   E   F   G


    E   F   G   A   B   C   D   E


alternate positions for same notes with D lever:


F# _1___3___5___6___8___10__11__13_


D# _1___3b__5b__6___8___10b_11__13_

The two levers produce the same harmonies but at different frets, so the effect has a different timbre depending on which you use. Also, the choice of one over the other might be driven by what position you are using on the other strings.

The G# isn't necessary at all if you don't mind slanting the bar now and then, in my opinion.
------------------

Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Williams D-12 E9, C6add9, Sierra Olympic S-12 (F Diatonic)
Sierra Laptop S-8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster D-8 (E13, C6 or A6)

[This message was edited by Bobby Lee on 10 June 2005 at 10:28 AM.]

Chris Grotewohl · From: Kansas City (Roeland Park)

Thanks Everyone on the replies. I thought my post was dead in the water and maybe I didn't make it very clear. Now, look at at the great replies. I am going to leave it at G# for now but might set it back to G later. I have almost fallen out of my chair a few times trying to get the G# with all the travel. I'll experiment. Thank you, Chris

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