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Topic: I can hardly listen to Buddy |
Steve Huddleston
From:
Arizona, USA
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Posted 27 Mar 2017 8:10 pm |
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| As a new player when I hear Buddy's stuff, it's almost depressing because I'll never even approach that level, both the technical side and the musical side. Anyone else have these thoughts? |
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Bill L. Wilson
From:
Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 27 Mar 2017 9:58 pm Buddy Was Special.
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| We as mere mortals can only dream of being able to play like Buddy, but realizing our limitations and just enjoying what we can do on this instrument is the only reward we're going to get. I stay busy most weekends playing steel and guitar in a country rock band, and at "70" yrs. old I'm just glad someone wants me in their band. Depressed? No. Frustrated? Sometimes. But always willing to learn and try something new. If you mess with one of these things very long, you're going to make sounds that will inspire you to want to keep on. Don't Give Up. |
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Tommy White
From:
Nashville
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Posted 28 Mar 2017 12:12 am
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Bill Wilson's reply is spot on. ðŸ‘ðŸ»
Last edited by Tommy White on 28 Mar 2017 8:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
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Pat Moore
From:
Virginia USA
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Posted 28 Mar 2017 5:07 am
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Bill Wilson's thread is exactly right. It also applies to Tommy White!
Pat  |
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Dick Wood
From:
Springtown Texas, USA
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Posted 28 Mar 2017 1:24 pm
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In 1982 I had only been playing steel in a band about a year when I heard Buddy was going to put on a seminar at a local bar between Dallas and Fort Worth.
Me and maybe 100 other steel players watched Buddy play for around an hour and a half. I remember telling a friend that he had to be from another Universe. After the show, I walked out of the club so depressed at my ability that I almost threw a ZB SD10 into the dumpster behind the club.
I drove past the dumpster but luckily I kept going determined that even though I would never play at his level, I would rise to my own whatever that would be.
My deep desire to learn this instrument hung in there and I stayed with it for 37 years now. I met untold numbers of friends,played places I would never have gone to and made a pretty nice side income.
I still can't play like Buddy,Tommy,Paul or the rest of the greats but I play like me and I keep getting calls to work with bands that like what I do and that's my reward.
_________________
Cops aren't paid much so I steel at night. |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 4:11 am
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TRUE, me, and others like me will never play like Buddy, thats a given. Quite frankly I am not even trying to achieve that level. My days are occupied with many other things. But what I do take away from listening to Buddy, as well as others, is pure inspiration and idea's which I may never have thought of.
Even if I grab ONE phrase or substitution, thats the reward, especially if I start using it on a regular basis.
When I played ball, the coaches used to tell us smaller guys, hit singles , practice hitting singles, let those other guys hit the long ball. Practice hitting singles.
So, I play singles ! 
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders , Eastman Mandolin ,
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 4:46 am Re: I can hardly listen to Buddy
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| Steve Huddleston wrote: |
| As a new player when I hear Buddy's stuff, it's almost depressing because I'll never even approach that level, both the technical side and the musical side. Anyone else have these thoughts? |
It get's worse the more you listen to him ! Once you figure out how to play some of the notes on the steel that he played you start to hear the subtleties of his phrasing, pitch and musicality.
He set the bar pretty freakin high !
_________________
Bob |
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Olli Haavisto
From:
Jarvenpaa,Finland
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 5:02 am
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Even if you don`t try to copy him, listening to him will affect your approach to the instrument and music in a lot of positive ways. Just let it flow into your mind and it will be there when you`re ready.
_________________
Olli Haavisto
Finland |
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Frank Freniere
From:
The First Coast
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 5:42 am Re: I can hardly listen to Buddy
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| Bob Hoffnar wrote: |
It get's worse the more you listen to him ! Once you figure out how to play some of the notes on the steel that he played you start to hear the subtleties of his phrasing, pitch and musicality.
He set the bar pretty freakin high ! |
+1 |
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Hal Higgins
From:
Denham Springs, LA
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 5:57 am
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I had the great and awesome pleasure to sit side by side with the master of this instrument, and what a thrill that was for me.....I had been playing about 3 years, and Buddy complimented my playing. I could feel the hotness in my face as I know I was blushing. Those moments are what I treasure. He was, indeed, an incredible innovator and a monster player. One of my very favorite videos that I watch of him is at the St. Louis convention when he and Laney Hicks did "The Nameless Shuffle". So smooth, rich tone, btw it's in the hands, and not one single flaw in the performance. Just one of the many performances from the greatest steel guitarist who ever sat behind this instrument. IMHO
_________________
HAL...Excel D-10 w/ 8 & 5. SteelSeat.com w/back,SteelSeat.com Pedal Board on Legs with Quilter Tone Block 200 amp, Boss GE 7, Boss DD 3, Boss RV 6, Boss RT-20 Hilton Expression Pedal, Evans Cabinet with 4 ohm Eminence 15" speaker. BJS birthstone bar, Powder coated Tone bar by Michael Hillman. Dunlop Coated finger picks and Zookies L30 thumb picks. |
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Mark Eaton
From:
Sonoma County in The Great State Of Northern California
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 8:13 am
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At least as a new player you know that you have nowhere to go but up.
There are no doubt many version of folks having feelings like this regarding different instruments when comparing themselves to the masters.
I've used the analogy below several times, it applies to dobro, but it works with probably anything from pedal steel to saxophone. And the person I was speaking with wasn't new, he had been playing dobro for at least three years but he wasn't a long-time veteran either. I lifted this from a thread here in 2016:
"Reminds me of a story of watching the Jerry Douglas Band tear it up at a Bay Area show about 13 years ago. For context, this is during the time when Barry Bonds was still on the San Francisco Giants and hitting the crap out of a baseball on a regular basis.
There were a few of us dobro/steel players sharing a table. At the conclusion of the show one of the guys turns to me and says, "now I'm gonna go home and burn my dobros in the fireplace."
Obviously he was kidding, but as a basis for comparison I said to him, "if you play on an amateur hardball or softball team and you go to a Giants game and Bonds hits a couple out of the park, do you say to the guy next to you, 'when I get home I'm gonna use my bats for firewood?' Of course you don't - and this isn't really all that different.""
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Mark |
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Brett Lanier
From:
Madison, TN
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 9:21 am
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| Now imagine trying to play all that stuff live in a room with everyone else; without the option of overdubbing or even taking the steel out of the mix, and on a song you just learned. Perhaps on a tuning and copedent you've just settled on... |
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Mike Neer
From:
NJ
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 9:38 am
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Use the greatness of other musicians to set high goals for yourself. Like Wes Montgomery said of Charlie Christian (paraphrased) "he had 5 fingers on both his hands and so do I."
The only time I get truly depressed is when I listen to an amazing vocalist, like Donny Hathaway or Stevie Wonder. No amount of practice can give me a voice like that.
_________________
Links to streaming music, websites, YouTube: Links |
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David Mitchell
From:
Tyler, Texas
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 10:20 am
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There's a guy that made a comment above named Dale Rottacker that comes as close to thinking and playing with the finesse of Buddy Emmons as anyone I have ever heard and I spent my career recording and producing some of the most famous steel players and singers in the world. The beauty of what Buddy played and what Dale plays is they can get the song across in a splendid way without overplaying senseless crap that has nothing to do with the song. If you would like to hear how Buddy Emmons would have interpreted and executed a song ask Dale Rottacker to play it for you. With that said we have to give Buddy Emmons full credit for showing everybody how beautiful a pedal steel guitar can sound.
Here is an example of one of Dale's recordings on YouTube under his channel name "Steelinatune". Listen to the whole thing because like Buddy Emmons it just keeps getting better and better as the song rolls along. Spend a day listening to his touch. He does some Emmons originals too like Nameless Shuffle.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUCDuHeN17o[url] |
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James Kerr
From:
Scotland, UK
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 12:00 pm
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This is a subject I have never fully understood, and will probably have trouble putting into words. I really can't understand why a very large number of Musicians spend their lives trying to sound exactly like someone else, putting in hours & hours of repetitive practise to master a single line someone else played, and whipping themselves if they fail.
Can anyone tell me who Buddy Emmons emulated when he was starting out, did he faithfully copy what someone else did at that time, or did he only ever want to be Buddy Emmons? I understand there was a time when he couldn't find work as a Steel Guitarist and played Bass.
James Kerr. |
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Justin Mills
From:
South Carolina, USA
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 12:33 pm
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| a guy once told me when i started playing drums over 30 years ago, when i first listened to Buddy Rich, i said "i should just quit now, ill never be able to do that" and he said "don't say that, he did it didn't he? so that means its possible." pretty simple to say, but i have carried that with me in my music no matter what instrument i play for 30 years now. |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 1:51 pm
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| James Kerr wrote: |
This is a subject I have never fully understood, and will probably have trouble putting into words. I really can't understand why a very large number of Musicians spend their lives trying to sound exactly like someone else, putting in hours & hours of repetitive practise to master a single line someone else played, and whipping themselves if they fail.
Can anyone tell me who Buddy Emmons emulated when he was starting out, did he faithfully copy what someone else did at that time, or did he only ever want to be Buddy Emmons? I understand there was a time when he couldn't find work as a Steel Guitarist and played Bass.
James Kerr. |
Yes. Buddy studied and learned from the masters that came before him. Check out Joaquin Murphey and Al Martino. I'll bet dollars to donuts that Buddy spent more of his life practicing and being frustrated then us "mortal" players.
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Bob |
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Larry Haas
From:
Morganton, North Carolina USA
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 2:13 pm
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| James Kerr wrote: |
This is a subject I have never fully understood, and will probably have trouble putting into words. I really can't understand why a very large number of Musicians spend their lives trying to sound exactly like someone else, putting in hours & hours of repetitive practise to master a single line someone else played, and whipping themselves if they fail.
Can anyone tell me who Buddy Emmons emulated when he was starting out, did he faithfully copy what someone else did at that time, or did he only ever want to be Buddy Emmons? I understand there was a time when he couldn't find work as a Steel Guitarist and played Bass.
James Kerr. |
James I think most would like to be able to play like the original song or CD. Most can't because they are not the person playing it. Everyone has a goal whether they think it or not. Everyone has different physical and mental abilities. There are a lot of very good players but I don't think anyone can match the style or playing that another person does. Each has their own style. I can't match your style and I am sure you couldn't match my terrible playing. I listen to a lot of players but can't play along with them or even get close. I am not one for words so I hope you understand I know what you are saying.
I listen to your Youtube videos a lot and really enjoy your style with the lap steel but I can't play like you play.
Larry |
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Curt Trisko
From:
St. Paul, Minnesota, USA
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 3:30 pm
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| James Kerr wrote: |
This is a subject I have never fully understood, and will probably have trouble putting into words. I really can't understand why a very large number of Musicians spend their lives trying to sound exactly like someone else, putting in hours & hours of repetitive practise to master a single line someone else played, and whipping themselves if they fail.
Can anyone tell me who Buddy Emmons emulated when he was starting out, did he faithfully copy what someone else did at that time, or did he only ever want to be Buddy Emmons? I understand there was a time when he couldn't find work as a Steel Guitarist and played Bass.
James Kerr. |
I totally agree. Proficiency and artistry are two different things. It takes proficiency to convey one's artistry, but without a person having their own artistry, the quest for proficiency lacks oomph and aim.
I am guilty of playing famous steel guitarists' parts over and over again hoping that some of their artistry will become a part of how I play. However, where I feel my hands, ears, and musical feeling most develop is when I create my own parts for songs. My point is that I think it's artistry that motivates proficiency and so if proficiency is your goal, concentrate on your own musical expression instead of fixating too much on others'. |
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 3:33 pm
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| Bob Hoffnar wrote: |
| Yes. Buddy studied and learned from the masters that came before him. Check out Joaquin Murphey and Al Martino... |
You probably meant to type "Pat Martino", yes? Al Martino was a pretty good singer but I'm not sure he was much of an influence on E.
_________________
www.JimCohen.com
www.RonstadtRevue.com
www.BeatsWalkin.com |
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 3:37 pm
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I remember when I first bought and heard The Black Album thinking to myself that this playing could not possibly have been generated by human agency. It seemed to me that there must have been some kind of high-precision device or machine that was capable of generating these sounds with this level of accuracy, emotional content and absolute perfection. I just could not fathom how any human being could possibly have played thusly.
And I still can't. Even though I've seen it with my own eyes, many times. He was one-of-a-kind, irreplaceable, and I consider myself extremely fortunate to have lived during his lifetime, let alone to have had him as a teacher and friend.
_________________
www.JimCohen.com
www.RonstadtRevue.com
www.BeatsWalkin.com |
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David Mitchell
From:
Tyler, Texas
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Posted 29 Mar 2017 11:07 pm
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Remember the story Lloyd Green tells in his autobiography about how one day during one of his first Nashville sessions Grady Martin turned him into a real artist instead of a copycat. Grady knew Lloyd had a lot of potential or he would not have called him.
He said after a few takes into the song Grady stopped the session and told him "If we wanted Buddy Emmons style we would have called Buddy Emmons. We want Lloyd Green on this record." Lloyd said from then on he approached everything with his own creative attitude. The fact is everyone has to learn from someone. When you have conquered other styles then if you want to go to the top you become an artist and be yourself and pave the way for others. |
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Paul King
From:
Gainesville, Texas, USA
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Posted 30 Mar 2017 1:26 am
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| No two players think alike or nor do they play alike. I have heard steel players tell me when they go to a show it makes them want to go home and sell all their equiptment. The reason is they will never play like Emmons, Rugg, Franklin etc. To me it inspires me and makes me want to do better. I know that I will never reach the level as men of that caliber but hearing them made me want more of their music. Yes, many of those men set the bar extremely high and they did it without all the effects and modern equiptment we have today. I encourage anyone who is thinking about selling for such a reason as listed above please reconsider. The high 90% of us will never reach an Emmons level. |
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David Mitchell
From:
Tyler, Texas
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Posted 30 Mar 2017 8:45 am
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| Paul King wrote: |
| The high 90% of us will never reach an Emmons level. |
True. Just like almost all oil and canvas painters will never be Michelangelo or Leonardo da Vinci.
Consider it a blessing from God to be able to play anything on a musical intrument. |
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