Are 12 string Universal Pedal Steels popular these days?

Steve Gabler · From: Ohio, USA

I am wanting to know if a Carter 12 string Universal holds its value like other steel guitars that are selling these days. Are they easy to sell if I want to change to an S-10? Thanks!

Larry Phleger · From: DuBois, PA

I have owned a Carter U12 for over 15 years. It has been an extremely dependable guitar with great sound and it stays in tune better than anything I have ever owned. A guitar like the one I own currently sells for about the same as I paid for mine.

Steve Gabler · From: Ohio, USA

Thanks Larry! I am thinking about buying one. What whould you think a Carter 12 string (black) in average condition (some scratches here and there) is worth? I am going to look at it today. I am guessing $1200-$1400.What do you think?

Tom Campbell · From: Houston, Texas, USA

Think more in terms of $1750 -$1800 for a Carter U12.

Steve Gabler · From: Ohio, USA

Thanks so much Tom!

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

It'll hold its value, will take a bit longer to sell
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Steve Gabler · From: Ohio, USA

Thanks! Thats what I wanted to know. I went to look at the Carter today and It looked ok. I printed out a chart to see if the knee levers went with the chart... The knee levers did not change pitch on all of the strings like the chart showed. Is this normal?

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

If you are saying that the guitar is not consistent with the chart of this guitar that the seller is providing, I'd want to know why.
But if you are saying that it does not comply with a generic chart you found online...I would venture to say that there are more guitars with variations on the setup than there are with 'standard' changes.
Yes, there is a rough standard but no, there's too much independent thinking to find too many guitars that are absolutely stock 'standard'. Close, yes, but little stuff....there's room for a lot of personalization.
(Someone might say that I'm wrong re: there being more non-standard guitars....so I took some license. Sue me).

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

I strongly suggest that you learn how to do stuff underneath the guitar. It is rewarding and it is just good to perform your own maintenance. Among my guitars is a Carter 12 and it has quirks that are good to know but it is a fine guitar. Plenty of help right here when you need it.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Well, it probably won't lose much value...if its priced right, but you should take into consideration that Uni's probably make up less than five or ten percent of the PSG market, so it won't appeal to as many players as a ten-stringer.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

There are probably more Universal players out there than people realize. I would guess the S10 is the most popular followed by D10, then S12. Some people like a 12 string extended E9th tuning which really just adds two more strings on the bottom.

Posted here on b0b's links pages are some common Universal tunings: http://b0b.com/wp/?page_id=690

Also from the old Carter website: http://steelguitar.com/sampleS12Tuning.html

I would suggest you stay with one of these even if you have to make a few changes. I've seen some really messed up guitars with illogical setups that make the guitar hard to play. This can lead to frustration and lack of interest. JMO.

We might be able to tell you more if you can post the current set-up on this guitar.

Bobby D. Jones · From: West Virginia, USA

Hi Stephen. There is 3 different 12 string tunings for a steel guitar. UNIVERSAL, Extended E9th and Extended C6. Then varations of these. For Universal alone there is tunings by Jeff Newman, Sierra, Excel, BMI, Franklin and GFI surf the net will give you many different setups.

If pedals do not work check to see if it has bell cranks and pull rods in place. Many who are not using a pedal or lever will back the nylon tuning nut off so if they hit the pedal or lever by mistake nothing will happen. Good Luck in your venture.

Ken Metcalf · From: San Antonio Texas USA

A 12 string in split cases is nice and light to haul around.
If you want to play a little 6th stuff without lugging a D-10.

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Ken is spot on - that's why I converted. My D10 is basic so I could bring all my changes with me. I guess if you have a really loaded twin-neck you'd have to make compromises, but I didn't.
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Larry Phleger · From: DuBois, PA

If you are planning to work on a Carter, remember that the bell crank shafts are hollow. This means that you should be careful not to over tighten the set screws on the puller. Carter warns against this in the literature they sent with their new instruments.

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Ollin Landers · From: Willow Springs, NC

I have both a Carter S-12 and a Zum SD-12. Both have an identical setup with very minor differences. One has splits on 6 the other on 5.

I paid a little less than the avg price for my Carter and it was in excellent shape. I'm watching the value go up every year.

I'm with Ken and Ian. I have never owned a D-10. I play 80% E9 and occasionally play some C6. But I have the added advantage of the lower 2 strings when I need to play some rock riffs without switching necks.

When I have the occasion to play an S-10 or D-10 the problem is not the copedent as much as it is the 12 strings. It takes me awhile to shift from 12 to 10 and hit the right strings. And there's always the "whoa" I can't do that on an S-10.
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Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Mike Ester · From: New Braunfels, Texas, USA

Got an '05 Carter S12U. I like it a lot.

Let's see... 87lb D10 or 31lb Uni? Hmm...tough choice. Wink

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2005 Carter S12U 7x5
1978 Sho-Bud Pro II Custom 8x4

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Tim Brady · From: Ohio, USA

I've had an S12 Carter 7/5 set up to a variant of an E9 Extended for many years. It has a George L on it. It is completely reliable, just never has issues. It stays in tune like a dream, just perfect in that way. Seems to play easy, re pulls etc. The tone...well I sort of envy the guys with the Sho buds, and Emmons and the like. I can just never get my guitar to have the sweet, flowery, rich tone that they get so often. It sound "stringy," or if I don't watch out even shrill or tinny. Bobby Cox helped me out with my amp settings, and I got a whole lot of improvement. Maybe the tone is in my hands, but I still cannot get that really sweet sound that some good players get.
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Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Alan Simon · From: Tennessee, USA

Try another pickup. Sure made mine sound better. Truetone or Alumitone.

Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

if you want to play an S10 get an S10. A U12 is a different beast. The trade offs between a U 12 and S 10'are significant. The U12 suits many players but does not have the elegance of a simple E9 tuned S10 steel. That is why the market for S10 giutars is so much more active.

My advice if you are just getting started is keep it simple and start with an S10. Once you get going a bit you can see what suits you.
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Mark van Allen · From: Watkinsville, Ga. USA

They are (popular) with meâ€¦

I agree with Bob on beginners looking at 10 strings, especially if classic country or americana is your bag. Resale, relative ease of setup, weight, and other factors all support that choice.

I only wish I'd not been discouraged from exploring the U12 direction when I first wanted to move beyond E9. Apart from fully chromatic chord subs/extensions, the U12 has everything I need from E9 and C6 tunings, with the freedom and fun of morphing from one to the other, and a whole LOT of stuff to explore into my dotage. So hip.
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