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Topic: Help identify this guitar |
Barry Gokee
From:
Sault Ste Marie Michigan, USA
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Posted 13 Sep 2016 6:44 pm |
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Looking for info on this MSA. Picked up at garage sale. tryin to figure out year and such.Guys chime in... I hope I can upload a couple of photos..Thanks Barry
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Justice Prolite Sd 10 Mullen D10
2 Msa D-10s HMS Sd 10
2 Session 500 Session 2000
Nashville 112 Pro-fex |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 13 Sep 2016 6:52 pm
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Those angles make it hard to tell. I'm betting on OLD.
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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David Nugent
From:
Gum Spring, Va.
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Posted 14 Sep 2016 4:06 am
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| The logo is one of their early versions so I agree with Lane (old), perhaps early '70's?. |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 14 Sep 2016 4:21 am
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Pre Classic design.. Probably very early 70's,.. They are supposed to be nice sounding, but kind of clunky mechanically compared to modern systems.. They don't seem to be an easy sale on these pages.. A few years after this guitar was built, MSA came out with their innovative all pull system which was the prototype for modern all pull systems,and is still today among the very best... Yours is a cool guitar however,and I hope you got a good deal...
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I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Jeff Harbour
From:
Western Ohio, USA
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Posted 14 Sep 2016 4:41 am
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Contact Kyle Bennett at the new MSA company. Assuming that the serial number is still visible (you didn't say anything about it), he should have the books with all the info for the new or old MSA company guitars.
Last edited by Jeff Harbour on 14 Sep 2016 12:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Paul Wade
From:
mundelein,ill
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Bill Ford
From:
Graniteville SC Aiken
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Posted 14 Sep 2016 5:31 am
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A good shot of the changer and end plate top & bottom would help, don't remember seeing that style underside on MSA.
BF
_________________
Bill Ford S12 CLR, S12 Lamar keyless, Misc amps&toys Sharp Covers
Steeling for Jesus now!!! |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 14 Sep 2016 7:21 am
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| Because it looks to be a factory-made undercarriage, I'm thinking that may be an MSA "Imperial" model. These were the first rodded MSA guitars, and if memory serves me correctly, they came out around 1971 (right before the MSA Micro models were introduced). If that's what it is, it's a very rare bird! In over 50 years of playing, I've never even seen an Imperial, only a couple of pictures of them. Before that, the MSA guitars used draw-bars, either the rotating style, or end pivot style. |
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Bill Ford
From:
Graniteville SC Aiken
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Posted 14 Sep 2016 11:07 am
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Donny, Wasn't the Imperial model the first maple/lacquer model? I had a late 60s, early 70s Formica (not Imperial) with the flat bars underneath, wish I still had the brochure showing the Imperial and the model I had....the maple was maybe later, just curious.
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Bill Ford S12 CLR, S12 Lamar keyless, Misc amps&toys Sharp Covers
Steeling for Jesus now!!! |
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Barry Gokee
From:
Sault Ste Marie Michigan, USA
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Posted 14 Sep 2016 1:38 pm More Pics
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Hey Guys, a couple more pics of the old MSA. the serial # is 200194.(odd).. Keep the thoughts comin. I can only insert 2 pics at a time. Thanks
[img]http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/userpix1504/12976_14365450_1079146295501498_885710734_n_1.jpg[/img
_________________
Justice Prolite Sd 10 Mullen D10
2 Msa D-10s HMS Sd 10
2 Session 500 Session 2000
Nashville 112 Pro-fex |
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Barry Gokee
From:
Sault Ste Marie Michigan, USA
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Posted 14 Sep 2016 2:07 pm More pics old MSA
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_________________
Justice Prolite Sd 10 Mullen D10
2 Msa D-10s HMS Sd 10
2 Session 500 Session 2000
Nashville 112 Pro-fex |
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Jeff Harbour
From:
Western Ohio, USA
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Darvin Willhoite
From:
Roxton, Tx. USA
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Posted 15 Sep 2016 8:20 am
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The body, logo, and changer looks like mid-60s to early 70s, but all of them I've seen had flat cross bars instead of shafts. This could be a transitional style that only a few were made, possibly an Imperial model as has been mentioned. Kyle was probably a teenager when this one was built  , but he knows a lot about the history of these, as do David Wright, and Junior Knight.
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Darvin Willhoite
MSA Millennium, Legend, and Studio Pro, Reese's restored Universal Direction guitar, a restored MSA Classic SS, several amps, new and old, and a Kemper Powerhead that I am really liking. Also a Zum D10, a Mullen RP, and a restored Rose S10, named the "Blue Bird". Also, I have acquired and restored the plexiglass D10 MSA Classic that was built as a demo in the early '70s. I also have a '74 lacquer P/P, with wood necks, and a showroom condition Sho-Bud Super Pro. |
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Barry Gokee
From:
Sault Ste Marie Michigan, USA
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Posted 15 Sep 2016 2:41 pm old msa
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Darvin, It would be wonderful if Kyle or David would chime in. Kyle tells me that serial # does not exist in MSA data. So maybe it is an imperial. It would be awesome if someone would tell me where i could find a photo of a imperial, as no one has seen this type of undercarriage. This vintage ought to be flat bar pull design. I dont know, maybe a prototype or one of a kind. Serial number is 200194. most 200 numbers were 66-67 era. Cant wait to restring it, give her a couple tweaks and play it.
_________________
Justice Prolite Sd 10 Mullen D10
2 Msa D-10s HMS Sd 10
2 Session 500 Session 2000
Nashville 112 Pro-fex |
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David Wright
From:
Pilot Point ,Tx USA.
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 1:59 am
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This guitar is pre MSA/Micro, I gave Kyle the #, he has nothing on it..and was not part of MSA at the time guitar was built. It was built in Oak Cliff...If it is a Imperial, My Dad built it, He was brought on board 67 or 68 to be production manager for MSA and he still built Sierras in the same shop..I have never seen cross rods like this, on MSA or Sierras...for me it's a mystery, It looks like a old Sho Bud system????& Emmons parts? it is a MSA changer for sure...Flat bars would have been on this guitar...The people that might know more are all gone now, My dad, Bud, Maurice.  ....I'm still looking for the answer... |
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Darvin Willhoite
From:
Roxton, Tx. USA
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 3:45 am
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I would bet the undercarriage has been changed from the original flat bar system. I've seen similar parts on an old Miller guitar.
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Darvin Willhoite
MSA Millennium, Legend, and Studio Pro, Reese's restored Universal Direction guitar, a restored MSA Classic SS, several amps, new and old, and a Kemper Powerhead that I am really liking. Also a Zum D10, a Mullen RP, and a restored Rose S10, named the "Blue Bird". Also, I have acquired and restored the plexiglass D10 MSA Classic that was built as a demo in the early '70s. I also have a '74 lacquer P/P, with wood necks, and a showroom condition Sho-Bud Super Pro. |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 4:35 am
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| Darvin Willhoite wrote: |
| I would bet the undercarriage has been changed from the original flat bar system. |
I was thinking the same thing.
The guitar would probably be an excellent instrument if it was retrofitted with modern mechanics.
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Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Bill Ford
From:
Graniteville SC Aiken
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 5:43 am
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| Darvin Willhoite wrote: |
| I would bet the undercarriage has been changed from the original flat bar system. I've seen similar parts on an old Miller guitar. |
I have also seen a flat bar conversion..BF
_________________
Bill Ford S12 CLR, S12 Lamar keyless, Misc amps&toys Sharp Covers
Steeling for Jesus now!!! |
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Darvin Willhoite
From:
Roxton, Tx. USA
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 5:54 am
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Here are two flat bar conversions I did.
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Darvin Willhoite
MSA Millennium, Legend, and Studio Pro, Reese's restored Universal Direction guitar, a restored MSA Classic SS, several amps, new and old, and a Kemper Powerhead that I am really liking. Also a Zum D10, a Mullen RP, and a restored Rose S10, named the "Blue Bird". Also, I have acquired and restored the plexiglass D10 MSA Classic that was built as a demo in the early '70s. I also have a '74 lacquer P/P, with wood necks, and a showroom condition Sho-Bud Super Pro. |
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Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 6:00 am
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| Darvin- udaman |
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Barry Gokee
From:
Sault Ste Marie Michigan, USA
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 6:37 am old MSA
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Darvin, how many hours do you put into that type of upgrade? And approximate cost. I can apply for loan today... Lol.
_________________
Justice Prolite Sd 10 Mullen D10
2 Msa D-10s HMS Sd 10
2 Session 500 Session 2000
Nashville 112 Pro-fex |
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Barry Gokee
From:
Sault Ste Marie Michigan, USA
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 6:45 am Old Msa
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Thanks guys for the info on this beast. I was thinking if this was upgraded back in the day it would possibly be full of old holes. It has 3 holes from previous work. Im gonna get her tuned and fired up this weekend. Hope its got potential and not a pile. Best thing Ive come across from Rafters of a garage. Thanks again Guys...
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Justice Prolite Sd 10 Mullen D10
2 Msa D-10s HMS Sd 10
2 Session 500 Session 2000
Nashville 112 Pro-fex |
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Darvin Willhoite
From:
Roxton, Tx. USA
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Posted 16 Sep 2016 6:51 am
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I didn't keep track of my hours on those two, I really didn't want to know how much time I spent. I'm a big fan of all MSA's and it was mostly a "labor of love". I would guess 80-100 hours, and a lot of that was lathe and mill time. You could probably buy a nice Classic S10, or S12 cheaper than you could convert yours. From what I see, yours can probably be made playable the way it is. The changer is sort of similar to an old ZB and should work fine with a fairly simple setup.
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Darvin Willhoite
MSA Millennium, Legend, and Studio Pro, Reese's restored Universal Direction guitar, a restored MSA Classic SS, several amps, new and old, and a Kemper Powerhead that I am really liking. Also a Zum D10, a Mullen RP, and a restored Rose S10, named the "Blue Bird". Also, I have acquired and restored the plexiglass D10 MSA Classic that was built as a demo in the early '70s. I also have a '74 lacquer P/P, with wood necks, and a showroom condition Sho-Bud Super Pro. |
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George Duncan Sypert
From:
Colo Spgs, Co, USA
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Posted 22 Sep 2016 4:55 pm Msa
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I had a double 12 MSA that I think was built in 1970 or 1969. I bought it new after discussion with Maurice. It had the round cross rods with threaded holes for the screws to go into with the hole in the head for the pull rod.
If these were set up too high they would break off like crazy. It was heavy, heavy, heavy. Did I say it was heavey? It was a pain in the you know what to work on or try to change the setup. It came with two knee levers on the right knee. Later I had a guy make me some knee levers to match the originals and put them on the left.
Eventually I had to make some of those screws myself because they kept breaking off.
I managed to sell the guitar sometime in the late 80's or early 90's. I can't say I was sorry to see it go. I probably spent as much money on back adjustments as I earned playing it.
All this to say that the round cross rods with holes with machine threads were orignal design.. Very shortly after that they went to a complete new better design. Wish I had known they were going to design something better.
George |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 22 Sep 2016 6:29 pm
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Thanks George...Imperial it is.  |
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