| Author |
Topic: 12" Speaker Shootout |
John Goux
From:
California, USA
|
Posted 19 May 2016 12:13 am |
|
Today I did a 12" speaker comparison. I'm posting my subjective opinions for anyone interested, as changing and auditioning speakers can be a time consuming process.
The test was done with this equipment:
Guitar: Williams S12 with Telonics pickup
Vol Ped: Goodrich passive, no buffer
Amps:
BF Fender Bassman, modded w/ mid, presence and reverb
BF Fender Princeton Reverb
Milkman 40 mini with Jupiter ceramic
Rivera era Deluxe Reverb II with EVM
(no solid state amps)
Speakers:
EVM 12L in open back
EVM in Deluxe II combo
Jupiter ceramic in Milkman combo
Celestion V-30 in closed back cube
Celestion 65 in open back
Celestion G30 Anniversary open back
(caveat, no JBL, BW or Neo speakers in test, sorry. I just didn't have any to throw into the mix)
A test like this illustrates how important your choice of speaker is. There was a wide range of perceived headroom, volume, punch, breakup and EQ.
I love Fender tube amps for steel. My main amp is a Pro Reverb with C12Ns. That amp is great for practice and medium size stages, but does not have the headroom for a clean steel sound with a loud band.
I have found the Fender amps are well suited for traditional lower output pickups, but struggle with clean headroom using modern higher output pickups like the Telonics or BL 705.
The headroom issue with high output pickups/Fender tube amps is partly preamp stage, partly power stage, but importantly, speaker choice.
For the test I used input #2 on the amps, which is lower in gain, and seems to ease the peaks and transients of the higher output pickups into the Fender style preamp stage.
I began the test with the Princeton Reverb with stock 10" Oxford, a sweet and even sound. With the Bassman I got a cleaner sound, and with more EQ options, so I could sculpt the tone better. The Milkman is a louder cleaner amp, by far, and was used. The Deluxe II struggled to stay clean, and I could not use the input #2 trick because of a mod.
The speaker results:
Best overall sound,
EVM in the Deluxe II cabinet. This was nearly the cleanest, was the most balanced EQ, had a smooth feel, and the larger open back cabinet gave an expansive quality. Plugging the diminutive Princeton into this EV made it seem almost as loud and clean as the 50 watt Bassman. Every amp including the Milkman sounded its best through this EV/combo cab.
Cleanest sound. Loudest sound:
The Jupiter ceramic. By a loud margin. This speaker is dramatically louder than anything else I tested. It is so efficient that even soft sounds, like hiss and hum in idle are noticeably louder(not so good in the practice room, but great on a stage). And it is not just volume, the speaker is very punchy. One benefit of this speaker's volume is that you can turn your volume knob down for better headroom from the power stage. I wish I'd had a JBL to compare it to. You will need to try the speaker to see if its EQ fits with your other equipment, as I found the EQ curve to be a bit stubborn. The Jupiter is a good option for clean steel with a loud band, in a small package.
Most contemporary:
Celestion V-30. You knew that. It sounds like a pop record. Smooth and a bit bass heavy in the cube. Occasional modulation artifacts(low difference tones) when stressed, but that is part of the charm. Forgiving highs. Easy to EQ.
Sweetest:
Celestion 65 watt. Easy on the ears and well balanced. A bit light in the low end, compared to the others. Breaks up very smooth. Probably not a good choice for pedal steel.
The rest:
EVM12L in open back. Punchy but for whatever reason not as good as the one in the Deluxe II. A bit boxy sounding. Normal variation, possibly.
Celestion G30 Anniversary. An American sounding cleaner variation of a greenback. Even, smooth breakup. Nice speaker that is good for many things but not the best at any. Good for steel if you like creamy guitar tones.
That's the test, folks. As always, YMMV. Hope this helps someone.
John |
|
|
 |
Dave Zirbel
From:
Sebastopol, CA USA
|
Posted 20 May 2016 8:49 am
|
|
Good summery, thanks. I do a lot of speaker swapping especially since I managed to blow up my jbl 
I'm having good results with a 4 ohm Jupitor alnico 12" in a modded SF Deluxe Reverb (has a bandmaster tranny and 6L6's). Played a barn gig on Wednesday and didn't need to mic it. The comments I get from my steel geek friends and sound men that I frequently work with is that it has more clarity than the jbl K120....go figure. I also tried some Tone Tubby ceramic speakers in a '66 Deluxe and a '65 Pro and they sound real good. I need to test them out a little more......
I couldn't get myself to like the Jupitor ceramic. It took a little while to break in the Jupitor alnico and it's sounding sweeter now.
Dave
_________________
Dave Zirbel-
Sierra S-10 (Built by Ross Shafer),ZB, Fender 400 guitars, various tube and SS amps |
|
|
|
kevin ryan
From:
San Marcos, California
|
Posted 20 May 2016 9:28 am
|
|
| Nice Post... I have been using 2 peavey 1201 8ohm's for 5 years, love their sound, very consistent in every playing situation.. I have tried all the light weight stuff and think they sound way too frizzy especially on strings 3&4... Is frizzy a word? Recently tried the Travis Toy eminence 12's and they sound as good as the peaveys .... I was really surprised because of the weight... |
|
|
|
Ed Boyd
From:
Illinois, USA
|
|
|
|
John Goux
From:
California, USA
|
Posted 20 May 2016 5:52 pm
|
|
I just double checked and the speaker in the Milkman mini is the Jupiter ceramic.
Kevin, I'd like to hear those Peavy speakers. Is that what you were using on stage in Phoenix?
Yesterday I was able to play steel and listen to two 15" speakers in identical cabinets. A Telonics and a "peavy" JBL. Not sure which JBL model that would be in the Stereo Steel rig. It has a silver dust cover.
They both sounded good. In comparison, the JBL was more traditional sounding, meaning more midrange and smoother. The Telonics was not that different, but it had a high fidelity top end to it. More frequencies up high, like 10k ish. I'm sure there is a frequency curve published for that speaker for those interested. Other than that, the speakers were similar in sound and volume.
It would be interesting to hear from steel players who use Celestion V-30s.
Travis Troy has an excellent YT about his Double T speaker. Maybe it is my iPad speakers, but I hear a nasal frequency poking through on that video. A Royer ribbon mic is a very sweet forgiving mic, and he is using a Little Walter. It ought to be a sweeter tone than what I'm hearing on that Eminence video. Guess I'd have to hear it in person.
John |
|
|
|
chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
|
Posted 21 May 2016 12:56 pm
|
|
| when my bandit's scorpion fried i put a good 1201 bw in and it get's better and better the more i use it. very strong speaker. i think i got it for around $50. |
|
|
|
Michael Brebes
From:
Northridge CA
|
Posted 23 May 2016 1:26 pm
|
|
I use both EVM-12L's and Celestion V30's. I do like the 12L's a little better, but when I don't want to carry the extra weight around I always go for the V30's.
_________________
Michael Brebes
Instrument/amp/ pickup repair
MSA D10 Classic/Rickenbacher B6/
Dickerson MOTS/Dobro D32 Hawaiian/
Goldtone Paul Beard Reso
Mesa Boogie Studio Pre/Hafler 3000
RP1/MPX100 |
|
|
|
chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
|
Posted 23 May 2016 4:49 pm
|
|
| can you get all these speakers mentioned for 50 bucks? |
|
|
|
John Goux
From:
California, USA
|
Posted 23 May 2016 6:24 pm
|
|
| Michael, do you have the V-30s open back or closed? What kind of cabs do they like? |
|
|
|
