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Topic: S-12 EXE9 Copedent |
Carl Mesrobian
From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 5 May 2016 4:56 pm |
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Hi, All. Just sharing my thoughts. The idea is to have an EX E9th and with minimal pulls be able to have open D tuning as on 6 string guitar. Any comments are truly welcome before I put this on the bench 
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--carl
"The better it gets, the fewer of us know it." Ray Brown |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 5 May 2016 6:53 pm
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I would add a zero pedal that drops the G# strings to G natural, and an additional pull on the E-F knee lever that drops the low E string to C#, to give you a bass note for the C# chord you get with the A and F position.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Mike Wilkerson
From:
Luther Oklahoma
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Posted 5 May 2016 7:45 pm
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Mike I enjoy reading your input and you are a wealth of knowledge thanks for all you do..... S;im
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S12 MSA Classic Nashville 400 with fox mods amp 1 volume pedal 1 Lil Izzy and 3 cords |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 6 May 2016 3:29 am
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I second the E-C# on the F lever, but if you play country, I'd put the 1st and 2nd string raise on a zero pedal.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Rick Nicklas
From:
Verona, Mo. (deceased)
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Posted 6 May 2016 3:47 am
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| Carl, I think you have your lower raise on P-1 on the wrong string. You have it ++C# on your D string and it should be on your B String pull. |
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Chris Brooks
From:
Providence, Rhode Island
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Posted 6 May 2016 5:55 am
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I'm with Mike and Lane: a "0" pedal to the left of the A pedal means they can be used at the same time--like AB. This results in a minor 6th chord (sub for a 4 chord, but bluesy), and the opportunity to do contrary motion upon releasing 0 + A: cool!
I have 1st and 2nd string raises on a knee lever.
Also, with Mike and Lane, I love the low E to C# drop attached to the E to F lever. Scares guitar players, too!
Question: Why not put the low G# to A change with the pedal B, which is changing the other 2 G#s? Seems like extra effort to have a separate pedal that does this. Putting all 3 G# to A changes on one pedal frees up that pedal, too!
Like Mike, I am a big fan of Extended E 9. I love the low D (which a universal omits) because I like playing out of the position where the low D becomes the tonic, i.e. in G, but playing in the 5th fret.
Chris |
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Carl Mesrobian
From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 6:53 am
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| Rick Nicklas wrote: |
| Carl, I think you have your lower raise on P-1 on the wrong string. You have it ++C# on your D string and it should be on your B String pull. |
_________________
--carl
"The better it gets, the fewer of us know it." Ray Brown |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 6 May 2016 8:30 am
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| Chris Brooks wrote: |
I am a big fan of Extended E 9. I love the low D (which a universal omits) because I like playing out of the position where the low D becomes the tonic...
Chris |
The question facing all 12 string players is whether to keep the D string, or sacrifice it and use a Low B string.
Shakespeare asked the question when he wrote Hamlet. "To B or not to B." 
I also use the D as a root, but I get it by lowering the 8th string. This means that all the notes in the the D triad I get by lowering the 8th and using the B pedal are on adjacent strings.
I have a question for you guys who raise the 1st string a whole step. Can't you get a lot of the same unison licks by moving the bar up 2 frets and using the 1st and 4ths strings and the C pedal? How much am I missing by doing it this way instead of having another knee lever?
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 6 May 2016 9:07 am
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Perhaps YOU can. I can't, since the licks want to leave the root ringing as you pull the 2 up to the 3.
Like the intro to "He Didn't Have to Be."
Perhaps there's another way to get it, but that's the way I hear it.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Brint Hannay
From:
Maryland, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 9:18 am
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| If you lower the 2nd string 1/2 step (or tune it to D, as I do, or raise it 1/2 step if you tune it to C#, as Mike does) you have the root there (and the fifth with the B pedal). |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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Carl Mesrobian
From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 9:48 am
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Greg. Thank you 
I am in the middle of re evaluating the setup on this beast - stay tuned, folks.
_________________
--carl
"The better it gets, the fewer of us know it." Ray Brown |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 6 May 2016 10:12 am
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I suppose I'll have to sit down at a guitar with that change and try it out.
My guitars already have 5 knee levers (and the wrist lever.) If I decide I want the change, I'll have to get a second LKL.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 6 May 2016 11:41 am
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A fingerpull will get you pretty darn close: you have to pull 1 so far that 2 raises to roughly E just going along for the ride.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 11:58 am
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Thanks for the low E to C# drop idea!
I am looking at a 12 string ext E9 keyless, burnt orange color of course. My first pedal may lower the high G# to G and raise the middle G# to A to get the 7th note on top while maintaining the root on the 6th string and rocking the B to C# pedal ala Mooney. Also allows the oft used picking strings 3,4,5 while rocking the 3rd string from G to G# ala Norm Hamlet on some Haggard tunes. These changes stand out well on a track or on the bandstand as they are on the higher strings. Other ways to get these effects at other frets just don't have the same sound or pop to them. I use these changes a lot and find that I don't use the Franklin pedal much except in split mode to lower the 10th string from B to A as a drone.
So far I am up to 4 floor pedals and 6 knee levers with staggered knees on RKL.
I had a guitar player sit down on my steel years ago and he effortlessly bent the top string up a fret. Sounded as good as me using a knee lever. I am just too chicken to bend a string that far manually. |
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Carl Mesrobian
From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 12:50 pm
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| Lane Gray wrote: |
| A fingerpull will get you pretty darn close: you have to pull 1 so far that 2 raises to roughly E just going along for the ride. |
Yeah- remember bar slants and fingerpulls? Underestimated techniques.
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--carl
"The better it gets, the fewer of us know it." Ray Brown |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 1:10 pm
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Lowering the 4th string to D is a pretty long pull. Good luck with that.
I used to lower the 12th string E to D on my "C" pedal. I used that a lot for power chords and tictac with B+C. I raised all 3 G#s on my B pedal. Also had low E to C# on the F lever.
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-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 6 May 2016 1:34 pm
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| Greg Cutshaw wrote: |
...6 knee levers with staggered knees on RKL.
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I tried that. Every time I used the outer lever I lost control of the volume pedal.
I think it's better to have the staggered levers on the left knee.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 1:57 pm
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I've had staggered knees on both sides. If they are mounted on the left, their placement is less critical IMHO. When I have them on the right, the one closest to the back of the guitar catches my whole knee. The one towards the center of the guitar hits just at the edge of the kneecap so a slight movement will allow you to either activate it or not.
I plan to use all the knees listed below on the new guitar if I get it but leaving the LKV as experimental.
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Carl Mesrobian
From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 8 May 2016 9:39 am
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Don't ask why - most of them are snugged up tight
_________________
--carl
"The better it gets, the fewer of us know it." Ray Brown |
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