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Topic: For that moment on the gig when you lose your place |
Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Scott Duckworth
From:
Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies
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Posted 17 Jan 2016 11:52 am |
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Man, I need the three pack!
I find myself playing in the hereafter. I wonder what goes here after this note... 
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it
I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus! |
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Don R Brown
From:
Rochester, New York, USA
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Posted 17 Jan 2016 9:28 pm
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We have another thread on one of these pages about lights for those real dark stages. Maybe someone can make a projection slide of the circle, and put it in one of those lights. That way you're always beaming it right in front of you!  |
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robert kramer
From:
Nashville TN
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Posted 18 Jan 2016 6:33 am
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| I special ordered the 12 pack. |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 18 Jan 2016 8:57 am
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| That just reminds me of the many lap-steels I've seen over the years with masking tape and labels stuck all over the fretboard, so the player knew where to put the bar. |
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 18 Jan 2016 6:46 pm
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well it's cute! the circle of fifths has been in so many books i've looked at that it still makes no usable sense to me after over 40 years. i tried to understand how this should help me but it doesn't.
i must have a cog missing in my mental machinery. |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 18 Jan 2016 8:43 pm
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 yes, i was afraid of that.
has anyone posted a youtube showing (slowly)
how this lays out on the fretboard and within the context of songs?
i think i need to see something like that.
if i don't die this year maybe i'll consider learning
something.
it's either something i sort of understand without realizing it, or it maybe a big door opener for me. |
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Skip Edwards
From:
LA,CA
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Posted 18 Jan 2016 11:16 pm
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I'm with Chris on this. The circle of fifths doesn't seem to be relevant to anything you'd ever come across on the bandstand...unless you spend your breaks chatting with a theory-head.
At any rate, I'd rather go the other direction, and make it a circle of fourths...
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 1:45 am
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I'm gonna wait for the movie...
anyway, the circle of 5ths , at first may seem a bit over the top theoretically, but it's all in the way it is presented upon your first exposure.
Think of the circle as someone showing you a road map for the first time. Once you understand how to use a road map you know it for your entire life. It's all in the way it is explained at the beginning.
Either or both , understanding 5ths or 4ths is extremely relevant and for those among us who are playing gigs regularly , playing songs cold and asking at the last second, "WHAT KEY are we in"? You already know it. You just don't realize you know it ! Now add that you are asked to kick it off at the 5 chord and you do...without any hesitation.
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders , Eastman Mandolin ,
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
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Charlie McDonald
From:
out of the blue
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 3:21 am
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This topic just keeps going 'round and 'round.
You can tune a piano with it.
Eventually it resolves. |
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Scott Duckworth
From:
Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 4:21 am
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Hmmm... I know how to use it, but can't remember how I learned it... just one of those natural things for me.
Now, it took me forever to understand (not use) the Nashville Number system. But now it's natural too.
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it
I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus! |
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Scott Duckworth
From:
Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 4:58 am
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Well, ya'll got my puzzler puzzlin'... so here goes.
Here is a circle of fifths:
If you are looking for major chords of a key, find the I chord (for instance C). The if you move one place to the left, you see F, which is the IV chord, and one place to the right is the V chord (G).
In the outermost inner circle, you find how to "spell" the major triad chord. In the innermost circle, you see the VIm chord, which would be the common one in the scale.
You can also look up a key by the number of flats or sharps.
Maybe my rudimentary explanation will help... since I've learned the Nashville Number system, I tend to use it, as I know the keys according to flats and sharps...
For the flats:
1b F = Fanny
2b Bb = Baker
3b Eb = Eats
4b Ab = Apple
5b Db = Dumplins
6b Gb = Greedily
For the sharps:
1# G = God
2# D = Deluged
3# A = All
4# E = Earth
5# B = By
6# F# = Flood
Most gospel pianists have some magical way they transpose anything greater than 4 flats or 2 sharps (my mom did it automatically) and I NEVER understood how they did it. But, I just know that they aren't in the listed key, so I find it and go with it.
Now my puzzler hurts, and I haven't even had breakfast yet...
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it
I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!
Last edited by Scott Duckworth on 19 Jan 2016 12:46 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Don R Brown
From:
Rochester, New York, USA
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 5:43 am
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Back in my younger days I got into a circle of fifths a few times, but I felt so terrible when I woke up the next day I stopped doing that!  And my head feels the same way after studying that chart for a while!  |
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Scott Duckworth
From:
Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 6:12 am
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_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it
I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus! |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 9:57 am
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Here's how you use it in the key of C:
On one side you have F (the 4 chord).
On the other side you have G (the 5 chord).
In the inner circle you have the minors related to those chords.
So, at a glance, you see the six most common chords in the key of C grouped together. This is something that you probably already know in the key of C, but might be hard pressed to come up with in the key of Eb (for example). Look at Eb. The same relationships are there, grouped the same way (1 chord, 4 chord, 5 chord, minors).
It's a pretty handy chart to have.
Also, on E9th steel, someone says "play Gm". On the chart you see that Gm is related to Bb. Go to your Bb fret (6th fret) and press your "A" pedal. That's your relative minor. Or go to your pedals down Bb fret (13th fret) and press your "B+C" pedals.
Eventually you learn which minors are related to which majors, but the circle of fifths chart really helps in a pinch.
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
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J Fletcher
From:
London,Ont,Canada
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 12:14 pm
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Well I notice that Scott's circle has F minor as the relative minor in Eb and Bob's has C minor.
Just to aid in the confusion! |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Scott Duckworth
From:
Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 12:47 pm
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Good catch J and b0b. I downloaded that one from the Internet (where everything is ALWAYS right)... but I was able to fix it. It's fixed above...
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it
I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus! |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 1:42 pm
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This is a good aid for learning chord relationship to each other. By the time one learns to decipher the center root key and related left then right segments they will probably already have learned that connection. Notice also that the relative min. [6] is located in the root chord and the related 2 and 3 minors follow the left, right thingy.
Learning the note intervals is of course the key to knowing how to build all chords.
All good to know and study, but not very easy to refer to in an "on stage" environment on the fly.
People who read and use sheet music are familiar with key sigs.
2 acquaintances of mine have ever used signing song keys in #'s and b's with the hands. Great way to communicate over loud stages. The phenomenon that voicing all the keys looks and sounds the same across a stage. Try it. G, D, C, E etc. Trouble is, nobody knows how to hand sign.
Hardly anybody else I know uses that. Most times people just think you're giving them the birdie, the peace sign, telling you to go to he!! or just waving at them when you try to sign a key. Sometimes that will get you a butt kickin' too.  |
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 19 Jan 2016 3:22 pm
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| over the years i've encountered players who used the 2 flats signals, etc.. after awhile you start to remember what some of them are, but generally i can find a key quickly anyhow. long as i'm not kicking it off. |
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Jim Park
From:
Carson City, Nv
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Posted 22 Jan 2016 10:04 am Circle of fifths
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| Here's how Mozart used the circle of fifths https://youtu.be/g0ZE38BQmvQ I never appreciated Classical Music till I watched Leonard Bernstein on Utube |
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 22 Jan 2016 10:57 am
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| aha! that explains it. you can play anything as long as you like the sound of it. |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 25 Jan 2016 7:17 am
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If you look at Bob's chart you can see why it is so easy for some people to be able to find those tricky minor chords so fast. If you already can hear a 1, 4 and 5 chord while figuring out a tune you a very short step away from knowing all the relative minor chords.
Like: Key of G
It sounds like a 4 chord but is not quite it and sounds like it might be minor you have the 2 minor which is A minor. So now you can play any A minor licks you know and most of the C major licks and they will work.
If you understand that chart even on the most basic level you will never be stumped by minor chords again and will also have a much easier time navigating new tunes without so much hunting and pecking.
The reason guys who record for a living can play tunes they have never heard before without screwing up is because they understand this stuff.
_________________
Bob |
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Scott Duckworth
From:
Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies
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