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Topic: 4th string split |
Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 2:57 am |
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I stumbled upon this last night, and many of you I'm sure will yawn and say yep, do it all the time...
I discovered by accident that the A/F triad on 5,4&3 can also be played using the C pedal and the E lower, which I guess makes it the C/E position! My 4th string split was not previously set up for anything and just happened to give me an in-tune E# first time!
Have I explained this properly and does anyone else use it much?
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Bill Ferguson
From:
Milton, FL USA
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 4:04 am
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I rarely use this as it does not sound in tune as much to me as the A/F.
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AUTHORIZED George L's, Goodrich, Telonics and Peavey Dealer: I have 2 steels and several amps. My current rig of choice is 1993 Emmons LeGrande w/ 108 pups (Jack Strayhorn built for me), Goodrich OMNI Volume Pedal, George L's cables, Goodrich Baby Bloomer and Peavey Nashville 112. Can't get much sweeter. |
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Jon Light (deceased)
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 4:26 am
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| On any of the 4 all-pull steels I've tried this on, for this to be in tune without the use of one of the two split-tuning hardware methods would be only by lucky coincidence--a lucky coincidence that did not occur on any of those guitars. You've gotten lucky. |
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Dale Rivard
From:
Ontario, Canada
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 8:49 am
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| Hi Ian, I use this but not in the context you describe. Try this: 5th fret so it would be over an E7th chord or moving from Bm to E7th. Start with B&C pedals, play strings 3&4 together, then 6th string, then 4&5 together, then 3&4 together, then as 3&4 sustain, keep B&C pedals down and lower your 4th string a half tone. Now as you keep both pedals and knee lever engaged, play the 6th string, then 4&5 together, then 3&4 together, then while 3&4 sustain, release the C pedal and knee lever at the same time. B pedal still down, play string 6, then strings 4&5 together, then 3&4 together, then while 3&4 sustain, lower your 4th string, keeping B pedal down. It's a nice chromatic move through the chord. I play this over medium to fast tempos so the slight tuning issue doesn't bug me too much. Merry Christmas, Dale |
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Georg Sørtun
From:
Mandal, Agder, Norway
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 10:02 am
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| You've been lucky to get the 4th string split in tune without putting in an actual split-adjustment (rod). I am not using that pedal/lever split much, but it may come handy at times. |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 10:26 am
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Dale, thank you - that's a useful chromatic move on the 4th string - similar to the A pedal and ½-step lower on the 5th.
To Bill, Jon & Georg - I don't have a tuning issue as I have a yoke-type changer with split tuning screws for each string:-
In the case of the 4th string, the raise to F# tunes with the top screw in the endplate, the "F lever" E# at the centre and the split E# we're talking about at the bottom. The lower to D# tunes with the small screw in the back of the changer frame.
Merry Christmas!
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 10:45 am
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darn it! i don't care what anyone else thinks, but to me anyone who keeps pushing the e sharp agenda is a little strange.
.. in a 40+ year career i never needed to say e sharp!! ...except as a joke!
edited to sound less scroogelike.
Last edited by chris ivey on 24 Dec 2015 3:36 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 11:11 am
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Chris, cut me some festive slack - I did call it the "F lever" 
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 11:22 am
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I have never used that combination. I get the same thing with the F lever, and can activate it quickly when needed. Splits take more time to activate for me.
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Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 55 years and still counting. |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 11:44 am
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In reality, I doubt if I shall use it much. But Dale's post* was instructive and it's nice to know that it's there and it works.
*in which case it's an F, by the way
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 11:49 am
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aside from that, ian, i find you very credible and intelligent. your homebuilt steel is very impressive!
merry christmas. |
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Dan Robinson
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 2:54 pm
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Interesting discussion. Might try this on my ShoBud Pro. R&B undercarriage should accommodate some way to tune the split.
Merry Christmas to all. Gotta hang my stocking so Santa has somewhere to put JayDee's new CD. |
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Jon Light (deceased)
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 3:01 pm
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I have no idea why I pictured the premise of your post to be that you just combined C pedal with E lower and voila, you had a good sounding split. Sorry.
The reason I am familiar with the usefulness of this move (and the futility of trying it without splitting hardware) is that yes, the chromatic motion has called out to me many times. The leading descending line of BC > AB+F > AB is impossible to achieve, seamlessly. |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 3:15 pm
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Well, I did say I'd stumbled on it when it would have been more accurate to say I'd discovered the use of something that was already set up, albeit by chance.
I was originally intending to use this split to get an E with both the E lower and the F lever engaged (to do with the fact that I have no pedal 6) but never got round to using it for that. So Jon, your initial impression is quite excusable
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Jon Light (deceased)
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 24 Dec 2015 4:31 pm
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| I've wanted to tap my changer for this split-- my Fess, to my disappointment, only has a few select strings tapped instead of all of them. But the last time I removed the piece to tap a different string I discovered that it is a big deal to remove and replace this piece. Very difficult to tighten it back in and the whole changer went way out of whack until I got it tight (and retuned all the changes) so I'm not in a rush to repeat this. |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 25 Dec 2015 5:58 am
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Add a third raise rod?
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Jon Light (deceased)
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 25 Dec 2015 6:39 am
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All raises are occupied on my triple/triple (Uni 12)--an E>F# lever is #3. I might make a Bradshaw-style extender. Or I might bite the bullet and remove the end piece again & tap it.
This thread has officially been hijacked. |
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