Take time to discover E13

Rick Barnhart · From: Arizona, USA

I had zero experience with the E13 eight string tuning when I asked for it on my new guitar. When arrived so equipped on the front (non-pedal) neck, I was completely confounded and confused. Mind you, I still am, but with a quick recording and lots of encouragement from Todd Clinesmith, I'm finally finding my way around it.

After a few days, I began asking if there was something else I could put there that would better suit me. Todd said, do me a favor and stick with the tuning for a while. He said it takes a while but soon things will fall into place. He was right, I'm finding jazzy/swingy feelin' pockets everywhere. It's like having C6 pedals 5, 6, &7 without having to use em.

Here it is high to low:

E
C#
B
G#
F#
D
B
G#
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Clinesmith consoles D-8/6 5 pedal, D-8 3 pedal & A25 Frypan, Pettingill Teardrop, & P8 Deluxe.

Ken Campbell · From: Ferndale, Montana

Rick,
What string guages are you using and what scale length?

Rick Barnhart · From: Arizona, USA

24.5" scale, but I'm not sure about the string gauges.
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Clinesmith consoles D-8/6 5 pedal, D-8 3 pedal & A25 Frypan, Pettingill Teardrop, & P8 Deluxe.

Sonny Jenkins · From: Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx

,,,,and the only root is the high E??? Seems like E13 would be much more suited for 10 string?

Rick Barnhart · From: Arizona, USA

Sonny, I'm told this is the tuning used by Vance Terry. Leon apparently used an E on the bottom and a G# on the 7th string.
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Clinesmith consoles D-8/6 5 pedal, D-8 3 pedal & A25 Frypan, Pettingill Teardrop, & P8 Deluxe.

Nate Hofer · From: Overland Park, Kansas

Rick
I'm with ya! I am also getting into the (Leon) E13! I'm more used to 6th tuning variants but there's a lot of great jazz/swing-oriented material and actually lots of shared ground with 6th tunings.

There's a couple of great E13 players here in Kansas City that I'm lucky to know: Bill Dye and Frankie K.

Sonny Jenkins · From: Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx

So do you see this tuning more suited to single string picking ???,,,,from just looking, seems it would be short on 2-3 note "chords/harmonies". Need to plug it in to my "guitar map" program and look closer,,,,,

Rick Barnhart · From: Arizona, USA

Sonny, it seems to me so far (E13 rookie) to be a little awkward to find single string melodies. Single strings work really well for me as pick up notes to the next chord in the progression.

I've found nice grips on 1 2 & 3 / and 2 3 & 4 open & at the 7th, &12th fret. Another nice ending tag is open strings 1 2 & 3, then strings 6 5 & 3 at the 5th fret, then chromatically up fret by fret on strings 1 2 & 3 from the 7th fret to the 12th.

I don't have an effective way to express my experimental grips in writing. This tuning felt very foreign to me, at first. Now that I've been able to live with it a while, I having a lot of fun with it. To fill in the gaps, I use a sort of strum thumb & finger pick style, for now. It's not my main tuning, but there's definately some tasty stuff in it. I'm keeping it.

That's what I'm missing, Nate. I'd love to sit down with someone who's well versed with this tuning. I'm okay with C6 with and without pedals...but no kiddin' this particular tuning is like having pedals without having to engage them...just change grips and move a few frets above or below.
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Clinesmith consoles D-8/6 5 pedal, D-8 3 pedal & A25 Frypan, Pettingill Teardrop, & P8 Deluxe.

Dennis Detweiler · From: Solon, Iowa, US

I've played pedal steel for many years. Recently bought a D-8 lap. I was sold on A6th tuning for the bottom neck right away. I did a lot of experimenting with the other neck. I liked the E13th for strum backup, but wasn't as comfortable with the movements (chords and note scales) available off of the open tuning as I was with the A6. I also didn't like the thin tone of my preferred high 3rd note (G#). So, I compromised and settled with these two tunings: (low to high)

A6: F# A C# E F# A C# B

D13: C D F# A B D F# E

I also like the 9th tone on top. Both tunings are the same open scale except for the 8th string, one being a 6th and the other a b7.
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1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8.

Mike Neer · From: NJ

It helps to do some reduction and look at the strings in groups. For instance:

Strings 1 - 4 are the structural equivalent of strings 2 - 5 in C6.

R 6th 5th 3rd

If you are at all familiar with the tetrachord approach I laid out on scales and modes, you can easily play any scales on those first 4 strings, the same way you would on strings 2 - 5 in C6.

It is a little more difficult to isolate triads in this tuning and look at it the way I do with my "Van Eps" harmonic mechanism approach, but you can isolate the minor triad (R b3 5) on strings 5 - 7 and use that as a reference point. For example, the C major scale in arpeggiated triads:

Rick Barnhart · From: Arizona, USA

Thank you, Mike. That's a lot to take in, in one sitting. I took a screen shot of your work, so I can disect it bit by bit. You're right, I'm finding a lot of common ground between the E13 & C6, especially in C6 pedal down positions. It's really a refreshing change of pace and every once in a while it brings a smile to my face when I can make somehing happen intentionally, twice in a row haha.

Trust me, if things are getting a little stale, give this one a try...it's a lot of fun. I'm glad I listened to Todd. I was very frustrated at first, and ready to re-string this neck in a more familiar way.
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Clinesmith consoles D-8/6 5 pedal, D-8 3 pedal & A25 Frypan, Pettingill Teardrop, & P8 Deluxe.

Todd Clinesmith · From: Lone Rock Free State Oregon

Glad to hear you are making progress with E13 Rick.

Most of the Western Swing greats played this tuning or a slight variation of it:
Noel Boggs, Leon , Vance,Bobby Koefer, Bobby Black,Herb Remington, Billy Bowman ect ect. Plus some of the players of today like Eddie Rivers, Jeremy Wakefield ,Lee Jefferiess ect .

It is great for chords, tho single string work is very achievable , just takes practice and time as anything else.

Note that in your one position you have partial 5 chord opportunities :

strings: 3 4 5 7
B G# F# B
1 6 5 1

Playing out of this position is very useful, and part of the bag.

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