who all has this Hughey change?

Terry Sneed · From: Arkansas,

somebody on another forum told me John Hughey
raised the 1st string a whole and the 2nd a half. how many have this change. I'm thinkin I'm gonna put it on my guitar. would they need to be on the same lever, or would they need to be split? thanks
could some of you that have it show some chords available with this change? I'd appreciate it very much.
Terry

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84 SKH Emmons Legrand D10
session 400'rd Steelin for my Lord.

ESnow · From: Berryville AR USA

Terry, I have this change on my guitar, both on the same lever. ESnow

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

Hi Terry.I'm thinking these are pretty common changes and for the most part like
ESnow mentioned they are on the same lever. Mine is on the RKL. I also have the 7th string whole tone raise on this same lever (RKL) as well which I am starting to use regularly along with phrases from the 9th string lower which is on RKR..I've started to play Tele' B Bender licks over here on the Steel..

It's a quagmire for sure !

The second string 1/2 step raise is a very powerfull little addition especially when you start to use it with the 2/2nd string lowers, 1/2 step and full step.

I never really thought of these as " John Hughey " related but certainly they can be. I think we've all heard more Paul Franklin with the first string whole tone raise and I could be mistaken but I think he was the one who took it from the traditional 1/2 step raise to the whole tone.

but non the less..John Hughey has some music on his steel that I am still scratchin' my head searching for..

t

[This message was edited by Tony Prior on 01 June 2004 at 03:45 AM.]

Larry Behm · From: Mt Angel, Or 97362

I raise the 1st on my 4th floor pedal and the 2nd a half tone and 7th a whole tone on my RKL.

Larry Behm

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

The standard change on LKR is raising the 1st string a half a tone and lowering the 6th string a whole tone. However, more and more players are 'opting to sacrifice the half tone raise and go for the whole tone raise on this knee lever. Still others are adding the 2nd string half tone raise with it.

I predict in the not too distant future, both of these newer changes will be standard on that knee lever.

Incidently, I had thought that PF was the one that came up with the whole tone change on the 1st string. In a recent thread Buddy said he used it on a recording 30 yrs ago. I don't recall hearing John Hughey use it. But it would not surprise me.

I will say this, regardless of who came up with it, I believe legacy will give it to Paul because of the unusually high number of recordings that he has used it on. It truly is a "must have" for many players today.

carl

Roy Thomson · From: Wolfville, Nova Scotia,Canada

I have the change on my LKR. Both strings at once 1st a whole, 2nd a half.
I associate this change with John Hughey's intro to the Vince Gill song "There's No Love Hear Anymore".
It has a very distinctive sound when used this way. Also has other uses of course, additional sounds etc.
Roy

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http://www.houstonsteelman.com/RoyT/

Terry Sneed · From: Arkansas,

Thanks guys. I didn't mean to sound like it was Hughey's idea, I should have said, someone on another forum told me Hughey used this change a lot. sorry.

C Dixon, I have the 6 lower and 1st string raise a half, on LKR. so all I need I reckon is raise that 1st a whole instead of a half, then add the 2nd string raise a half.
I don't have the 2nd string lowered a whole, just a half. will I need the 2nd lowered a whole also, to go with this change?
Terry

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84 SKH Emmons Legrand D10
session 400'rd Steelin for my Lord.

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

You can get the same notes by just raising your first string to G and moving the bar up a fret. The effect is a bit different - the bar movement makes it sound less mechanical than moving both strings on the lever.

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Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9),
Sierra Laptop 8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

Terry Sneed · From: Arkansas,

Bob, I see what you mean. I would get the same notes by raisin F# to G (which I already have) and move up one fret to raise the 2nd a half tone.
but, which would sound better? any opinions?
I kinda like the sound a pedal or lever gives, rather than just a slide up or down.

will somebody please post a few chord changes usin this whole and half tone raise together. I ain't got my chord chart yet, so I'm tryin to understand what this change does, and how to use it.thanks
Terry

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84 SKH Emmons Legrand D10
session 400'rd Steelin for my Lord.

[This message was edited by Terry Sneed on 01 June 2004 at 09:48 AM.]

Jonathan Cullifer · From: Gallatin, TN

I use the 2nd and 4th string, drop my E's and slide up one fret to get some of those sounds...I have toyed with the idea of getting the change put on my guitar as it would be very useful to have.

Jonathan

John Steele · From: Renfrew, Ontario, Canada

Buddy Emmons used the first string whole tone raise on the Darrell McCall recording of "Pins and Needles" in the 70's. I believe that was the first recorded example of it.
-John

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www.ottawajazz.com

barry wheeler · From: Sumerco, WV, USA

Yes Terry, I've had this change on my super pro on RKR for some time now. I use it all the time.I Love it. For me, a must have. I strongly recommend it. Try it. You'll like it.

Terry Sneed · From: Arkansas,

well, I reckon I'll have to wait till I get my Emmons chord chart.

I've got both changes on LKR with my 6 string lower, but I don't have enough travel to raise the first a whole tone. I guess I'll have to switch to a different hole in the bell crank. thanks

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84 SKH Emmons Legrand D10
session 400'rd Steelin for my Lord.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

This pedal just gives us different inversion of the I-IV change, doesn't it? I have it on my new MSA, but I'm at a loss to find any new chords it offers. Is it just a "lick pedal", like the "C" pedal?

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

Donny,

It can yes, however that is not the way some are using it. Especially for the 2nd string D# to E raise. I use this a lot going from a V7 to I chord resolve; sustaining strings 2, 3 and 5 starting with the 2nd string a D note then raising it to and E note with the lever as I bring in A and B pedals.

This creates an unusual and "crying country" sounding 7th chord to Tonic chord resolve.

The first string whole tone raise fills a need when you want to raise that first string a whole tone after picking it. OR, unison notes on string 1 and 3, then resolving in different ways such as letting off and bringing in the B pedal.

The same goes for string 7 with the E to Eb lever. IE, pick strings 4 and 7 with the knee lever engaged lowering the E's. Now let off the knee lever and bring in the whole tone raise on the 7th string. And back. This quick minor third to major 3rd sound can of course be gotten on strings 3 and 5, 5 frets lower but is it ever nice to have that change when you are at the IV chord fret.

I rarely ever use the I to IV change picking strings 1, 2 and 5 as you suggest.

carl

Terry Sneed · From: Arkansas,

"This creates an unusual and "crying country" sounding 7th chord to Tonic chord resolve. "

Now that's what I like! I think I'm gonna like this new change.

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84 SKH Emmons Legrand D10
session 400'rd Steelin for my Lord.

Reggie Duncan · From: Mississippi

I thought you would, Terry! That is why I suggested it!

Terry Sneed · From: Arkansas,

Thanks Reggie.

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84 SKH Emmons Legrand D10
session 400'rd Steelin for my Lord.

Ray Minich · From: Bradford, Pa. Frozen Tundra

Dave Horch · From: Frederick, Maryland, USA

I've been very interested in this change since forum member David Spires introduced me to it a few years back.

I currently have the 6 string lower/ 1st string raise on my RKL, as it should be on a "standard" Emmons setup (correct? or no?). Everyone so far has said they have the 6 string lower on LKR? WTF? I'm confuseled

Either way, does anyone see a drawback to adding this change to that (RKL) knee lever, as long as it's added to the 6th lower lever? I'm just used to lowering the B's on that knee. Best, -Dave

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Mullen D-10 - It's still one smooooth puppy!
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[This message was edited by Dave Horch on 02 June 2004 at 09:43 PM.]

[This message was edited by Dave Horch on 02 June 2004 at 09:47 PM.]

Reggie Duncan · From: Mississippi

Having the 6th string lower on the same lever as the 1&2 raise interfered with my style. So, I moved it to my LKV, which also lowers 2 one half tone.

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

Wow, I'd have a hard time with that, Reggie. The second string lower is used so much with the 6th string, with and without pedals.

I raise my 7th string along with the 2nd string lower, and even that gets in my way sometimes. I'm used to it, but it took me a long time. I don't recommend it.

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Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9),
Sierra Laptop 8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

Scotty Wenzel · From: Lawrence, KS

Dave,

Me too. My RKL is 1st string raise G#/2nd string raise E/ 6th string lower F#. This is making my head hurt..

sw

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GFI S-10 ULTRA, G&L and Fender guitars, Ocarina, Comb/w paper

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

An Emmons-like setup puts the lever on the right knee because the E lower lever (I call it "E") is on the left knee. You want it to be on a different knee from the "E" lever so that you can move the 6th and 8th strings together. This gives you the same effect that you have on the top two strings, only an octave lower.

There's a logic behind all of this. Trust me.

Disclaimer: I don't actually have this lever on my guitar. YMMV

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Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9),
Sierra Laptop 8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

Keith DeLong · From: Dartmouth NS Canada

My RKL(lefthanded steel)raises the 1st a full tone, the 2nd a half tone and the 7th a full tone. I don't have any half-stops unfortunately. Raising the 2nd string is an easy add-on,and whether Juhn Hughey started it or not, he used it quite a bit, listen to the break in "Don't Come Crying to Me" on Vince's albun "The Key", you'll hear it as well.

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