| Author |
Topic: Omitting the C-Pedal on U-12? |
Markus Mayerhofer
From:
Vienna, Austria
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 4:39 am |
|
I'm contemplating about swapping the E->F#-change of my C-Pedal to a 2nd LKL-Lever (or even the F->Lever with a halfstop) and achieve the B-C#-change with the A-Pedal in order to get a free raiser-slot on string 5 for a B->C-change, which is quite cool for the 6th-side of the universal-tuning...
After studying various C6-copedants, this seems to be a quite common change...
Is that a good idea?
What to do w/ the free Ped?
Does anybody have experiences or even better ideas?
My current setup:
Standard ABC
P4: G#, Eb, C on strings 12, 11, 9
P5: C#, F, F on str. 12, 11, 7
P6: D, F on str. 8, 4
P7: A#, C# on 6,5
LKL: E->F
LKV: F#->G# on 1, G#->G on 6
LKR: E->Eb, D#->C# on 2
RKL: B->Bb
RKL2: G#->A on 6, works cool w/ P6...
RKR: D#->D on 2, B->D on 9 |
|
|
 |
Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 5:02 am
|
|
For myself, I could never do E>F on a feeler stop. It is much too important a fundamental change to compromise with the lack of a positive stop.
I do have E>F# on a 2nd LKL but it is in addition to the C pedal. I tried to eliminate the C but found it too important to my style. For me, the lever move is no substitute for the quickness of touch and feel of the pedal. So the lever just enhances certain chordal/melodic movement abilities where jumping from AB to BC is too disruptive.
I happen to also raise the low B (string 9 on my 12 string) on this lever so that I have independence of these two strings---4th string E raise can be independent of the C pedal and 9th string B raise can be independent of the A pedal. |
|
|
|
Les Cargill
From:
Oklahoma City, Ok, USA
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 9:28 am
|
|
You don't say what guitar you have.
If it's, say, an MSA or other all-pull, you can add a "fingertip" barrel to the pull rod to reuse the pullrod for more than one pedal.
http://www.psgparts.com/Barrel-Adjuster-Tuning-100-101-005.htm
You'd have to tune it by reaching under the guitar. |
|
|
|
Dennis Detweiler
From:
Solon, Iowa, US
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 10:02 am
|
|
I have a double raise/double lower 1976 MSA U-12. I thought about eliminating the C pedal at one point, but still have it. I have to tune my A pedal (strings 5 & 9) from under the guitar. The rods are threaded on both ends and tune the 3rd raises using quarter size nylon wheels under the guitar. The rod is stabilized and kept from turning with my own created parts. I'd have to send a picture rather than explain it's structure if interested.
_________________
1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8. |
|
|
|
Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 12:04 pm
|
|
I went with a string-4 E-to-F# lever for several years.
I also changed the C pedal to raise B's-to-C's, like you also mentioned.
I liked both of those changes for alot of things.
Then I joined a band that did alot of classic country and needed to be able to do the fast C-Pedal schtick, so I switched back to the C pedal.
I miss my E-to-F# lever, and will probably put it back on. I still have it on other Steels I own.
I would try your ideas for a while. You can always change it back.
fwiw, Now sometimes I'll use my right foot on the C-pedal for string-4 E-F#-E when I already have A+B down.
Last edited by Pete Burak on 7 Oct 2014 7:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
|
|
Len Amaral
From:
Rehoboth,MA 02769
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 3:05 pm
|
|
| I recently eliminated my C pedal and raise string 4 E to F# on the vertical above pedals A&B. Lots of variations with and without pedals A&B. |
|
|
|
Markus Mayerhofer
From:
Vienna, Austria
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 4:56 pm
|
|
Sorry, i forgot to mention,
it's an GFI Ultra U-12... |
|
|
|
Tom Gorr
From:
Three Hills, Alberta
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 6:40 pm
|
|
| Pete Burak wrote: |
| Now I use my left foot on the C-pedal for string-4 E-F#-E when I already have A+B down. |
The other left foot?
(or am I not understanding this right?). |
|
|
|
Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
|
Posted 7 Oct 2014 7:33 pm
|
|
Woops, I meant, right foot... volume pedal foot.
[I'll edit that]
For example, I'll slide from open G at fret 3 to AB down G at fret 10, then I'll reach over with my right foot and hit the C pedal to raise string 4 to pull it into an Em. |
|
|
|
Markus Mayerhofer
From:
Vienna, Austria
|
Posted 8 Oct 2014 12:24 am
|
|
Dennis,
could you send me an photo of the undercarriage of your guitar? Thanks a lot!
The multiuse of an already used rod could be a solution, it's all about getting a fourth B-string raise (in that case B->C) on a Guitar w/ a triple raiser... |
|
|
|
Markus Mayerhofer
From:
Vienna, Austria
|
Posted 8 Oct 2014 12:30 am
|
|
Les, that looks like an good idea, but i don't get the point how it works...
Is it a kind of half-stop or do you need an extra rod and where this rod is connected? |
|
|
|
Markus Mayerhofer
From:
Vienna, Austria
|
Posted 8 Oct 2014 12:39 am
|
|
Pete and Len,
thanks for your encouragement in trying that change!
As stated above, if there is another option in getting an fourth B-String-Raise on string 5 and possibly 9, i won't omit the C-Pedal.
If it will work on the GFI i will try to adapt my Sierra too. |
|
|
|
Les Cargill
From:
Oklahoma City, Ok, USA
|
Posted 8 Oct 2014 4:23 am
|
|
| Markus Mayerhofer wrote: |
Les, that looks like an good idea, but i don't get the point how it works...
Is it a kind of half-stop or do you need an extra rod and where this rod is connected? |
First, I typed "fingertip" when I meant "rack and barrel". Dernit.
It might not even be that good of an idea.
You have two pulls on one pullrod. That means two pedals/levers, two cross-shafts and two bellcranks.
But it means one pullrod and one changer hole.
One pull is connected the usual all-pull way.
For the second, you have a barrel tuner on the pull rod where the second bellcrank lives. The barrel tuner has one end attached to the rod with a setscrew and the length of the barrel is adjustable - making it a tuner.
The first pedal engages the changer in the classic all-pull way.
The second one engages through the barrel.
That is the theory - there are a lot of details. |
|
|
|
Dennis Detweiler
From:
Solon, Iowa, US
|
Posted 8 Oct 2014 5:36 am
|
|
It's a clevis pin mounted through the pull rod with a set screw holding it in place. And, a roll pin pressed into the clevis. This keeps the rod from turning. The tuning adjustment is very accurate. The nylon threaded tuner can be made from whatever feels easiest to locate when reaching under the guitar. You have to tune from the endplate tuner first. Then tune the second raise from under the guitar. In this case, I tune the second raise from this rod both B's to C#'s
_________________
1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Revelation preamp, Carbon Copy Delay and Hall Of Fame Reverb, Crown XLS 1002, 2- 15" Eminence Wheelhouse speakers, ShoBud Pedal, Effects Pedals. 1949 Epiphone D-8. |
|
|
|
Markus Mayerhofer
From:
Vienna, Austria
|
Posted 8 Oct 2014 3:01 pm
|
|
| Thanks a lot Dennis, i think i get the point! |
|
|
|
Markus Mayerhofer
From:
Vienna, Austria
|
Posted 8 Oct 2014 3:02 pm
|
|
| Les, do you think that part will fit on a GFI too? |
|
|
|
Les Cargill
From:
Oklahoma City, Ok, USA
|
Posted 8 Oct 2014 3:46 pm
|
|
| Markus Mayerhofer wrote: |
| Les, do you think that part will fit on a GFI too? |
I have no way of knowing. I am pretty sure a barrel would.
I'm no expert here, Markus - I was just needing to add a third raise on a 2-raise 2-lower changer guitar and using barrels was one possible strategy. |
|
|
|
