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Topic: Steel and guitar twining |
Larry Lenhart
From:
Ponca City, Oklahoma
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Posted 18 Jul 2014 12:50 pm |
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When playing twin parts (harmony) does the guitar normally take the lead and the steel plays the harmony, or vice versa, or does it matter ? I am sure this topic has been discussed before but i couldnt find a thread for it. Any general advice, techniques, theory, etc. would be appreciated. I usually do this between guitars, and typically i play the harmony, on guitar with guitar player, but would like to expand it and do it on steel also.Thanks in advance.
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Zum Encore, Remington D8 non pedal, Hallmark Mosrite clone, Gretsch 6120 DSW, Gretsch G5210T-P90 Electromatic Jet Two 90,1976 Ibanez L5, Eastman archtop, Taylor Dreadnaught, Telonics pedal, Squire Tele, Squire Strat, Fender Tonemaster, Gold Tone 5 string banjo, Little Wonder tenor banjo, 3 Roland cubes 30s and 80, Carvin combo bass amp |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 18 Jul 2014 1:25 pm
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The twin parts I've played a part in the development, it has gone from a guitar part that I figured out a harmony to, or the guitar picker finding a harmony to my part.
I don't think I've ever started from a "let's create a twin ride," but gone from "that's a cool ride" to "I think I'll join it."
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 18 Jul 2014 6:49 pm
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cash on the barrelhead...emmylou
steel on top, tele down below |
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Ray Montee
From:
Portland, Oregon (deceased)
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Posted 18 Jul 2014 8:32 pm I have to disagree.............
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JERRY BYRD performed as many two guitar arrangements of anyone I know.
Quite often he took the lead however, it was not at all uncommon for Jerry to switch to the harmony line for a measure or two; then back to the lead line. It really does a head job on you when you hear it, if you listen very closely to it.[/i] |
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Clyde Mattocks
From:
Kinston, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 18 Jul 2014 10:02 pm
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I have done a lot of it over the years. I generally prefer the steel carrying the melody because it has the better sustain, thus there is a stronger sense of the melody conveyed to the listener. But it's not a hard and fast rule. Many of the great teams switched it around. Sometimes, if the tune is quite intricate, the steel and guitar may have to change up simply because a part lays better on one instrument or the other. For example, the steel can usually get higher and lower notes than the guitar, depending on the tuning.
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LeGrande II, Nash. 112, Fender Twin Tone Master, Session 400, Harlow Dobro, R.Q.Jones Dobro |
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Bo Legg
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Posted 18 Jul 2014 10:35 pm
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| If you play long enough with a guitar player you get a feel for his phrasing and most anything you play will sound like harmony if you phrase it with him. Notice I said “like harmony†not “like good harmony“! |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 21 Jul 2014 1:29 pm
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Since most everybody starts with (and learns) the melody first, I think the more experienced player should do the harmony work. Playing good harmony requires thought and experience because you're often changing intervals, whereas playing straight melody is a rote skill, as it usually doesn't change very much.  |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 22 Jul 2014 4:24 am
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Donny, what if the more experienced player was the one who had the melody first? In that case, the piece needs reworking. Perhaps then the other lead player can sit down and the two work it up.
I kinda think that if the line is normally a guitar line, the steel takes the harmony, and if it's usually a steel line, the guitar gets the harmony.
Remington Ride would hit the ear strange if the steel played harmony, and that "short'nin' bread" rhythm figure from Rednickin' Love Making' Night would sound odd if the steel had lead. Likewise the iconic Tele rides from Folsom Prison or Workingmen Blues (both of those, the tenor part is ALMOST right under the bar)¹
If don't have an ear for harmony, don't improvise a part, but work them up in rehearsal.
¹ Actually Folsom Prison's harmony part is the "baritone" line; the part below the melody. The tenor line climbed up to a 9th and sounded too jazzy. So I played notes 3, 4 and 5.
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 22 Jul 2014 1:53 pm
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Lane, I thought it was obvious I was talking about stuff that wasn't of an iconic nature, i.e. new parts being worked up in songs that hadn't been twinned before. But if you're twinning what is normally a solo line, I don't think it makes much difference who does what, because it's going to sound different either way!  I feel the average listener is listening to sounds, not instruments. |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 22 Jul 2014 2:15 pm
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Right on, Donny. That makes sense.
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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