Rickenbacher B Panda, early 1940's pickup, 1 1/4" or 1 1/2"

Philip Brodermann · From: United Kingdom

Hi, I am a new member here. I am considering the purchase of the above instrument. I questioned the seller about the size of the pickup. He stated that the coil is 1 1/4" wide and the 'cover' (as he puts it) is 1 7/16" wide. He believes it to be the 'smaller' pickup. According to my research, this makes no sense and it is indeed the earlier 1 1/2" version.
Please see pictures of the guitar in question - can anyone here clarify this for me?
Thanks, Phil.

Mike Neer · From: NJ

This is a wartime Rickenbacher B6. Most of the wartimes that I've seen and owned had 1 1/2" magnets, as this one does. The white celluoid plates replaced the aluminum ones during the wartime production.

Copied from an earlier post:

GENERAL INFORMATION:
B-models where introduced in 1933/4. They where the company's second steel guitar model after the legendary "A"-model (aka. the "Fry-pan"). A Standard guitar version was also issued but with much less success.
As on the "Fry-pan" they all featured an electromagnetic "Horse-shoe-magnet"-pick-up, invented not by Mr. A. Rickenbacher, but his partner, Mr. Beauchamp. The company was issued a patent on the pick-up in 1937.
The body was entirely made of the world's first plastic; Urea-Formaldehyde (aka. "Bakelite"), black in color (much like the old telephones), a concept for which the company immediately filed and received a patent.
The neck was bolted onto the body. This was the first electric solid body instrument with this feature ever (a feature they seem to have forgotten to file a patent for... Oooops).

"PRE-WAR" MODELS (The first generation):
All pre-1940 (aka. pre-war) models have all of the following characteristics:

1-1/2" wide pick-up plates/No frame around the pick-up (until 1944/45).

Bridge integrated in the body molding (until 1944/45)

Five cover plates are chrome plated brass (non-magnetic), not white nor celluloid.

No cover over key head.

Frets are not out lined by recessed white lines.

1 or 2 controls: If two, they're located on opposite plates, not both on the treble side plate. If one (volume), chances are the knob will be of an octagonal shape (first two years). Starting 1940 (second genreation, see below) both controls on the treble side.

String through the body attach (until 1944/45 and again in the 1950's)

Small horizontal "Rickenbacher Electro (RF) Los Angeles" logo on key head (Note the spelling: it's Rickenbacher).

1/4" plug on facing the player. (Starting 1940 it's on the other side, facing the audience).

Edges of the body (corpus) are not rounded but some have a slight 45 degree bevel finish (seems hand made).

Earliest models may have no mention of any US-patent of metallic parts. (PAT. NO. 1881229 on the bakelite body on all "B"-models).
Later and until August 10th 1937, the little tabs or "ears" on each side of the pick-up will bear a "PAT PEND.".
From 08/10/'37 on a patent number replaces the "PAT PEND." stamping.

"WAR TIME" MODELS (The second generation):
From 1940 to 1944/45, war time material shortages as well as economical considerations may have forced Rickenbacher to painting the 5 cover plates (however some have been sold with the plated finish):

White body plates. Most are enameled steel and others are of white celluloid:

Tone and Volume controls on treble side, stacked vertically.

The body style changed; the body's edges are now rounded (from the molding).

The neck is a little thicker and re-inforced (an invisible feature) and has white outlined frets (paint filled grooves on each side of each fret).

Most importantly probably, the formula of the bakelite was changed as the early one was so brittle that bodies would pop, chip and/or break during the manufacturing process.

The 1/4" jack now faces the audience.
These are still quite desirable guitars, as they still feature the much acclaimed 1-1/2" wide magnet plate pick-up (original design).

"POST-WAR" MODELS (The last generation):

Starting 1945 a smaller pick-up was introduced (1-1/4" wide).

Pick-up mounted with a metal frame (plated) surrounding all of the pick-up. This frame came into the way or the originally integrated bridge, so bridges are now a separate "screw-on" part.
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Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

The 1 1/2" pickup actually measures exactly 1 7/16".

The 1 1/4" pickup measures exactly 1 3/16"

I've got both right here and just measured them.

Jack Hanson · From: San Luis Valley, USA

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

Patrick Harison · From: Minneapolis, MN

I asked the exact same question on the forum a couple of weeks ago. the difference between the small and large horseahorse pick ups is very visually apparent as per the above photo....
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John Dahms · From: Perkasie, Pennsylvania, USA

As much as I am a vintage snob it must be admitted that either the 1 1/2" or the 1 1/4" pickup with the surround trim, they both can sound great and probably better than most any other pickup ever made so don't get too hung up on it. Any Ric is good.
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Cartwright Thompson · Posted 27 Jun 2014 2:21 pm

That's true, all Rics sound great but the 1 1/2" pickups on a Bakelite body sound a LOT better.

Philip Brodermann · From: United Kingdom

Hi, thanks for your replies and information. I am now a little closer to buying this. I have had an 'in hand description' whilst on the phone and established that there are no repairs, original pots, a slight forward bow of the neck similar to that of a regular guitar, the white panels are metal. It looks like it hasn't been played much and has the original case.
I still find it slightly over priced at $1400, what is your opinion?
Thanks again, Phil.

Mike Neer · From: NJ

$1400 is extremely high. I wouldn't pay more than $900-1000 max. But then again, these are much more common in the US than in the UK. It is in very good condition, at least cosmetically. I would want to hear it first.
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Jerome Hawkes · From: Fayetteville, North Carolina, USA

agree with all above - all the Ric horseshoes are great.
$1400 is the very top end though - is this from a retail / vintage dealer? they tend to be way over priced on lap steels. I recently passed on a post-war 7 string configuration (much rarer and desired) w/org case for $800 which was a good price really. i just prefer the string thru body models.

although i feel these B6 Rics are underpriced in general - value wise & vs other vintage instruments, the fact is that this is a $1000 steel tops. we may be kicking ourselves one day, but thats the market value today. They really aren't that rare (thankfully).

- of course, you are in the UK so all this could be a moot point...not to add that shipping these bakelites could be a crap shoot if not packed properly or mishandled. i would (&have) paid $100 more than market just because i could drive, inspect it and pick it up.
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'65 Sho-Bud D-10 Permanent • '54 Fender Dual-8 • Clinesmith T-8 • '38 Ric Bakelite • '92 Emmons D-10 Legrande II

Jerome Hawkes · From: Fayetteville, North Carolina, USA

Philip Brodermann · From: United Kingdom

Hi, thank you for your comments, I thought the price was a bit high, the seller is a vintage dealer in New York............they started at $2195 Laughing

Maybe I should keep an eye on the 'for sale' section here.
Once again - thanks for your advice!!
Phil.

Jon Light · From: Saugerties, NY

I'm looking at your guitar right now (online). Nothing wrong with the dealer. But NY steel guitar retail prices are seriously inflated.
Ric prices were steadily climbing in the early 2000's but they have pretty much stalled. That's more than you should pay for an American Ric (plus shipping) unless it is fairly exceptional. You'd have to do your own research on the UK market.

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