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Topic: Honest self-analysis of playing |
Mike Neer
From:
NJ
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Posted 20 May 2014 4:30 am |
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I think one of the things that has helped me the most in my playing is listening very honestly with the intention of being constructive. It seems so obvious, but one of the things that I have found, especially after playing more electric, is that it is easy to fall in love with the sound and to neglect really being in the moment with each note.
It is also very easy to beat yourself up once you hear what is really going on. There are so many things at play in the act of playing steel, and we start by breaking things down into little categories, such as right hand picking or blocking or slanting, etc. Unfortunately, it can all become unmusical. Being musical is the one element that we can't afford not to build. Work on things in a musical context. I do run picking exercises, but after doing them chromatically or randomly, I try to put them into musical situations.
I notice several things about my own playing that really need improvement. I will admit, I don't take the proper care to tune perfectly. For the first time, it is really starting to bug me, because even the slightest bit of being out of tune sounds like I am not connecting with my instrument. My "inner" ear hears the note before I play it, and the actual notes that are slightly off are disruptive to the process.
I try to make my notes speak articulately, but sometimes I find I use vibrato when I don't really want to. In these moments, I know I am not really "singing" it. I would like to be able to have that kind of connection where nothing is just automatic. I don't want the hands to guide the musical ideas, because it can get into the territory of lazy rhythms, which is not something that I want to do. That's why sliding the bar in very specific places is important to me.
Anyway, just clearing out some of my morning ideas. I was going to post some exercises that show how I have adapted some of George Van Eps' triad work into steel guitar playing, but being slightly out of tune ruined the clips for me. 
I know I still have a long, long way to go.
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Links to streaming music, websites, YouTube: Links |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 20 May 2014 5:06 am
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One step at a time is good walking. – Chinese Proverb
You don’t have to see the whole staircase, just take the first step.â€
-Martin Luther King, Jr.
One may walk over the highest mountain one step at a time.
– John Wanamaker
The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step.
– Lao Tzu
This one step – choosing a goal and sticking to it – changes everything.
– Scott Reed
Champions know there are no shortcuts to the top. They climb the mountain one step at a time. They have no use for helicopters!
– Judi Adler
Cutting and pasting proverbs on an internet bulletin board is a lot easier than mindfully practicing on your instrument.
- Andy Volk
_________________
Steel Guitar Books! Website: www.volkmediabooks.com |
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Mike Neer
From:
NJ
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Posted 20 May 2014 5:08 am
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I am Sisyphus.
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Links to streaming music, websites, YouTube: Links |
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C. E. Jackson
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Posted 20 May 2014 5:08 am
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Mike, a good topic for all players. Honest self-analysis is good for all of us. Also, constructive criticism from a close friend is excellent. Tuning by ear gets harder as we get older and our hearing begins to fail, but thanks for electronic tuners.
We should all continue to try and improve our techniques and playing each time we play. 
C. E.
_________________
My Vintage Steel Guitars
My YouTube Steel Guitar Playlists
My YouTube Steel Guitar Songs
A6 tuning for steels |
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Ken Campbell
From:
Ferndale, Montana
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Posted 20 May 2014 5:10 am
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| Mike Neer wrote: |
| I am Sisyphus. |
Insightful.
Much respect. |
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Jerome Hawkes
From:
Fayetteville, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 20 May 2014 6:27 am
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i keep a little notebook right next to me when i'm practicing steel - i write down little observations all the time. i dont have it in front of me now, but some notable ones are:
- pick with "authority" - really mean to HIT the note dead on. so many times when i am getting weak tone, its right there. i come from an acoustic background and this is where i developed that - i see it sorely missing in many playing electric instruments where they let the amp do the "work" - they are scared / unsure of the note they are going to hit next- the hands do this, the amp is just for amplification of the sounds in your head.
i was reading an interview with Dizzy once that summed it up - he said students always come to him asking what he is hearing in his head when he takes a solo. they assume its bop-be-bop-doo-da, etc - he said wrong....its BOP!-DE!-BOP!-DOO!-DA!...the notes are screaming out. have the note you are hearing in your inner ear BLASTING. this is a fun experiment. i often keep the note i'm hearing small and in the background (cause there is so much mental space being occupied by other things) - bringing it up to the front is a major revelation. thats why i think a lot of great players keep it really "simple" with their ideas when you break it down.
i'll post some others later when i get a chance - thats a big one though.
you must pre-hear the note clearly - it solves a bunch of other issues down the line.
there was a thread a few months ago on Buddy Emmons practicing without an amp and why did he do that...was it some "secret" method? and i immediately understood why he and other instrumentalist do that (i've seen trumpet players just finger the valves while they hear the lines in their head). the note is clearly established in their mind and they are just connecting the brain>hand, they dont really need the amp - its just amplifying what is in their head.
_________________
'65 Sho-Bud D-10 Permanent • '54 Fender Dual-8 • Clinesmith T-8 • '38 Ric Bakelite • '92 Emmons D-10 Legrande II
Last edited by Jerome Hawkes on 20 May 2014 11:17 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Bill Hatcher
From:
Atlanta Ga. USA
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Posted 20 May 2014 6:44 am
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more important to play than to worry about or evaluate your playing. when you play it....its done..its over..you have a clean slate.
then you play more.... you can always change, improve, try something else.
its like driving....if you really evaluate it..it will scare the H E double hockey sticks out of you and you will never want to do it again.... |
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Jerome Hawkes
From:
Fayetteville, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 20 May 2014 6:59 am
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| Bill Hatcher wrote: |
more important to play than to worry about or evaluate your playing. when you play it....its done..its over..you have a clean slate.
then you play more.... you can always change, improve, try something else.
its like driving....if you really evaluate it..it will scare the H E double hockey sticks out of you and you will never want to do it again.... |
thats very true - but i think mike is referring to dedicated practice critic / evaluation, which imo is different from performance. i mentioned this in another thread that i dont go back and listen to gigs our band records for this exact purpose - its done - if i felt good about the gig, i leave it there, if i felt bad, i leave it there, i dont go back and "check" if it really was that good or bad. i might go back and listen after 5-10 years, but never recent gigs because, for the musician, its always somewhat too critical and depressing - but thats in a live, uncontrollable environment where at that stage, you shouldnt be self-analyzing but just removing all that clutter and just play what comes thru you.
i once played in a semi-pro bluegrass band that was trying to break in to the big time circuit (they eventually did and had several #1 charted songs, not with me in the band) - but the band leader was militant about recording every gig and then ripping it apart at the next practice. gig we felt were smoking and everyone was pumped about were systematically critiqued til we didn't want to even play the song again... 
_________________
'65 Sho-Bud D-10 Permanent • '54 Fender Dual-8 • Clinesmith T-8 • '38 Ric Bakelite • '92 Emmons D-10 Legrande II |
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Peter Jacobs
From:
Northern Virginia
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Posted 20 May 2014 8:46 am
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Too true,Mike. I find I focus too much on the little (or in my case, huge) errors in accuracy or tone or rhythm or note choice and miss the big picture of "did I help the song?" While identifying things that I can do better is always helpful, I sometimes get mired in the mindset of "I'm never going to get the hand of this." More often, though, I try to stick to :well, that was close, next time I can do it better, and it went along with the rest of the song." Then I listen to some Lindley or Steinar or folks here on the Forum for inspiration.
For me, part of it is because I played acoustic instruments (mostly banjo) for so long, although I picked up lap steel before I got a reso. I'm still a bit afraid of the amp, and I have a lot to learn about how to use it properly, and sometimes that shows.
Thanks for speaking openly about topics like this -- it's good to know that even the really strong players are being introspective about their playing.
_________________
Peter
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www.splinterville.com
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@splinterville6278/videos |
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David Matzenik
From:
Cairns, on the Coral Sea
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Posted 20 May 2014 1:28 pm
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Everyone is going to hit a clam once in a while. One thing that I find very encouraging is that sometimes when I play a bad harmony I will pull it into tune immediately without any thought. I can't even say which note was out. And I don't have time usually. Early clam recognition may be a new field of study. And getting out of one, good players really know how to cover their tracks.
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Don't go in the water after lunch. You'll get a cramp and drown. - Mother.
Last edited by David Matzenik on 21 May 2014 6:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Joseph Napolitano
From:
New Jersey, USA
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Posted 20 May 2014 6:01 pm
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| Thanks for this great thread Mike. Really good input from Jerome too. Very helpful topic. |
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Jana Lockaby
From:
Kaufman, TX
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Posted 21 May 2014 6:12 am
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Thanks, this has been very encouraging, and just what I needed to read today. Recording myself, ugh, I can't listen to it for more than two or three times. By the third time I go from, "That wasn't so bad.", to "I just stink.",and "I'm never going to get this!" I push too hard, try to learn too much too fast. You've just reminded me to take some of my own advice.
In pllaying, as in life: The slower you go...the less it hurts. Trust me.
If you know me, that's funny. One step at a time takes too dang long. Thanks again, time to get back to work. |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 21 May 2014 9:56 am
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Be sure to check out this whole interview as well as the playing clips on YouTube but check this part out. Here's Wes Montgomery, in many people's book, the greatest jazz guitarist ever. Wes describes how he developed his amazing facility with octaves and how he screwed up in the beginning. An astounding clip to surface and totally applicable to steel or any instrument. The ultimate example of perfect practice = perfect playing?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Br4SFqOdSsc
_________________
Steel Guitar Books! Website: www.volkmediabooks.com |
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George Piburn
From:
The Land of Enchantment New Mexico
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Posted 21 May 2014 1:06 pm Has it happend to you ?
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Have you ever experienced ? ---
You play -- in your minds eye -- every thing awesomely, tons of great notes and every thing perfect, and you get Nothing from the Audience - No kudos - applause - nadda.
Then another time you hit every wrong note, miss all of your practiced dittys, basically screw up the entire thing, in your minds eye, and the Audience Adores you and every one comes up after and compliments.
As Mike is alluding to and going for -- is what every Super Musician I've known does -- It is all about the music -- The Challenge is about getting the music right regardless of one audience member or 10,000 the performance is just as good.
A personal guru Ernie Watts once told me, Even at this level the music is for Free - the money is all for logistics. Then I realized what it means to be an Artist. Jerry Bryd explained it on his video too. Head Hands Heart.
Hope this adds to the discussion. |
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Len Amaral
From:
Rehoboth,MA 02769
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Posted 21 May 2014 4:42 pm
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Mike:
I hear what you are saying but watching your video clips I see the emotions are intense. You play a wide variety of styles and play from the heart. I started playing pedal steel long before I picked up the lap steel 4 or 5 years ago and I find the lap or console steel much different and difficult to hit every note spot on. Your a young guy and those golden notes are within reach so keep picking away. |
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Mark Roeder
From:
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
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Posted 21 May 2014 4:51 pm
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I suspect you hear yourself recorded more than most of us, Mike. I bring this up because I just did some this week for my website and to my surprise, I didn't sound like I thought I did.
It reminded me what a great learning tool that recording is .....The big thing being learning how to listen to myself.
_________________
www.deluxe34.com lap steel stands, Clinesmith, Gibson Console Grande, Northwesterns, The Best Westerns
https://www.facebook.com/TheBestWesterns |
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Paul Honeycutt
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 21 May 2014 4:56 pm
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Good words, George!
I'm just happy to hit the right note most of the time. But I try to be aware of the quality of each note. The attack, the touch, the tone, all of that when I practice. And I also try to think of it as music. It's not the instrument, it's not the technique it's how all of those things serve the music.
I'm getting serious about lap steel after years of guitar and mandolin and some Dobro. Everytime I play it it's a learning experience. Have you ever looked down at your instrument and seen infinity? It's all infinate choices of notes and melodies and songs and... And I'm usually my harshest critic. |
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Ken Campbell
From:
Ferndale, Montana
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Posted 21 May 2014 7:26 pm
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| Holy crap! That Wes Montgomery interview is the stuff! Thanks for that Andy!!!, |
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Edward Meisse
From:
Santa Rosa, California, USA
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Posted 22 May 2014 3:31 pm
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I have just finished my very first recording project. I think I sound dreadful. But the client is delighted. And the engineer seem to think I'm overly self critical. Like Mike, part of my problem is with the intonation, especially on the heavier strings.
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Amor vincit omnia |
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David Mason
From:
Cambridge, MD, USA
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Posted 25 May 2014 5:17 pm
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| Quote: |
| ...the band leader was militant about recording every gig and then ripping it apart at the next practice. gig we felt were smoking and everyone was pumped about were systematically critiqued... |
| Quote: |
| ...every thing awesomely, tons of great notes and every thing perfect, and you get Nothing from the Audience - No kudos - applause - nada. Then another time you hit every wrong note, miss all of your practiced dittys, basically screw up the entire thing, in your minds eye, and the Audience Adores you and every one comes up after and compliments. |
There has been way too much real-life evidence to support these, that is, how well you think you played (or how much fun you had?) is a very poor predictor of how well you actually played. Funny stories, even, Mr. Happy himself, "Captain Trips" Jerry Garcia threw Phil Lesh down the stairs once, he was so pissed off at how the bass player had ruined the gig, and when they listened back, pure magic - the Good Fairy came to visit that night.
I think it's quite likely that you play best when there is some self-critical senses still engaged, beside just playing the right notes; timing & tuning & tone can all surely benefit from some attention. I've seen a few too many concerts and shows where some assortment of band members, usually the headliner, "got" themselves into the mood, glug glug glug. And they were happy, generally just groovin' away! And, but, there is that occasional sense of pure magic (what Robert Fripp refers to as the good fairy), but you really can't will it into existence, and you SURE can't will it by not paying attention to the music!
THREE AWFUL THINGS THAT HAPPENED IN MUSICIAN'S HEADS:
A)That Henry Czeszzing-hungarian nutcrackername wrote a book about "FLOW", and now everybody wants to be all flowy all the time.
B) A bunch of people wrote books about how "creativity" is a result of juxtaposing disparate elements, which is why there are now digeradoos on every other sensitive indie-folky stuff and friggin' RECORD TURNTABLE "MUSICIANS" going zzzt zzzt zzzt right in the middle of some potentially real music.
C) The word got out that in the mid-60's, Miles Davis was paying his band to NOT practice between gigs, because he didn't want them yanking out their newest transtotium peedletonic wee-wee, he wanted them to react to each other. Great! Stop practicing, just getcher self-flowy... the part left out is that the musicians he was "paying to not practice" were Wayne Shorter, Herbie Hancock, Tony Williams and Ron Carter. And you're not. |
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Ken Campbell
From:
Ferndale, Montana
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Posted 25 May 2014 6:34 pm
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| Excellent points. And it made me laugh. Thanks.... |
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Bill Creller
From:
Saginaw, Michigan, USA (deceased)
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Posted 25 May 2014 7:29 pm
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I found that just recording some stuff on a simple tape recorder can really bring the ear to the way the playing sounds to others, when I didn't really HEAR it while playing.
Like, " boy, that really sucked "!  |
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Jim Hoock
From:
Highlands Ranch, CO.
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Posted 1 Jun 2014 5:19 am
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[quote="Peter Jacobs"]Too true,Mike. I find I focus too much on the little (or in my case, huge) errors in accuracy or tone or rhythm or note choice and miss the big picture of "did I help the song?"
Great comment! That should be the ultimate measurement... |
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Bob Stone
From:
Gainesville, FL, USA
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Posted 10 Jun 2014 5:14 am
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| For me, recording is essential for hearing where I need to improve. |
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Bishop Ronnie P Hall
From:
Detroit, Michigan, USA
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Posted 20 Jun 2014 5:18 am
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Gentlemen, and (Ladies)
There is an old saying that comes to mind, as I read this discussion," Only the artist himself sees the flaw, in what we all see, as the masterpiece." I would think that perhaps this saying, would maybe apply to what is said here. If not, then I would surely practice more intensely, in the hope that somehow I would reach perfection or pass out trying. Just a thought! Be blessed!
Ron
_________________
Goldensacredstrings
goldensacredstrings@gmail.com
http://www.youtube.com/user/goldensacredstrings |
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