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Topic: A 10 string UNI....maybe? |
Len Amaral
From:
Rehoboth,MA 02769
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Posted 13 Apr 2014 1:23 pm |
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OK...I love the U-12 but no loner play out due to old manitis and heavy gear.
So, a minimalist suggestion for a U-10
Two pedals and 4 or 5 knee levers (depending)
Obviously, this will be more E9 than B6 and you get something and have a light weight steel that has the vibe that has what most people want to hear. (IMO)
This is what I propose for a 10 string Uni understanding you have to give up something and compromise
The first 8 strings operate as normal on the E9
String 9 goes from B to D and second string Ed to C# on LKL (same as my U-12
Another LKL` for string 2 Ed to E and first string F# to G#
Pedal 1 is standard raising 5 & 9 (B to C#)
Pedal 2 is standard except it raises all G#'s (3-6-10) to A
RKR lowers 4th & 8th string E's to Ed (RKL raises 4th & 8th string E's to F
Two Verticals: LKV raises string 4 & 8 E to F#
RkV LOWERS STRING 5 & 9 b to B to Bd
This eliminates pedals 3-4-5-6-7
What do you think? I know we can keep adding things but it adds to the weight and labor building it.
The purpose of this topic is to generate ideas with a fast setup and get a bit of the best of both of best worlds.
Lenny |
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Jim Priebe
From:
Queensland, Australia - R.I.P.
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Posted 13 Apr 2014 3:03 pm
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Len
You are not alone out there - join the clan.
I use the setup below and I came from playing a U12.
The pedal 4 is the 'normal' pedal 7 from a U12 setup.
This copedent gives all the familiar E9th capability and reduces the B6 to what I commonly used. The C6th type pedal aren't there as I just don't think/play in C6th mode once you have played U12 for a long time - I just use the tuning to get whatever I want or need. There are still 7th's and 9th's all over the place with this setup without those traditional C6th pedals. I use the LKR for minors a lot and add pedal A to that too.
That tempering probably won't suit all guitars but it works well on mine for me.
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_________________
Priebs GFI ('09)Short-Uni10. GFI ('96)Short-Uni SD11. ('86)JEM U12
www.steelguitardownunder.com |
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Len Amaral
From:
Rehoboth,MA 02769
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Posted 13 Apr 2014 4:37 pm
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Hi Jim:
Your 10-UNI is a bit more involved than my suggestion but makes a lot of sense.
I was going to eliminate the C pedal for a vertical that raises the E's to F#.
I do like the Newman pedal 7 and would consider that
change. |
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Jim Priebe
From:
Queensland, Australia - R.I.P.
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Posted 13 Apr 2014 9:31 pm
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Well I could almost do with out a C pedal but that BC combo works in a certain 4 string tonal area that you just can't duplicate with other positions.
As far as up levers go I find them the least compatible with the human appendage/legs while sitting at a pedal steel but that might just be me  so personally I would steer away from them.
I am actually in the middle of rodding a U12 from scratch and I have a newborn admiration for those who build and repair these things. I have come to the conclusion that I would rather play than tinker and anything simpler seems attractive right now hence my interest in this post.
_________________
Priebs GFI ('09)Short-Uni10. GFI ('96)Short-Uni SD11. ('86)JEM U12
www.steelguitardownunder.com |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 14 Apr 2014 12:59 am
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I wonder how many others were thinking about this when suddenly a post appears!
Part of me thinks there's enough knowledge out there about fake C6 on E9 that it's hardly worth it. But another part of me admits to having given it a bit of thought. This is Day setup but you could reverse it.
I've made the assumption of four pedals, with RKV as a back-up for only three. The novel feature is the elimination of the 8th string E rather than the 9th string D. Then releasing the D# lower gives you pedal 6, so you have a two-in one lever. (Worth noting maybe that the D was there first and Jimmy Day added the E.)
I've thought it through as best I can without an extra S10 to try it on, so please find fault.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Len Amaral
From:
Rehoboth,MA 02769
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Posted 14 Apr 2014 4:57 am
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I feel comfortable on the U-12 and have been playing one for many years. With that said, when I played out , I would sparingly use strings 11 & 12 playing out as you are competing with the bass player.
The more I think about it due to this thread, pedal 3 could raise string 9 (B to C)
Pedal 4 and 5 could be where pedals (5 & 6) were and pedal 6 could be where pedal 7 was?
The reason I like a vericle (E to F#) on strings 4 & 8 is it is more useful to me with pedals A & B up or down.
Also, I would want this setup on a single body, NO PAD as my Zum and Sierra U-12. |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Tom Campbell
From:
Houston, Texas, USA
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Posted 14 Apr 2014 12:28 pm
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Hi Lenny
I have also thought about a modified 10 string vs my 12 string steels. The only time I ever use the 11th and 12th strings was to lay down a bass pattern for other instruments.
I have my 3rd pedal raising the B strings to C. Pedals 2 and 3 down make a nice minor...if your vertical lever raises your F# to G, you get a minor 7th chord.
Like you I am migrating to non-pedal, but the lure of pedal steel is still strong. |
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Georg Sørtun
From:
Mandal, Agder, Norway
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Paul Redmond
From:
Illinois, USA
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Posted 14 Apr 2014 7:31 pm
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See the "Sigler pedal" thread.
PRR |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 15 Apr 2014 6:06 am
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Many years ago Paul sent me a letter in which he explained his 10 string "uni" copedent,,,,seemed VERY efficient,,,but I have forgotten exactly what it was. Maybe he could chime in here and share that bit of wisdom with us,,,,????
oooops,,,sorry,,,I didn't see Pauls post on the "Sigler Pedal" thread,,,, |
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John Billings
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 15 Apr 2014 10:43 am
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B up to D on LKR1
Gotta have a low E string. That's my "Cello" string in the string trio.
Wonder if I could also lower the B to A? I already lower it to Bb. Hmmmmm,,,,, |
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Rich Peterson
From:
Moorhead, MN
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Tom Gorr
From:
Three Hills, Alberta
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Posted 15 Apr 2014 12:36 pm
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I really couldn't live without the low G# in a more full universal tuning, and the low E is pretty important...the lowest B in the 12 string E9/B6 is a waste of space....I'm not sure I could live without at least an 11 string universal, and the only reason I can live without the low B...is I haven't really learned how to use the lower voicings of P5 & P8 in the Uni tuning.
I might be more inclined to drop string 2 and figure out another way to get a D...but then again, I use string 1 and 2 together as a partial chord...opinion..a 10 string universal just isn't enough....unless maybe an E6/E9 universal is considered.
It would be difficult to part with my F# string 7 per JET10 tuning because so much blues happens with that one, and of course, the minor chords with 7 as a root.
The late Al Marcus had proposed a "Lean and Mean" 10 string universal tuning. He played steel over 60 years as a professional steel player...that's a guy's ideas I wouldn't overlook for a second. |
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